Pick interpretation

[ColdShot]

I used to post here, but I forgot my old handle :-(. Anyway
here's a question:

Offensive player sets a blind pick behind the defender. Defensive player pivots on the left foot to start up court and collides (face to face) with the offensive "screener" before the right foot lands. Is it a foul? On whom? Does the pivot count as "a normal step"?

Thanks!

Bill

NCAA (http://www.ncaa.org/library/rules/2004/2004_basketball_rules.pdf):
"Section 20. By Screener
Art. 1. A player shall not cause contact by setting a screen outside the visual field of a stationary opponent that does not allow this opponent a normal step to move.

[BktBallRef]

A step is lifting the foot and putting it back down. Did he step or not?

[Jurassic Referee]

If a pivot counted as a normal step, you'd have to call traveling every time a player with the ball pivoted. A pivot by definition is made with some part of the pivot foot never coming off the floor.

From your description, it sounds like the screener didn't give the defensive player the necessary step. If so, it's an illegal screen.

[ColdShot]

Originally posted by BktBallRef
A step is lifting the foot and putting it back down. Did he step or not?

OK, if he turned up court on his left foot (still can't see the screener, but his foot leaves the floor), and then begins to move up court "stepping" with his right. I guess the question is what is a "normal" step. Intrinsic in this situation is that the player being screened from behind doesn't see the screener until he has turned. Does the act of turning count as the step? Or does he get a "normal" step out of the turn?

Here is the NBA version, which says the player screened is "given latitude". The NCAA rule isn't so clear:

NBA (http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_a.html?nav=ArticleList):
3. Screening
"If he screens behind a stationary opponent, the opponent must be able to take a normal step backward without contact. Because the opponent is not expected to see a screener behind him, the player screened is given latitude of movement. The defender must be given an opportunity to change direction and avoid contact with the screener.

[rainmaker]

I think the general principle is for the screener to give the screenee room to turn around without significant contact. It's actually to the screener's advantage to leave a little room. Less likely to get an elbow in the nose, or the gut, or.. you know, ... wherever.

[ChuckElias]

Originally posted by ColdShot
Does the act of turning count as the step? Or does he get a "normal" step out of the turn?

Maybe you posted this late at night and you weren't thinking clearly. Does turning count as stepping? Are you serious? Stepping counts as stepping. Pick up a foot and put that foot back down. That's a step. The screened player must be allowed to make that movement (pick up a foot and put it back down) before contacting the screener.

Why are you trying to make this so hard? It's a step. If he can take a step toward the screener before contact, the screen is legal. If contact occurs before the step toward the screener is completed, it's a foul on the screener.

[Nu1]

As I'm reading this post I've thought about some scrimmages I've had this year. (I can't remember last years games...although examples may be plentiful from them as well.)

It seems to me that I could probably call a lot more illegal screens than I have. Especially during some offensive sets where block players are moving across the lane...setting up right behind a defensive player (facing the back of the defensive player)...and then the ball is reversed or skipped for an entry pass into an offensive player coming off that low screen in the lane.

I think I call the "moving screen" much more than the "blind screen." Is this call - an illegal screen due to distance and position behind a defensive player - something that many of you call often?

[ColdShot]

> Maybe you posted this late at night and you weren't thinking clearly. Does turning count as stepping? Are you serious?

I apologize, I was not clear. The screenee is above the top and to the left of the key. His back is to the baseline. The ball still hasn't crossed half court. His man is in front of him, slightly to his left. Suddenly the ball is passed over his head and to his left towards the baseline. His man also cuts towards the baseline on his left. He tries follow the ball and his man as he begins to rotate his body to his left where his man and the ball are. I'll try to break the next part down in "slow motion":

The screenee pivots on his right foot, his left foot comes off the floor as he rotates to his left and then his left foot comes back to the floor (net movement down court is minimal, but he has rotated about 45 degrees. Again the screener is behind his original position so he doesn't see him yet). He begins to step towards the baseline after lifting his right foot to take a (normal?) step. The right foot never hits the ground. Faces crack together as he makes contact with the screener.

Try this in your office: stand facing one wall, with a small picture or other object directly (180 degrees) behind you. Slowly turn and take a step towards the picture. The act of making a 180 degree turn is a two part process. A rotational pivot with little down court *movement* and then a directional step. Depending on the amount of rotation, and your focus point, you may not see the picture until you've already started your directional step. You do not make a 180 degree turn in one step, indeed it's nearly impossible to turn 180 degrees in one "normal" movement.

Once again the NCAA wording:

"A player shall not cause contact by setting a screen outside the visual field of a stationary opponent that does not allow this opponent a *normal step to move*."

I'm not trying to be difficult, I'm just looking for clarity regarding your various interpretations. Yes, in the act of turning around your feet come off the floor and then come back down before you've turned enough to see what is behind you. Are those turning movements considered "normal steps"? Obviously it is different, but if the ball handler pivots on one foot it is not considered a "step".

Thanks again, and my apologies for the lousy description.

Originally posted by ChuckElias

Maybe you posted this late at night and you weren't thinking clearly. Does turning count as stepping? Are you serious? Stepping counts as stepping. Pick up a foot and put that foot back down. That's a step. The screened player must be allowed to make that movement (pick up a foot and put it back down) before contacting the screener.

Why are you trying to make this so hard? It's a step. If he can take a step toward the screener before contact, the screen is legal. If contact occurs before the step toward the screener is completed, it's a foul on the screener.

[ChuckElias]

Originally posted by ColdShot
The screenee pivots on his right foot, his left foot comes off the floor as he rotates to his left and then his left foot comes back to the floor

Legal screen. Again, don't make this harder than it has to be. He stepped. The step was completed before the contact. Legal screen.

[FrankHtown]

In response to Nu1...it seems every team has a version of a "box" that they run to inbound under their basket. Inevitably it seems to involve a back screen on a defender at the junction of the freethrow line and the lane line extended. The defender is guarding their opponent who is above the key. Here comes an offensive player, sets a screen right behind the defensive player, and the offensive player who was above the key, now has a free shot to the basket, because the defensive player was illegally screened. It takes two things...1) to recognize what's happening, and then, 2) call it.