NBA Dress Code

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by RookieDude
So you think I would feel sorry for a bunch of spoiled millionaires if they were told they had to wear their hair a certain way?
I don't think so.

Why do you have to feel sorry in order to disagree with a policy? My point is it screams of hypocrisy to say "Corporate America" is the concern when that same "Corporate America" does everything to appeal to people that look like the players with their marketing strategy. Of course they can do whatever they like, that does not mean all of us have to agree with it. I also understand why some feel this is a racial issue, because you do not see the NFL or NHL doing this. The policy that the NBA is using might not be racist, but the perception that "Hip Hop" culture is run by Black people is not only wrong but directed. I live in a lily white suburb and I see the same cloths on kids out here as I do when I go to the heart of the inner city. The difference might be that the white kids are wearing Abercrombie & Fitch, and the inner city kids might wear FUBU and Enyrce. Everyone wears Timberland Boots (or similar style and company) which are now outlawed by the NBA.

Peace

[Camron Rust]

Any employer has the right to define acceptable on-the-job behavior and dress. The teams, as franchises, must follow the requirements specified by the franchiser (the NBA). Thus the NBA can impose dress codes on teams...and players.

As has been suggested, it is somewhat about age. They trying to get these players to stop dressing like 14 year-olds.

[Camron Rust]

Originally posted by JRutledge

Why do you have to feel sorry in order to disagree with a policy? My point is it screams of hypocrisy to say "Corporate America" is the concern when that same "Corporate America" does everything to appeal to people that look like the players with their marketing strategy.

There is a LOT more of "Corporate America" that trys to appeal to people that are not trying to have this look. The numbers of people with this look are NOT a majority or anywhere close to it (perhaps so in the 12-25 age range) If the NBA wants to stay a viable business, they must maintain broad support across all ages. For whatever reason, they've lost a lot of support from the middle/older age demographics. It sounds like they believe the dress/fashion (and the behavior/attitude that seems to come with it) is a reason. The players can either do what it takes to increase the suppport and profits or relegate themselves to reduced contracts in the future when the fan base is made up of only teens and 20-somethings that don't have any money. If they loose the 35-50 year olds with enough money to buy $100-$200 seats, they'll not make it far.

[Edited by Camron Rust on Oct 19th, 2005 at 03:10 PM]

[truerookie]

Originally posted by JRutledge

I can make any comparison I want to. I do not know if you went to college, but it was rare that I would see a professor of mine in a dress or suit. Many times they wore jeans or sweat suits. I did not see suits very often and this was in the education profession. I know Doctors that do not wear suits and ties to work. I think it depends on how you look at this. I am an official and I do not have a dress code. Now their might be some expected dress, but people that do not wear suits in their regular life are not coming to games all dressed up. I wear nicer close to games because I feel it makes me more presentable, I would object to a dress code for everyone that officiates too.

I really do not know what you meant by "turning your back on their culture." You are going to have to explain that one.

I just think the NBA is being hypocritical. They allow hip hop and pop culture to invade their game all the time with the entertainment during games, All-Star Games and events and videos and tapes they promote. Are these artists wearing business casual? Are they even wearing suits when they perform on stage at an NBA event? Even the most clean cut artists are not wearing a suit or dress. If they have a problem with the culture, than play Frank Sinatra all day and see how many fans you turn off. Frank always wore a suit when performing. The Chairman of the Board should fit the image the NBA is looking for perfectly.

Look, when you insist on hiring 18 year olds and give them millions of dollars you are going to have a different attitude of people and how they dress. You have many players that are much older that do not dress that way at all. I think Grant Hill is a good example of that. Actually some of the best dressed people that I see are African-Americans. I know when I go to officiating functions, I get a lot of complements on the suits I wear. Sometimes I feel like I am overdressed because just about everyone in attendance is not dressed in a suit or anything like what I have on. I am also one of the youngest individuals in the room. So it is not all about age and culture. I just think the NBA or any league as a dynamic involved that it is silly to have dress code of this nature.

Peace

I really do not know what you meant by "turning your back on their culture." You are going to have to explain that one.

Culture was a wrong word to use in the situation. I should have went with Urban upbringing. They do not return and make a contribution to the communities in which they grow up in. They make give to the one they are currently living in. However, it is not the same. Some may take the mind set, I am not giving or going back to that environment under any circumstances. Now that I have made it!!

[BktBallRef]

It makes no difference whether the players, or the fans for that matter, like it or not. If you're a player, you'll either follow the rule or you won't play. It's that simple. It's a done deal.

[JRutledge]

Is the NBA going to tell their owners to have a dress code? Has anyone seen Mark Cuban wear a suit? I have seen Jay-Z in a suit, but not at an NBA game. What about Usher? Remember, the NBA is making this rule, not teams. I would have no problem if a team took this position. I have a problem with the NBA making a rule when most of what happens off court is not seen. I have attended an NBA game and I never saw any of the players. They should worry about what the players wear off court as they go into the locker room.

Peace

[SeanFitzRef]

Let's flip the question....

How would you feel if your employer told you you had to wear a certain uniform home from work? Not while at work, but when you're off the clock? And if you're seen in other forms of gear at any point until you got home, you would be fined?

I'm sure the NBA code isn't this extreme, but it could be. Once I'm 'off the clock', I should have the right to dress as I choose, since I'm representing myself, not company X. After I am done working for the day, I should have the right to throw on some jeans and a t-shirt, some shorts, a snow suit or whatever (no fishnets, please!!).

I understand where the NBA is trying to go with this policy, because they are definitely losing a large number of their paying fan base (35 - 50 demographic). These people can afford to pay the prices that the NBA wants to charge to keep the money rolling in and stay profitable. While I understand where JRut is going with his point that the league shouldn't make the policy, it is the league as a whole that is struggling with the whole "Image is Everything" concept, so it is a league-wide problem.

The NBA is run similar to McDonald's franchises, where there is basic uniformity in all of the franchises, but each franchise is allowed to have some creative freedom. But if you walk into a McDonald's in Boston, you will see basically the same thing as a McDonald's in LA, or here in Chicago.

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by SeanFitzRef
The NBA is run similar to McDonald's franchises, where there is basic uniformity in all of the franchises, but each franchise is allowed to have some creative freedom. But if you walk into a McDonald's in Boston, you will see basically the same thing as a McDonald's in LA, or here in Chicago.

I think comparing companies is not relevant to this discussion. I agree that McDonald's is one of the most successful franchises, but I do not think it is just because of the dress of the workers. McDonald's is not marketing their uniform for sale to the general public. The NBA sells a lot of what is outlawed for the players to wear to the public.

The players are also to blame for some of this; they allowed this to happen in their collective bargaining agreement. Whether you think the policy has some racial elements or corporate justifications behind it, the players signed off on this policy. I do think if this was some suburban kids wearing similar things this would not be an issue. I think the fact that this is a bunch of rich, defiant largely African-Americans now this is an issue. I really have a problem when the dress code talks about not wearing necklaces and headgear. I do not think earrings are the most professional thing to wear (which is why I stopped wearing mine all together), why are these not on the forbidden list?

Peace

[mick]

And another thing....
After a game, those guys put on some regular clothes (at least they did when the Pistons and Bucks left the Bradley Center a few years ago) and then they set out to go to some pub with old teammates or friends.
The players, I would imagine, would like a few moments of normalcy when they can catch it. The frocking league should not feel the need to put them on display with that "to-and-from" dress code.
mick

[SeanFitzRef]

Originally posted by JRutledge
I think comparing companies is not relevant to this discussion. I agree that McDonald's is one of the most successful franchises, but I do not think it is just because of the dress of the workers. McDonald's is not marketing their uniform for sale to the general public. The NBA sells a lot of what is outlawed for the players to wear to the public.

Which makes my point all the more relevant. The NBA players are equivalent to Big Macs, Quarter Pounders, and Fries. So what the NBA is trying to sell is the image that these players fit in with the mainstream folks.

Everytime I turn on an NBA game, I see the great majority of the guys in the league look like me, only taller. I have had the opportunity to talk to these guys in locker rooms or out of the public eye, and they don't sound like they just left a gang-banging session. The vast majority of the NBA players have some level of college education and maturity to handle themselves respectfully. But then you have the Carmelo Anthony incidents, the Quintel Woods incidents, and you see these guys dressing similar to the guys I see selling on the corners, and I understand where Stern would want to make the change.

Not saying I agree, but I understand. He has a business to run, and he is trying to make sure that the business sells to those that can buy. He is to blame for allowing the Baller Mentality to invade the league, so now he's trying to fix it.

[SeanFitzRef]

Originally posted by JRutledge
Is the NBA going to tell their owners to have a dress code? Has anyone seen Mark Cuban wear a suit? I have seen Jay-Z in a suit, but not at an NBA game. What about Usher? Remember, the NBA is making this rule, not teams. I would have no problem if a team took this position. I have a problem with the NBA making a rule when most of what happens off court is not seen. I have attended an NBA game and I never saw any of the players. They should worry about what the players wear off court as they go into the locker room.

Peace

This article answers the question:

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont....1251992b.html

[JRutledge]

Here is my main idea from my point of view.

Is there a racial element? Of course there is. We live in a country that is afraid of Black males and resents their money making. I have not heard one person complain how much of a millionaire Mark Cuban is. BTW, Cuban admitted to the PTI crew he does not even own a sport coat. Cuban said he worked too hard in his life so he did not have to wear such things.

Is the policy going to change? Of course not.

Is this the best battle to fight? Not at all.

I think the players should raise the issues of race if they feel they should. We have that right to our opinion whether others like it or not.

If I was in the playerÂ’s situation this would not be a problem for me. I tend to out dress most people I come in contact with when I am going to games or when I officiate basketball. I do not wear tennis shoes and T-shirts to games. I know a lot of officials that do, I just think it looks tacky. I am also not into the jewelry or the Timberland boots either. Now if I am in a casual mode I wear hats and T-shirts in my off time. When I have business to take care of, I wear much nicer cloths.

Peace

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by JRutledge
Here is my main idea from my point of view.

Is there a racial element? Of course there is. We live in a country that is afraid of Black males and resents their money making. Peace

Originally posted by JRutledge
And before someone thinks I am crying racism, I am not. If you have ever seen Steve Nash or Bill Walton's son before and after games, this is not about race. It is about age and what is acceptable amongst a younger generation.

Peace

Why don't you go away, get your story straight, and come back here & try to tell it again.

Take your time.

[JRutledge]

I believe that this society has many levels of racism. This is just another example on a lower level. I just feel it is not a fight worth having. The players will deal with it.

Peace

[David B]

Originally posted by JRutledge
I believe that this society has many levels of racism. This is just another example on a lower level. I just feel it is not a fight worth having. The players will deal with it.

Peace

Of course they will deal with it;

Either deal with it, or find another line of work!

I like that, join the club that the rest of us are part of ... the working class.

THanks
David