Insight on Coaches box

[rockyroad]

Truerookie, if there's nothing spectacular going on, and the coach is just standing there, why are you initiating contact with him/her? Unless they do something to get your attention (screaming, waving arms, being a dexter-head, etc) why even pay any attention to the coach?

[truerookie]

Originally posted by mick

When we pre-game U.P. here, it just for the officials.
Coaches are not expected to be within hearing distance.
mick

I may not have put it in a manner I thought it would be taken. I thought after meeting the team captain's you meet the coaches and as you meet the coach I can mention the coaches box. Do you not meet the coaches in U.P? I can cover with my partner.

[truerookie]

Originally posted by rockyroad
Truerookie, if there's nothing spectacular going on, and the coach is just standing there, why are you initiating contact with him/her? Unless they do something to get your attention (screaming, waving arms, being a dexter-head, etc) why even pay any attention to the coach?

Is it not a rule or not? a rule is a rule

[ChuckElias]

Originally posted by truerookie
All I am saying the rule states they must remain seated when the clock is running unless they are shout instructions to their players or applauding a spectacular play/effort.

Rook, I'm not trying to pile on, but it sounds to me that you don't really know all the aspects of the Head Coaches' Rule (10-5). The underlined part of what you wrote above is called "coaching" and standing up to coach is not allowed unless your state has adopted the coaching box.

"Shouting instructions" and "applauding an outstanding play" are in two different categories. A coach is allowed to briefly stand for the latter even if your state has not adopted the coaching box. However, a coach may not rise for the former without benefit of a coaching box.

Take another look through 10-5, just to get more familiar with it.

[tjones1]

I think this is a POE this year. So, you're probably going to hear a lot more about this topic.

[ChrisSportsFan]

Originally posted by truerookie

BBR, I am in Missouri.

Rook

Where are you at in Missouri? I'm in St. Louis. Curious where you worked a girls freshman game as it could have ONLY been part of a fall season rec league. Now you're talking about a volunteer parents coaching.

[mick]

Originally posted by rockyroad
Truerookie, if there's nothing spectacular going on, and the coach is just standing there, why are you initiating contact with him/her? Unless they do something to get your attention (screaming, waving arms, being a dexter-head, etc) why even pay any attention to the coach?

Good question, dj!

Truerookie is admittedly a rookie, so he is still attempting to interpolate all the rules into an easy to understand "system".

For example, if the coach had been standing long enough to get a 20-point lead, then the coaching box rule must be applicable to his State for at least that much of the game.
All of a sudden, from that mishmash of disjointed information, a rookie will remember [outa the blue (or is it gray matter)] a phrase in one of the books and after a little consideration, he acts on it,

So it is that truerookie, though he is still working on the system, has not put together R10-5-1 with Rule 1-13-2 [Note] and with the Case studies of 10.5 where they talk about 'the optional coaching box'.

New officials are just learning and using the letter, not the intent of [certain] rules? They appear to be overly officious, as truerookie obviously appeared to that coach, because all the rules have failed to blend, but will with diligence.

mick

[mick]

Originally posted by truerookie

I may not have put it in a manner I thought it would be taken. I thought after meeting the team captain's you meet the coaches and as you meet the coach I can mention the coaches box. Do you not meet the coaches in U.P? I can cover with my partner.

Coaches are invited to the Captain's meeting. 5% will show up because they have all "heard it before".
Generally, our only contact with coaches is 1-1/2 minutes before the game where my partners wish each coach "Good luck", and I wish them to "have a good game".
mick

[mick]

Originally posted by ChrisSportsFan

Where are you at in Missouri? I'm in St. Louis. Curious where you worked a girls freshman game as it could have ONLY been part of a fall season rec league. Now you're talking about a volunteer parents coaching.

So ChrisSportsFan, does Missouri use the box?
mick

[ChrisSportsFan]

Originally posted by mick

So ChrisSportsFan, does Missouri use the box?
mick

Yes and so long as they are using it to coach, I don't even know they're up. (practically speaking)

[rockyroad]

Originally posted by mick

Good question, dj!

Truerookie is admittedly a rookie, so he is still attempting to interpolate all the rules into an easy to understand "system".

For example, if the coach had been standing long enough to get a 20-point lead, then the coaching box rule must be applicable to his State for at least that much of the game.
All of a sudden, from that mishmash of disjointed information, a rookie will remember [outa the blue (or is it gray matter)] a phrase in one of the books and after a little consideration, he acts on it,

So it is that truerookie, though he is still working on the system, has not put together R10-5-1 with Rule 1-13-2 [Note] and with the Case studies of 10.5 where they talk about 'the optional coaching box'.

New officials are just learning and using the letter, not the intent of [certain] rules? They appear to be overly officious, as truerookie obviously appeared to that coach, because all the rules have failed to blend, but will with diligence.

mick

You and I know that, Mick, and we know that there is way too much going on out on the court to be paying attention to the coaches - unless they do something to attract our attention...sometimes it's hard to remember those early years when the letter of the law was more important to me than the intent...but I just can't imagine confronting a coach who is simply standing there doing absolutely nothing...that's a no-win situation.

[mick]

Originally posted by rockyroad

You and I know that, Mick, and we know that there is way too much going on out on the court to be paying attention to the coaches - unless they do something to attract our attention...sometimes it's hard to remember those early years when the letter of the law was more important to me than the intent...but I just can't imagine confronting a coach who is simply standing there doing absolutely nothing...that's a no-win situation.

Well, when that single phrase [coach may not stand] pops to the forefront of a busy mind, and the rest of the rule is yet to be learned, then, yeah, I can see a well-meaning rookie make an uninformed decision.
When that happens, the thought may become dominant and the focus may narrow until the new official just deals with it and ultimately ends up with a "m'bad".
mick

[Junker]

On a kind of funny related topic...I used to lift weights with a guy that was a first year coach. One night I came in and he tells me he got his first T. I asked what he did and he told me he got up off the bench and threw his hands up in the air at a no-call. I said, "Yep, that's a T (this was a freshman HS game)." He tells me he couldn't believe he got it. I asked what the rule was and he tells me the rule almost to the letter, "I can stand to applaud a spectacular play or to instruct my players." I said,"Yep." He says, "I can't believe I didn't get a warning or something." Makes you wonder sometimes.

[BayStateRef]

Originally posted by Junker
I asked what the rule was and he tells me the rule almost to the letter, "I can stand to applaud a spectacular play or to instruct my players." I said, "Yep."

That is not what the rule says. (10-5, 1 & 2) allows the coach to stand "to spontaneously react to an outstanding play" but it says nothing about instructing players. The coach may also stand to request a time out, confer with the scorer's table for a correctable error, replace a player within 30 seconds, attend to an injured player (when beckoned) and to confer with his team during a time out or between periods.

If he wants to instruct his players while standing, he needs to be in a state that has adopted the coaching box rule.

[stripes]

Originally posted by rockyroad
Truerookie, if there's nothing spectacular going on, and the coach is just standing there, why are you initiating contact with him/her? Unless they do something to get your attention (screaming, waving arms, being a dexter-head, etc) why even pay any attention to the coach?

I agree that we should not initiate contact with a coach when things are going along nicely, but I believe that we need to pay attention to what the coach is doing throughout the game. Lots of the screaming, waving arms and being a dexter-head comes, in my experience, from officials not paying attention to what the coach is doing until he demands attention from his actions.

Paying attention to what is going on with the coach can prevent molehills from becoming mountains. Part of officiating is knowing what is going on outside the lines as well as what is going on inside the lines.