reffing the screens

[cloverdale]

Hi everyone been away from the game since Febuary and just did a varsity team camp...one of the things I want to work on for the up coming season is to do a better job of reffing the screens and the defenses that have to go through them...as I tried to pay attention to more of the off ball I still was struggling with the screens and was wondering is there a trick to slowing down the action in the paint>?

[Love this Game]

Yes clover,

Talk to them, as they are posting up, tell them to clean it up.

If you see one that is set real close to illegal screen, then talk to them tell them to set the solid.

That is what I do, the first qtr is the qtr the get them to play the game clean. If in your eyes they are still setting them not clean in the second qtr, i start calling them, if they arenot listening to me talking to them

I was working this shooout last weekend, I had to call 3 seconds on this one kid 4 times, i am on the base line(get out of there) (get out of there) then i call it.

The coach and I are laughing abt after the game and trying to explain to him that when he is on offense and the ref says get out he might want to look at where he is.

But I think you can stop all of that by just talking to them. And then if it does not work start calling those illegal picks.

[blindzebra]

It's all about positioning and not taking referee the defense literally.

Some officials focus on the defensive player and lose sight of the ball and other players.

Work on seeing through the players by not focusing on the match up as much as watching through it. This will allow you to see the screen coming when you are on ball.

When you are off ball get as many players as you can in your visual field, and work at picking up the cutters and the screeners. Get in position to see the whole play.

[BktBallRef]

Remember these 3 things:

1- All screens must be short of contact.

2- Time and distance are always relevant. If the screen is from behind, allow the defender one step without contact. When the defender is moving, you may need to allow up to two steps.

3- The screener must be stationary, unless both are moving in the same direction.If the screener steps into the defender or extends his arms, hip or legs into him, you have a foul.

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by BktBallRef
Remember these 3 things:

1- All screens must be short of contact.

2- Time and distance are always relevant. If the screen is from behind, allow the defender one step without contact. When the defender is moving, you may need to allow up to two steps.

3- The screener must be stationary, unless both are moving in the same direction.If the screener steps into the defender or extends his arms, hip or legs into him, you have a foul.

One more thing I think it's important to keep in mind. No screen is illegal until there's contact. It's not quite true that anyone can do anything, but very nearly. If the screen-ee dodges and avoids contact, then the screen wasn't illegal, no matter if it was moving or leaning or doing jumping jacks.

The corollary is that even the most incidental contact is illegal if it's a screener that moves into a screen-ee. Call a ticky-tack screen or two, off ball, in the first quarter, and you won't have any thing to worry about the rest of the game.

[JRutledge]

Call the obvious violations of the rules, not just the bad screens attempts.

As a general philosophy I like to have the player being screened earn the call. If they just kind of give up on the position, then I tend to not call it. If the screener comes out and really hits them or they are really knocked off stride, I try my best to call those all day. But I will not call a foul if the kid just saw a screener and stopped running or did not continue in the same direction. I understand the rule talks about what to do when there is contact, but the rule still refers to incidental contact and not calling something just because there is contact.

Peace

[tomegun]

Dave Libbey once described officiating at two games: on-ball and off-ball. You want to see the consequences of the ball while officiating a play on-ball. While officiating off-ball call contact. Period.
Another official mentioned the term "ref the defense" and said it was wrong. We should ref the matchup. Most of the time you will only have to look at two matchups (4 players) max at the C. Once it is more then that a rotation should occur.
Screening is one call that we have the luxury of being slow on. See what happens and then call it or no-call it. Often officials see a little bit of contact and pass on it. If Reggie Miller's teammates could set illegal screens with a tiny bit of contact Reggie would have a field day. Shooters only need an additional split second to get their shot off so being illegal the smallest little bit will help the shooter. If the player screened is contacted illegally and slowed one step it will make all the difference in the world for a shooter or a player that cuts to the basket once the defensive player arrives late as a result of the illegal screen. Look for players taking the contact to the person they wish to screen and look for elbows and knees coming out for ineffective screens.
In time it will come much easier. I think one thing the original poster pointed out alluded to watching the ball. This could be a bigger problem than calling illegal screens.

[cloverdale]

I have read your posts 3 times and printed it for future reference...alot of things to think about and implement... zebra, you hit the mark with me, I tend to tunnel vision when i'm trail...will open up some to keep my primary in focus...

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by tomegun
Dave Libbey once described officiating at two games: on-ball and off-ball. You want to see the consequences of the ball while officiating a play on-ball. While officiating off-ball call contact. Period.
Another official mentioned the term "ref the defense" and said it was wrong. We should ref the matchup. Most of the time you will only have to look at two matchups (4 players) max at the C. Once it is more then that a rotation should occur.

Please keep in mind that there are quite a few differences between 3-person and 2-person, and between the levels where 2-person is worked, nd the levels where 3-person is worked. In two person, you don't have the luxury of watching only two match-ups, at least not very often. I'd say ref the defense is very good advice at any level that takes 2-person. As players move around the floor, you need to know that the screen was set, or that there was legal guarding position before contact. In order to do that, you need to focus more on the defense. It sounds like the statement that "ref the defense" is wrong came at a 3-person camp, which would probably include a higher level of play, and obviously a different style of reffing.

[blindzebra]

Originally posted by rainmaker

Please keep in mind that there are quite a few differences between 3-person and 2-person, and between the levels where 2-person is worked, nd the levels where 3-person is worked. In two person, you don't have the luxury of watching only two match-ups, at least not very often. I'd say ref the defense is very good advice at any level that takes 2-person. As players move around the floor, you need to know that the screen was set, or that there was legal guarding position before contact. In order to do that, you need to focus more on the defense. It sounds like the statement that "ref the defense" is wrong came at a 3-person camp, which would probably include a higher level of play, and obviously a different style of reffing.

I never said it was wrong, I said it can cause an official to lose sight of everything else if taking too literally.

Find the defense or be aware of the defense are better terms, IMO.

Reguardless of level or system the most important factors are:

Positioning and being able to see through the play. The NBA philosophy...but it is the same at all levels...is open vs closed looks. Straightlined and getting in a stack discribe the closed look very well. Two hands up about 6 inches apart make for a great demonstration. Seeing both hands and space between is what you want, seeing the back of one hand is not.

Finding the defense and being aware of the ball and or pivot foot. This is where referee the defense taken literally causes problems. It is very easy to find the defender and lock on.

Focus through the match up on ball. After you find LGP and ball/pivot, position to see through the play and open up your visual field. It is not that hard to referee off ball if there is not great pressure on the ball. This will help with those high post screens behind the ball and the screen to free up the ball.

The same goes for off ball. Position to see as many players with an open look as possible. Be aware of the cutters and the screeners, and find the defenders in their path.

[Edited by blindzebra on Jul 2nd, 2005 at 04:10 PM]

[JRutledge]

I have never taken the term "Referee the defense" as to mean not to ever watch the offense. The term really is only to tell officials to understand that where the defense is so that you do not incorrectly call fouls and possible violations on the defense. If you are not too close to the play, you can see what both are doing. What happens to many officials, they watch the offense the entire time and call blocking calls on defensive players when they were in LGP.

If you referee the defense you can recognize what the defense is doing and understand what the offense will have to do to beat the defense. An offense plays different when they are up against a zone defense or man to man defense.

When you understand that it helps you know what might possibly happen. You can anticipate much more easily and not get caught completely off guard.

Peace

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by blindzebra

I never said it was wrong, I said it can cause an official to lose sight of everything else if taking too literally.

I never said you said it was wrong!

[tomegun]

Blindzebra, I think I was the one she was saying was wrong. You did a fine job of describing how what I said applies to officiating two or three man on any level.

[blindzebra]

Originally posted by rainmaker

I never said you said it was wrong!

I never said you said it was wrong!

You replied to tomegun's post and he mentioned it.

I was just clearing that up and then I went on to explain that level and system had little to do with how you should see the play.

In fact the open look philosophy is even more important with only two officials, because there is more overlap, i.e. secondary areas, to get help from a partner in three whistle.

I find that many of the 3 whistle mechanics and philosophies adapt very well into 2 whistle. We do very little 3 whistle below the college level here in Arizona, so I'm not speaking from a predominately 3 whistle position.

[Edited by blindzebra on Jul 4th, 2005 at 01:25 AM]

[Jimgolf]

Along the lines of this topic, what about "leaners" (those players that have legal position for a screen, but the defender goes around, so the screener leans to the side to make his position wider)?

How much leeway do you give to "leaners", or is any contact enough to warrant a foul call?