Van Gundy fined for comments about playoff officiating

[ChrisSportsFan]

Heck, even the very best players in the world will still miss a shot or 2 every game....shrug?

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by IUgrad92
Many say that to be an NBA official is the pinnacle of officiating, they are the best in the game. Then how does Salvatore miss that call???

You've never missed a call?

And if you're going to tell me that FEEBLE officials are the best in the world, I know you're full of $hit!

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by IUgrad92
I see you didn't refute my comment on NBA officials allowing 3-5 steps just to allow spectacular dunks. That was really my point. Obviously, the rules have evolved, hence the yearly NFHS changes!! NBA officials basically ignore their rules to allow certain events to happen. That's fine with me, the NBA is just entertainment.

That's because you were exxagerating so much, we could address it all. I've never seen an NBA player take 5 steps and dunk the ball. Yes, they allow an extra step but so does the NCAA.

NBA officials DO NOT ignore the rules. The officiate the game by NBA rules and the follow the philosophy of the NBA. If you were in the NBA, not that you ever will be, you would call the game the exact same way that they do.

[TriggerMN]

Originally posted by BktBallRef

That's because you were exxagerating so much, we could address it all. I've never seen an NBA player take 5 steps and dunk the ball. Yes, they allow an extra step but so does the NCAA.

NBA officials DO NOT ignore the rules. The officiate the game by NBA rules and the follow the philosophy of the NBA. If you were in the NBA, not that you ever will be, you would call the game the exact same way that they do.

You obviously never saw James Worthy play, then.

[IUgrad92]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by BktBallRef
[B]That's because you were exxagerating so much, we could address it all. I've never seen an NBA player take 5 steps and dunk the ball. Yes, they allow an extra step but so does the NCAA.


So the NCAA allows a step too, huh? I'd be interested in seeing what the average travel calls per game is between the NCAA and the NBA. I rarely see an NCAA official pass on a travel call just to allow a dunk.

Originally posted by BktBallRef

You've never missed a call?

And if you're going to tell me that FEEBLE officials are the best in the world, I know you're full of $hit!

BktBallRef, if you would have read my second post, you never would have made this comment. No offense taken. I sure did get a chuckle though when those FEEBLE officials called travelling on LeBron after he took 4 steps in preparing for a monster dunk. Tweeeet, no basket!!! LeBron didn't know what hit him.

I understand the NBA guys are highly trained and do what they are told to do. That's why the NBA is in a decline. People are finally seeing it as entertainment and not really basketball. That's a show I would never want to be an actor in. Now NCAA........that's a different story!!

[BktBallRef]

Got news for ya, bub, the NBA is not declining.

[Camron Rust]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by JRutledge
[B]

Originally posted by IUgrad92

I have seen many Olympic Games, you really cannot tell me these guys are the best or the system they use is the best. That has to be the funniest thing you have said in this post. FIBA officials, the best officials in the world?

Peace

While I don't ofter agree with Jeff, he couldn't be more right here.

The guys in the olympics looked like the keystone cops out there. The average NCAA playoff crew would have been more capable. THe calls were horribly inconsistent. I could never figure out if they would have a block or charge. It was different every time down the floor.

As far as the best basketball....HAHAHA. Yes, the US got beat a few times. With ~2 weeks of playing together, would you really expect a group of individuals to play really well against teams that play together nearly year round....usually with 1-2 NBA starters (that gained their skill here) that have returned home to help them out for 2 weeks.

[gostars]

You also have to remember that several of the best player from the US (like Shaq) didn't come to the Olympics at all.

[ysong]

Originally posted by BktBallRef
Yes, they allow an extra step but so does the NCAA.
NBA officials DO NOT ignore the rules. The officiate the game by NBA rules and the follow the philosophy of the NBA.

to BktBallRef and other GENTLEMEN:

I have some questions about NBA philosophy:

1. What are the reasons (or excuses) that NBA does not use more replays to help the officials, like NFL does?(currently they only use it to correct clock, I think)

2. Why does NBA not make the rule interpretations widely available to the public, like NCAA does?

3. What responsibilities (integrity, sportsmanship wise) they genunely believe they have to the public?

Of course, I know all the cynical "answers". so spare me those. Please help me with some objective insights.

Thanks.

ysong

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by ysong
1. What are the reasons (or excuses) that NBA does not use more replays to help the officials, like NFL does?(currently they only use it to correct clock, I think)

The NBA is not the NFL, or the MLB. MLB doesn't review anything with replay. Why should they? What issues would you like to see reviewable?

2. Why does NBA not make the rule interpretations widely available to the public, like NCAA does?

The NBA rules are online on their website. They have a TV network that often has the supervisor of officials on to explain calls, rules, interpretations and philosophies. They routinely discuss specific situations through press releases. The publicly reprimanded an official last year for a judgment that he made. I think they're very public about the things that need to be before the public.

3. What responsibilities (integrity, sportsmanship wise) they genunely believe they have to the public?

Do they have a responsibility to inform the public regarding internal processes, discussions, and philosophies? No, they do not. Further, there's no reason to comment of the "percieved" injustices of biased individuals, connly known as fan(atic)s.

BTW, I hate it when someone tells me how to answer a question. I reserve the right to answer with "cynical answers" if I so choose to. When you ask a question, you get what you get. You don't get to determine how the respondent answers the question.

[Goose]

Just my 2 cents plus my old Chuck Taylor's thrown in for good measure.

Ahh, the NBA. The worst officiated pro league in the US of A.

Before bashing the ref's to death for their ineptness, let's look at the bigger picture.

1. The NBA exists not to exhibit basketball at a high level but to make money. The means to make this money is a game called basketball. Those who fail to recognize this little matter, should just stop now.

2. With point one being said, the sole purpose of the league is to generate money for the owners, period. And with that being said, the owners have collectively choosen to market their product in a certain manner.

3. This marketing has evolved into the fuzzy area that was once the sole property of the WWF, a.k.a., World Wide Wrestling Federation, who when pressed for explanations, billed themselves as "Sports Entertainment". Sadly, these are the depths to which the NBA has fallen.

4. In order to appeal to a mass audience apart from New York City, Chicago, and L.A., the NBA has adopted for quite some time, the mentality of putting entertainment above the actual game itself.

5. The entertainment factor has created several large scale problems though. One such problem is that no one really wants to plunk down 50 dollars to see Shaq, Lebron, or you put in the stars name, sit on the bench in the first quarter with 3 fouls, nor do they pay to see them foul out either. So, the stars have long received special treatment. Afterall, the ref's are hardly willing to bit the hand that is feeding them. This is also why crappy behavior is tolerated.

6. Again, in the NBA's quest for appeal, they have tweaked the game, underminded some rules all in the name of money. Yea, the ref's can be blamed for the way the game is called to a degree, but again, they surely don't want to crush the golden egg, nor the goose that is laying them. Everyone wants to see the monster dunk, but who really cares if he took a couple of extra steps? It was fun wasn't it?

Conversely, the College game has been somewhat different, although as of late, they are swinging to the trend of bringing in more money, hence more crappy officiating and more gimmicks to raise interest.

The college game used to be, and for my money still is the defacto standard. The game is called correctly and fairly with little reguard to star power. Some will argue that point, but it is more often than not, that a teams key player is in foul trouble, which causes the coach to actually coach... What a novel thought! The bench in college ball plays a far larger role in the game than we see in the NBA. This is a direct result of the game being called correctly. Guys are gonna foul and foul out and this is seen repeatedly in the college game. The NBA rarely has Shaq or Iverson foul out, and when it does happen, PTI or Sports Center will be all over it and questioning the ref's left and right.

The NBA is little more than the old Globetrotters, only these guys don't throw water on the fans. Well, at least they don't do it as a joke.

In my book, the NBA has sacrificed a great game all for the entertainment dollar which has only dumbed down the game and turned off many avid basketball fans. Then they wonder why their ratings are so poor. Hey stupids, play the game right and let the game speak for itself.

I could go on and on, but it is pointless. The NBA has merely drifted into the same arena as Wrestle Mania. Is it real or is it fake? I'll leave it up to you. But for my entertainment dollar, I'd much rather go and see the And-One mix tape tour than the crappy NBA. At least with the bozo's from the And-One tour, you know what you are getting, and they are quite "entertaining" afterall.

goose

p.s. the professor rules!

[Mark Dexter]

Originally posted by ysong

1. What are the reasons (or excuses) that NBA does not use more replays to help the officials, like NFL does?(currently they only use it to correct clock, I think)

Well, the main thing is that reviewable plays in football almost always involve location - of the ball or of players. If the NBA went to replay, soon people are going to want every foul, every travel - called or percieved but not called - to be reviewed.

In addition, football lends itself to reviews, where basketball does not. You always have time between downs in football, while you might go three minutes without a whistle in basketball. With a travel - when do you review a travel that wasn't called?

[ysong]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by BktBallRef

BTW, I hate it when someone tells me how to answer a question. I reserve the right to answer with "cynical answers" if I so choose to. When you ask a question, you get what you get. You don't get to determine how the respondent answers the question.

Somebody needs a nap, real bad.

I wonder if Bushref has re-incarnated again.

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by Goose
5. The entertainment factor has created several large scale problems though. One such problem is that no one really wants to plunk down 50 dollars to see Shaq, Lebron, or you put in the stars name, sit on the bench in the first quarter with 3 fouls, nor do they pay to see them foul out either. So, the stars have long received special treatment. Afterall, the ref's are hardly willing to bit the hand that is feeding them. This is also why crappy behavior is tolerated.

That is just crap. Shaq and Tim Duncan foul out a lot. These are two of the best big men in the game and they foul out in big games and when the spotlight is the brightest. Tim Duncan fouled out the other night on a foul that was suspect at best. These two players are the last line of defense and block a lot of shots. Perimeter players like Michael Jordan or Allen Iverson are not going to foul out. They do not block shots and they are not the last line of defense in or around the basket. If you look at who fouls out the most, these are Centers and Power Forwards that consistently lead the league.

Does it ever occur to people that stars do not foul or get fouled because they make better decisions? MJ used to constantly attack the basket. Scottie Pippen used to attack the basket. Who else on those Bulls teams constantly attacked the basket?

Peace

[JugglingReferee]

Originally posted by Goose
the WWF, a.k.a., World Wide Wrestling Federation,

Were you thinking of the web when you wrote this sentence?

Ya gotta admit that there is some very intelligent marketing going on. The WWF became the WWE and their slogan was, 'Get the F out'. Same with the NBA. Very good marketing.

Go Nash! Go Suns!