I ref mostly in Nebraska and some in Iowa. Both of these states run with 2 man crews{in high school}.I have been to a few national camps where they have talked about working with 3 man crews for high school games. Does anyone what the ratio is between states that work 2 man compared to states that run 3 man?? After working many 3 man games in college-I do believe that at least 4 the larger schools; 3 man crews would be a much better situation. Please post your state and what type of crews you run with. THANKS!! ---Can we cover all 50 states from here?

[Edited by BOBBYMO on Mar 7th, 2001 at 08:58 PM]

Ga, we run 3 man for all our varsity HS that my assoc covers

Might need to rephase the question.
 

You might need to ask in a different way. At least in the state of Illinois is just depends. We only have 2 classes (A-small schools, AA-bigger schools). It depends in this state on several factors. I grew up in West Central Illinois, and many of those schools which happen to be Class A are almost entirely 3 man games. But they usually have the officials do a JV game, then the varsity after. I have been doing this for the majority of my 5 years in officiating. Now over 2 years ago, I moved to the Chicago area, and almost all the varsity games that I did were 2 man (I only do boys games). Now the post-season is 3 man in both boys and girls basketball. But the regular season is going to vary depending on some conferences or individual schools or even assignors.

So at least in Illinois, it is a hybrid until you get to the post season. But many of those conferences that I will be working next year are going to 3 man next year. So that is the direction the state is taking and the conferences are following.

Colorado does 2 man. Three man has been experimented with bugt I don't think it will take off. Not until Colorado does better then 49th in the country on money spent per child in school.

Three Man in Ohio
 

In Ohio, the decision to go (or not to go) to three man coverage is left to each league. The vast majority of the larger-school leagues are now three man for boys, and the smaller schools are steadily moving that way, too. As far as I know, all the girls' games are two man until mid-way through the post-season tournament.

3-person crew
 

Hello Everyone. I am new to the forum (lurked for a while). I have enjoyed the comments/discussion so I decided to take the plunge!. I am in the Northern Virginia area and my association (350 officials) is the largest in this area. We cover about 75 schools -- freshman, JV, varsity, and Recreation ball. The schools in Va. are classified A, AA, or AAA (depending on school enrollment). Girls A & AA previously participated in the Fall, but begining next school year will move to "winter" ball. We have used 3-person crew for all District, Region, and State tournaments. This year, we went to regular season 3-person varsity crews in mid-January. We are hoping next year to go to 3-person at the varsity level for the whole season. Some of the Districts have always insisted on 3-person crews all year. The remaining Districts have "discussed" doing this, but so far it has been a $$$ issue.

In Northern California, almost all the leagues use 2-person mechanics during the regular season. Once we get to the state tournament, however, we start using 3-person for both boys and girls.

Is this common in other states? One thing I do not like about this system is that teams are used to 2 refs all year, and the playoff officials have worked 2-person all year - then at the end of the year, we all of a sudden throw 3-person into the mix. I'm not quite sure that is fair to either the officials or the teams.

If the leagues had the money, I think most would choose to work 3-person all year, but we are lucky to get paid fair with just 2 officials...

Re: Three Man in Ohio
 

Now I find that interesting. I live about 20 minutes outside of Cleveland, and being a first year official I try and stay to watch the V games after all my JV games (ya never know when the opportunity will present itself...). Anyway, every game I've seen, girls or boys, has been 3-person mechanics - at least at the V level.

In South Carolina we do 3 man for varsity games. The consequence to 3 man is the fee per official drops. We only get $45 for 2 varsity games (girls and boys).

The ohio mechanics vary by region.

Here in the lovely capital city all varsity uses 3 man. The only exception is some conferences still use two man for their girls. And I was under the impression all tourney games were three.

I have said it before, and I will say it again, to use expense as a reason not to have three man is weak.

Most schools have 10 home games, give or take one or two. If the varsity fee is $45, then that is only $900 more per year to take varsity to three man. You cannot tell me they can't scrape up an extra $1000 per year to handle varsity games properly. At worst riase the gate a quarter a ticket, it will more than make up the diff.

If you're curious...in Atlantic Canada 3-whistle mechanics are only used at the University level. Small colleges and below all use 2-whistle and each level seems to use a different set of rules. This year I am responsible for knowing 4 sets of rules!!! The 2-whistle system at the college level and the AAA high school is very challenging. The schools just don't want to spend the extra $$$.

Ct respond
 

In Southern Ct most game are 2 man although all inter-city game are 3 man. Some of the schools use 3 man on their own. All semi-finals and finals of our county are 3 man. I'm almost sure that the semis and finals of the states are going to 3 man this year.

In Northern Nevada we have 3 classifications, 4A, 3A, 2A, and 1A. All 4A schools have 3 person crews for Varsity boys and girls games. All post season games are covered with 3 person crews for sectionals and state tournaments.

Re: Ct respond
 

Yup, changed just this year - it used to be just finals were 3-man.

The part of CT I'm from, it used to be school's call (some of the big games would be 3-man), but this season, every regular game except for one was 2-man, although it seems like the assignors have been sending alternate refs to each game.

Oklahoma uses 3-man for 5A and 6A (64 largest schools in state)but uses 2-man for class B thru class 4A.

In Kansas it is left up to the leagues to decide how many refs during the regular season. All post-season tourneys (regional, sub-state & state) are 3-man crews for both boys and girls varsity. Most of the larger leagues (3A thru 6A) use 3 officials for all varsity games. Some of the 1A & 2A schools use 3-man but most use 2 officials. I've also heard that a few of the larger schools in the Wichita area are using 3 officials for some Jr. High games. Must be nice!

In Utah it is all 2-man. Two seasons ago there was talk of going to 3-man, but it got shot down. Rumor has it that two things were to blame--$$$ and the small schools in the state feeling like they would get the leftover officials after the big schools got the best ones.

I hope we can get it pushed through in the next couple of years. The game needs it.

[Edited by Kelly Kinghorn on Mar 13th, 2001 at 07:12 PM]

Here in southtern West Virginia it is about all 3-man even girls games. Because no matter what size the school or whether it is boys or girls it is still better court coverage. About everyone in my chapter insists on 3-man.

WOW! What a difference crossing the northern border makes!

In NC, all schools are required by the NCHSAA to use 3 man crews for varsity games. We get $70 to work a girls and boys doulbeheader. But that's a flat rate. We don't receive any travel pay.

Our association has just finished our second year of officiating JV games with three officials. It's a great training tool for the up and coming officials. They get $60 for a JV doubleheader.

In Indiana, the state tournaments use only 2 offocials. However, there are a few conferences that require 3 officials for varsity games. I believe that most of these still hire a separate 2-man crew for the JV game.

WISCONSIN
 

For the most part, it is 2-person crews; including the play-offs and state level games. However, I have been told, by other officials, that the Metro area around Milwaukee does use 3-person crews during conference play.

I am not aware of the pay structure for Varsity level games. I do know that this varies between conferences (Some pay a flat fee, no travel, etc...). For lower level games, we individually solicit contracts and these fees vary from as low as $15 for Middle School - $30 for Junior Varsity.

In Oregon, all Jr Hi and HS ball is 2-whistle right up through the state championship. We will probably never go to 3-whistle, if given the choice and what I hear is that $$$ is the reason.

I have lived in different parts of Alaska, and I have seen two and three man mechanics, Some areas due to the shortage of officials, they are limited to 2 man.

AK ref SE

3-man in high school
 

BobbyMo,

Well, you bring up a very hot issue right now in high school sports. I am a basketball referee in Michigan and we are currently in the 3-man crew toss right now. Here in Michigan there about 10 conferences that require 3-man crews for the varsity games. And some conferences, leave it up to the crews themselves as to whether tto bring a third man or night. In the palyoffs, the first two rounds of playoffs are done with 2-man crews. The third, fourth, and final rounds are officiated by 3-man crews. Right now, we are asking that all basketball playoffs be officiated by 3-man crews. We will see what happens.

Jtsref

In texas, we have gone to three person mechanics in all of our major Tournaments. (5a our largest division) and in district play the coaches have voted it in in some areas of 4a as well as all of the 5a districts statewide if I am not mistaken. The game is advancing to the level of the need for three person, and I believe that eventually we need all levels to go to it. I believe that one major obstacle is the one of cost to a lot of these smaller schools, thay just cannot afford the extra $45 for the third official, plus numbers are down for officials in my state and nationwide. Let's recruit people!! Just my 2 cents.

How many home games are there?
 

During our season each school has 10 to 15 home games. Our fee is $65 and change. That's $650 to $975 thruough the couse of the season. Each school charges admission and usually sell concessions is it really a money issue? Or due the old school AD's and coaches just refuse to conform? Sorry to vent but if the personel is available we should work!!:)

North Carolina uses 3 man crews for HS varisty. JV and anything lower is 2 man. Fee is $70.00 for 2 games (girls & boys)
Majority of AAU ball is 2 man, but some tournaments are going to 3 man.
I would be interested in the data you gather.

In the greater San Antonio, TX area we went to three-person mechanics for ALL 4A and 5A games this year (non-district, district, and playoffs). 1A, 2A, and 3A all use three-person for the state tournament (final four).

The coaches (i think) and officials both felt like the move improved the quality of officiating for those games. In order to facilitate the move, most officials were scheduled to work two games (9th or JV - 2 person and stay for Varsity - 3 person).

Jake

3 man in high school
 

In iaabo board 12 ,we use 3 person for D.C. boys/girls and our private schools in the area.