The Hartzell thing

[RadDad2005]

New poster here. I wondered what the reaction would be to Doug Gottlieb's accusations toward Rick Hartzell. I guess I expected a bit more outrage from a group of officials. Apparently the B10 was outraged send the following message to ESPN (for context, Gottliebs comments are listed at the bottom):

March 4, 2005

Park Ridge, IL -- The Big Ten has communicated its extreme disappointment and concern to ESPN's management relative to statements made by Mr. Doug Gottlieb at the halftime of Thursday's Purdue at Illinois basketball game on ESPN2.

Specifically Mr. Gottlieb called into question the integrity of Mr. Rick Hartzell, an official in Tuesday's Indiana at Wisconsin basketball game, telecast by ESPN.

In addition Mr. Gottlieb questioned the professionalism of Big Ten Associate Commissioner Rich Falk relative to the administration of the Big Ten's men's basketball officiating program.

Neither statement should have been made, and in our view these statements represent an example of irresponsible sports `reporting'. It is unfortunate that Mr. Gottlieb, whose own reputation for honest dealings has been called into question in the past, has been placed in the position by ESPN to pass judgment on a well-regarded, veteran official working a Big Ten basketball game, and a Big Ten associate commissioner who has rendered valuable service to the Conference and college basketball for decades.

The Big Ten Conference considers this matter concluded and will have no further comment.

TRANSCRIPT OF DOUG GOTTLIEB'S COMMENTS DURING HALFTIME OF ESPN2'S COVERAGE OF THE PURDUE-ILLINOIS GAME MARCH 3, 2005:

"As we take you back to Tuesday night Indiana-Wisconsin it's obvious that there may not be a real clear cut, a clear cut bad call made on this particular play.

But if you watch it there is the appearance that maybe there is a conflict of interest. You know, Indiana trailed by one and it looked like Wilkinson fouls on the play...Mike Wilkinson fouls on the play. Mike Davis obviously went nuts but Rick Hartzell was the official who was in position.

And that conflict of interest or at least the appearance of the conflict of interest is apparent because Rick Hartzell is the athletic director at Northern Iowa. Now if he's the AD for a bubble team, why is he officiating a game involving another bubble team in a game that could cost Mike Davis his job, and could definitely cost Indiana a chance to play in the NCAA Tournament?

I'm not saying there is a clear cut conflict of interest, but there is at least that appearance. And it lends the question, why is Rich Falk assigning him to a game in the Big Ten? He's the conference officials commissioner, and why is he assigning him to this game, and why wasn't a switch made at the last second so that there's never that appearance? When it was obviously at least to Steve Lavin, who was calling the game as the color man for ESPN. He said it was a bad call. I agree. It was a totally blown missed call. But now there the appearance of the conflict of interest because there's no call made and because he's the AD at Northern Iowa."

[tjones1]

Welcome to the forum. Here's a thread that was already started: http://www.officialforum.com/thread/18910

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by RadDad2005
...Gottlieb's accusations toward Rick Hartzell. I guess I expected a bit more outrage from a group of officials. "

This group of officials doesn't put much stock into what announcers say. They know next to nothing about rules, officiating, or fair play. Why should we be surprised when they accuse us of cheating? They do it all the time.

[TriggerMN]

Good for the Big 10. Gottlieb and Lavin were both 100% wrong, as replays showed definitively.

[Peach State Ref]

Does anyone see where there might be a possible conflict of intrest for a athletic director at a D1 school officiating D1 athletics ? Personally, I do - even if it is outside his own conference. I think that Rick is a quality official, but I am not sure this is a prudent for the NCAA to allow this.

[TriggerMN]

OK. If you're going to do that, let's take out everyone who has a job affiliated with a D-1 program. That takes out guys like Ed Hightower, Randy Heimerman, Gerald Boudreaux.

Now let's take out everyone who is an official who played D-1 in college. That takes out countless guys like Steve Welmer.

Where do you want it to end?

This is like saying a professor at Harvard can't go and give a speech on new technology at Stanford because it might make Stanford students smarter, thus giving them better jobs and taking away prospective alumni monies to Harvard down the line.

[JRutledge]

I have members of my family that attended a couple of Big Ten schools. Should I not be allowed to work D1 ball ever because I have family members that attended those schools? I attended a school that is a D1 program and one of my parents is a teacher at that university still. Should I not be allowed to work D1 games in any conference because of that? If that is the case I cannot work the Big Ten, Mid-Con, MEAC, ACC and Atlantic 10. I was also born in Ann Arbor and had a parent attend Michigan, Wisconsin and Florida A&M. There are over 300 D1 school, there are a lot of possibilities for conflict if working at a school, attending a school or having family members is going to be considered a conflict all the time.

Peace

[Rich]

Originally posted by Peach State Ref
Does anyone see where there might be a possible conflict of intrest for a athletic director at a D1 school officiating D1 athletics ? Personally, I do - even if it is outside his own conference. I think that Rick is a quality official, but I am not sure this is a prudent for the NCAA to allow this.

This is stretching the whole conflict of interest thing a bit too far. Should Rick not work games involving his school or in his conference? Sure.

But where do many officials seem to come from? Education.

My HS football crew has a teacher on it. We won't work varsity games involving his school, obviously. That's as far as it goes. Any more would make my head hurt.

[ChuckElias]

Originally posted by JRutledge
Should I not be allowed to work D1 ball ever because I have family members that attended those schools?

No, not b/c you had family members there. . .

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by ChuckElias

No, not b/c you had family members there. . .

Why, because I am too tall?

Peace

[Adam]

Originally posted by JRutledge

Why, because I am too tall?

Peace

No, because your sig line is too long.

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by Snaqwells


No, because your sig line is too long.

I have been told that before.

Peace

[mj]

This whole conflict of interest is amazing to me. When I was doing a lot of Frosh/JV games at my hometown high school, I never once saw something on the court and thought about whether I should call that foul/violation on Jimmy because I might see his Dad at work.

You see something, decide whether an advantage was gained and go from there.

I know the Hartzell thing is a little different, but really is it? We are just refereeing a basketball game and whoever is playing, I could care less who wins.

My $.02

[RadDad2005]

thanks for the responses. The closest I ever came to favoring a team was in a junior high game, the score was 73-0 and I was calling fouls so the trailing team could get a chance to score a point. It ended 84-1. Mission accomplished!

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

And now for something completely different.

Obviously, I must be the only official to officiate a D1 game and call all five fouls on his girl friend who was playing in the game.

MTD, Sr.