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Old Fri Jan 28, 2005, 10:28pm
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this happened before the JV game. during warmups before the jv game a member of the varsity dunked the ball, the jv's were not on the court at the time, they had went back into the locker room. this happened at about the 6 minute mark. at about the 2 minute mark the same varsity player dunked the ball again with the jv's on the court warming up to. should a technical foul be given to start the game even though it was a varsity player? that player was not in the book for the jv game. he was definetly a varsity player. did it matter if the jv's were on the court or not? please provide some input. the varsity officials said it would not be a technical because we have no control over the varsity players. i think we should have called a technical.
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Old Fri Jan 28, 2005, 10:33pm
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Was the varsity guy in uniform?
At most, I would have warned the JV coach after the first one.
"Coach, if he does it again, it'll be a technical."
Not sure I'd really worry about it, but I think a warning would do the trick if you want it stopped.
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Old Fri Jan 28, 2005, 10:36pm
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the varsity player was in uniform, but the varsity team had different warmups on than the jv's. i was wondering by rule if it would be a technical the first time he dunks the ball. all the coaches seen it from the other team, his coach had no idea. it's not that "if i want it stopped", the fact is that i dont believe it is legal.

[Edited by yankeesfan on Jan 28th, 2005 at 10:40 PM]
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Old Fri Jan 28, 2005, 11:02pm
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Why did you ignore the first dunk? You should have shoo'ed him off or T'ed him up.

I would have T'ed him up right there, walked him over to the JV coach when he showed up & let him explain why he felt the need to dunk while I was on the court & he wasn't.
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Old Fri Jan 28, 2005, 11:16pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dan_ref
Why did you ignore the first dunk? You should have shoo'ed him off or T'ed him up.

I would have T'ed him up right there, walked him over to the JV coach when he showed up & let him explain why he felt the need to dunk while I was on the court & he wasn't.
where is the rule to support this. i can't penalize the jv team when they are not even on the court. do we have jurisdiction on varsity players?
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Old Sat Jan 29, 2005, 12:38am
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I got no T. I'd tell the JV or Varsity coach to get him off the floor and let him chew on the player. It isn't legal if he's warming up for the JV game, but he isn't a JV player. Don't get a case of "Whackattack fever" over this.
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Old Sat Jan 29, 2005, 11:48am
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Quote:
Originally posted by yankeesfan
Quote:
Originally posted by Dan_ref
Why did you ignore the first dunk? You should have shoo'ed him off or T'ed him up.

I would have T'ed him up right there, walked him over to the JV coach when he showed up & let him explain why he felt the need to dunk while I was on the court & he wasn't.
where is the rule to support this. i can't penalize the jv team when they are not even on the court. do we have jurisdiction on varsity players?
Youi have jurisdiction over the court.

As I said you should have done *something* when the kid dunked the first time. I would have T'ed him up. He was in uniform and he already knows better. It's safe to assume he's a squad member if he's in uniform & on the court during the warm-up period.
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Old Sat Jan 29, 2005, 12:08pm
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Since he is a V player he would not be in the book. How would you handle that?
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Old Sat Jan 29, 2005, 12:08pm
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I agree with Dan here on the main point. This is your fault for ignoring the first dunk. You can't be timid or unsure of your job. When I referee, I know that it is my court.

I would not, however, T him up. Rather, I would step toward the player and instruct him to leave the court. This is not his game. Then he would have left. It is that simple.

(Reason I don't T him-
1. I don't like dishing out Techs for things I can avoid.
2. I don't think the JV coach should sit the whole game because of an idiot Varsity kid that gets no warning.
3. Because I can handle this situation without one.
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Old Sat Jan 29, 2005, 01:18pm
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How can you Tee someone who is clearly not a member of the team? Do you Tee the home team if a spectator comes on the court and dunks. I think not.
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Old Sat Jan 29, 2005, 02:07pm
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How can you Tee someone who is clearly not a member of the team? Do you Tee the home

akward as this may sound to you i believe you certainly could. you can "T" the teams for there fans unsporting acts, wouldn't you agree. before you say it though, i know, its is to be done as a last means whenever possible. this kid was simply a spectator at the time of this jv game. he didnt belong on the floor anymore than any other fan. and unlike like a "joe blow" sitting in the stands you would certainly know which team he supported.
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Old Sat Jan 29, 2005, 02:14pm
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Dan_ref
[B][QUOTE]Originally posted by yankeesfan
Quote:
Originally posted by Dan_ref
[
Youi have jurisdiction over the court.

As I said you should have done *something* when the kid dunked the first time. I would have T'ed him up. He was in uniform and he already knows better. It's safe to assume he's a squad member if he's in uniform & on the court during the warm-up period.
hey dan,

what if the varsity player dunks at half time when the officials are in the locker room? i was told we do not have jurisdiction on the varsity players. this is really the same situation.
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Old Sat Jan 29, 2005, 05:58pm
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Quote:
Since he is a V player he would not be in the book. How would you handle that?
A1 dunks 14 minutes before the game. Coach A attempts to buy his way out of the T by not putting A1 into the book at the 10 minute mark. How would you handle that?

Quote:
How can you Tee someone who is clearly not a member of the team? Do you Tee the home team if a spectator comes on the court and dunks. I think not.
I don't agree the V player is clearly not a member of the squad. If a spectator comes on the court chase him off. If he doesn't go have security kick him out.
Quote:

what if the varsity player dunks at half time when the officials are in the locker room? i was told we do not have jurisdiction on the varsity players. this is really the same situation.
Not the same at all. If the officials are in the locker room then they can't see the dunk.

BTW, not T'ing the kid up is fine too. But I wouldn't have a problem with the T because the dunk is such an extraordinarily stupid thing to do. Then he does it twice! But the 1 thing you can't do is ignore it.
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Old Sun Jan 30, 2005, 05:03am
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To me this is a real problem.

I hvae seen this a few times now.

Halftime of the JV game and the varsity boys take the home floor. Goofy music played, cheerleaders doing their thing, etc. Boys are warming up. JV officials off floor in locker room. Varsity officials are in the lockerroom dressing and doing pregame.

Invariably, some of the varsity guys are dunking.

I'm done with my half in the adjacent auxiliary gym (girls JV) and go to watch the other gym and see this conduct (as I am headed to the locker room with my partner to meet and to watch the varsity guys pregame).

What can I do? What can be done? Should someone stay on the floor? This is a pretty common occurance and seems designed specifically to let the home team do a warm up that they otherwise coudlnt do--replete with dunks.

But as an official, what do we do?

Clark
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Old Sun Jan 30, 2005, 05:32am
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Do we have to ask if he is eligible?

Seriously, here's the only justification that I believe could be used for issuing a technical foul to a varsity player during the jv warm-ups:
RULE 2 SECTION 8 OFFICIALS' ADDITIONAL DUTIES
The officials shall:
ART. 1 . . . Penalize unsporting conduct by any player, coach, substitute, team attendant or follower.
NOTE: The home management or game committee is responsible for spectator behavior, insofar as it can reasonably be expected to control the spectators. The officials may call fouls on either team if its supporters act in such a way as to interfere with the proper conduct of the game. Discretion must be used in calling such fouls, however, lest a team be unjustly penalized.



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