2 Man Mechanics Question

Future909 · #1 (**permalink**) Sat Dec 25, 2004, 04:31pm

Hi everyone,
Before I ask my question, let me explain my background just a little bit. Im going into my third year of Basketball Officiating and have started working with a new guy(new boss if you can say that in a different area). I have already been told by coaches, other refs, and atheletic directors that I am much more crisp and professional than most of the refs that have been doing this many years more than me. Now onto my question.
I have always been taught even when I was young and playing ball that the lead official always keeps the players to the left of them running up and down the court (not under the basket or out in the wing of the court obviously) but as players are running up and down the lead official is to the right of the players. Am I wrong and if so what is the correct positioning? The only reason I ask is because I am now told by this new guy (new boss) that it is not the case. Thats the way I have always started my games from the tip. Whatever team controls the tip, the official that has the players to the left of them is the lead. Please correct me if Im wrong.
Also if there is anyone in southern California that pays well, that needs experienced referees please let me know.

mick · #2 (**permalink**) Sat Dec 25, 2004, 04:56pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Future909
I have always been taught ... that the lead official always keeps the players to the left of them running up and down the court (not under the basket or out in the wing of the court obviously) but as players are running up and down the lead official is to the right of the players. Am I wrong and if so what is the correct positioning? The only reason I ask is because I am now told by this new guy (new boss) that it is not the case. Thats the way I have always started my games from the tip. Whatever team controls the tip, the official that has the players to the left of them is the lead. Please correct me if Im wrong.
Also if there is anyone in southern California that pays well, that needs experienced referees please let me know.

Future909,
Welcome to the forum.

Players to the left is a long obsolete mechanic.
Grab an officials manual and give it a looksee.

mick

Future909 · #3 (**permalink**) Sat Dec 25, 2004, 05:00pm

ok thanks. So pretty much just determine who is lead and trail prior to the tip for the first run? Thanks for the reply.

mick · #4 (**permalink**) Sat Dec 25, 2004, 05:14pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Future909
ok thanks. So pretty much just determine who is lead and trail prior to the tip for the first run? Thanks for the reply.

Future909,
I do not understand your statement.
The phrase, "Players to the left", is not found as a mechanic.
mick

tjones1 · #5 (**permalink**) Sat Dec 25, 2004, 05:22pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Future909
ok thanks. So pretty much just determine who is lead and trail prior to the tip for the first run? Thanks for the reply.

In 2-man (NFHS), the umpire is going to become lead no matter what and the R becomes trail. I always get my mind set before tip (If I'm the umpire)...."Ok if white gets it I'm going to my left, if blue gets it I'm going to my right."

mick · #6 (**permalink**) Sat Dec 25, 2004, 05:33pm

Quote:

Originally posted by tjones1

Quote:

Originally posted by Future909
ok thanks. So pretty much just determine who is lead and trail prior to the tip for the first run? Thanks for the reply.

In 2-man (NFHS), the umpire is going to become lead no matter what and the R becomes trail. I always get my mind set before tip (If I'm the umpire)...."Ok if white gets it I'm going to my left, if blue gets it I'm going to my right."

Often, but not necessarily.
Sometimes the umpire goes with the ball and the referee goes away from the ball.
mick

Rich · #7 (**permalink**) Sat Dec 25, 2004, 05:35pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Future909
Hi everyone,
Before I ask my question, let me explain my background just a little bit. Im going into my third year of Basketball Officiating and have started working with a new guy(new boss if you can say that in a different area). I have already been told by coaches, other refs, and atheletic directors that I am much more crisp and professional than most of the refs that have been doing this many years more than me. Now onto my question.
I have always been taught even when I was young and playing ball that the lead official always keeps the players to the left of them running up and down the court (not under the basket or out in the wing of the court obviously) but as players are running up and down the lead official is to the right of the players. Am I wrong and if so what is the correct positioning? The only reason I ask is because I am now told by this new guy (new boss) that it is not the case. Thats the way I have always started my games from the tip. Whatever team controls the tip, the official that has the players to the left of them is the lead. Please correct me if Im wrong.
Also if there is anyone in southern California that pays well, that needs experienced referees please let me know.

The side of the court you work on is dictated by the position you take on (1) the jump, (2) the throw-in, and (3) the free-throw. You are always on the opposite side of the court as your partner. You NEVER, in 2-man, cross the court during a live ball.

Old, old (at least more than 10-12+ years out of date) had the lead with the players on his left running down the court. This was called the Cadillac and finally someone realized it makes no difference if the lead is left or right as long as the players are boxed in.

tjones1 · #8 (**permalink**) Sat Dec 25, 2004, 05:37pm

Quote:

Originally posted by mick

Quote:

Originally posted by tjones1

Quote:

Originally posted by Future909
ok thanks. So pretty much just determine who is lead and trail prior to the tip for the first run? Thanks for the reply.

In 2-man (NFHS), the umpire is going to become lead no matter what and the R becomes trail. I always get my mind set before tip (If I'm the umpire)...."Ok if white gets it I'm going to my left, if blue gets it I'm going to my right."

Often, but not necessarily.
Sometimes the umpire goes with the ball and the referee goes away from the ball.
mick

Ahhh yes, this would happen if a team gains possession in its backcourt. The umpire goes with the ball and the R takes lead.

mick · #9 (**permalink**) Sat Dec 25, 2004, 06:07pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Rich Fronheiser

The side of the court you work on is dictated by the position you take on (1) the jump, (2) the throw-in, and (3) the free-throw. You are always on the opposite side of the court as your partner. You NEVER, in 2-man, cross the court during a live ball.

Rich,
We often work help mechanics with the lead crossing over for strong-side mechanics.
mick

Rich · #10 (**permalink**) Sat Dec 25, 2004, 06:17pm

Quote:

Originally posted by mick

Quote:

Originally posted by Rich Fronheiser

The side of the court you work on is dictated by the position you take on (1) the jump, (2) the throw-in, and (3) the free-throw. You are always on the opposite side of the court as your partner. You NEVER, in 2-man, cross the court during a live ball.

Rich,
We often work help mechanics with the lead crossing over for strong-side mechanics.
mick

OK, OK, what I mean is that the officials don't switch sides PERMANENTLY during a live ball. Even if you go strong-side, you are coming back once the ball goes the other way. The trail doesn't switch sides with the lead....

mick · #11 (**permalink**) Sat Dec 25, 2004, 06:26pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Rich Fronheiser
The trail doesn't switch sides with the lead....

Rich,
I have heard it done that the trail may cross over the top once the Lead goes strongside.
Though I have never done it, it is referred to as the Lead forcing the switch.

mick

Future909 · #12 (**permalink**) Sat Dec 25, 2004, 07:22pm

Okay thanks for your responses guys, I just finished reading a officiating manual 2004 edition and it says that at the tip off the Umpire will become lead and the referee while tossing the ball becomes trail. Thanks for the responses.

PA Official · #13 (**permalink**) Sun Dec 26, 2004, 05:08pm

No....it states that at the tip the Umpire goes with the ball, not the lead.

Just think, if the ball is tipped 30 feet backwards, and the Umpire automatically goes to lead, who has the ball?

Rich · #14 (**permalink**) Sun Dec 26, 2004, 05:16pm

Quote:

Originally posted by PA Official
No....it states that at the tip the Umpire goes with the ball, not the lead.

Just think, if the ball is tipped 30 feet backwards, and the Umpire automatically goes to lead, who has the ball?

The referee?

bob jenkins · #15 (**permalink**) Sun Dec 26, 2004, 06:36pm

Quote:

Originally posted by PA Official
No....it states that at the tip the Umpire goes with the ball, not the lead.

Just think, if the ball is tipped 30 feet backwards, and the Umpire automatically goes to lead, who has the ball?

The R will hae the ball, unless there's serious defensive pressure (which happens very rarely on the tip). If there's pressure, U moves with the ball and R becomes lead.