This happened is boy's varsity game the other night. I will try to describe so it makes sense. A1 has ball in frontcourt. B1 taps it away (toward half court). Both chase, B1 dives for ball and retrieves it with half of his body in his frontcourt and half in his backcourt. Before he picked it up it bounced once in his frontcourt. From his position on the floor he passes to B2 in his backcourt.
Seems to meet the 4 criteria for a backcourt violation, except not sure if there must be team control before the ball achieves frontcourt status. Opinions please.

Where was his feet when it established control?

He was laying on the floor, waist up in his frontcourt, waist down in his backcourt.

I say he can pass in backcourt with no violation.

I agree ~ no violation.

There's no team control until he's on the floor, holding the ball. When he does, he's in the BC.

No violation.

The ball never has frontcourt status here.

The player catches the ball while touching both the frontcourt and the backcourt. The player has backcourt status when he touches both, so the ball has backcourt status as well. Team control is established at this point.

The player then bounces the ball. This is a dribble, so the status of the ball is governed by the "three points" rule. All of the player and the ball need to be in the frontcourt for the ball to attain frontcourt status during a dribble. This doesn't happen.

The player now passes to a teammate in the backcourt. No violation.

Simple rule here and it applies most of the time

If youre not completely in the front court then youre in the back court.

Same is true if youre completely Inbounds then youre not OOB.


My suggestion. dont make things harder than they are

BktBallRef, that is what I was not sure of. I knew his status was still backcourt since he was not completely over. I just did not know that the fact that the ball bounced in the frontcourt before he got control made a difference.
1st two point for backcourt violation are team control and ball must achieve frontcourt status. Question was must control come 1st?

The team control must exist when the ball has FC status before it can be a violation.

Only then do the last to touch/first to to element matter.

Think about it this way.
On a throw in, A1 throws a bounce pass to A2, who is standing in the back court. The pass first bounces in the front court before A2 catches it in the BC. No violation.
Team control must be established in the front court for the violation to occur.

Not true. A1, inbounds in the backcourt, throws a bounce pass which first bounces in the frontcourt, then is caught by A2 in the backcourt. This is a violation, even though A never had control in the frontcourt.

Until there's team control by A, there is, in effect, no A backcourt or frontcourt. So the ball bounced in B's frontcourt, but that's not A's backcourt, until A has team control.

A1 has established team control by virtue of having player control. When the ball hits the frontcourt on a bounce pass, the ball gains fc status and team control is maintained by A. Thus, team control has now been established in the front court.

Lotto: I'm not sure what these players did (maybe A1 put a good spin on the ball so it hit in frontcourt and bounded into the backcourt. Even so, Team A (nor Team B) does not have control on a throw-in, until one A player gains player control. So, it can theoretically bounce from front to back to front to back (being tipped or batted) and still not be in any Team's control until a player holds or dribbles the ball. There is no frontcourt status just because the ball bounced there. No violation in your play.

No, no, no, no, no. This is not a BC violation. There was no team control when the ball bounced in the FC.

nine01c,
I think Lotto's play is not referring to a throwin, but the ball is already inbounds.
"Inbounds" here is an adjective, not a verb. :D

I read it the same way you did, the first time.

I think you misread Lotto's play. The pass originated from a player holding the ball inbounds...not a throwin.

Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. This is a BC violation. A1 threw the ball from a location inbounds in the backcourt. If A1 threw the ball, he had player and team control on the throw.

If you read the inbounds as a verb then A1 was what A2 caught. Hope A1 was not too heavy.

Yes, it is a violation; but there is also team control established in the front court, even if there was never player control established in the front court.

Good job, Snaqwells.
Lotto, you're also incorrect on this statement: "The ball never has frontcourt status here." JLC specified, "Before he picked it up it bounced once in his frontcourt."
In NFHS play the ball has a status of its own if a player is not holding or dribbling it. 4-4-3

You're right...I misread the original play. (I thought *he* bounced the ball in the frontcourt, not *it* bounced in the frontcourt.)

My error. His description made it sound like a throw-in to me, which would seem like a legit interp to me.

What if team A has possession, ball is tipped by B2 hit's A1's leg goes back court, A2 retrieve's it? or team A in control, both A2 & B2 deflect the ball backcourt, & A2 retrieves it? thanks!

In your first scenario, it's a violation.

In the second, if both players' touched it simultaneously, I would call a violation. But I've never read a specific inerp on such a play.