Ok before we start, I didn't see the play. I heard about it third hand and thought I would run it by all of you here.

1pt game Team A scores to go ahead with 3 seconds left on the clock. Team A has not been warned for delay at any point during the game. After they make the basket they grab the ball and hold it. They don't allow Team B to get the ball and time runs out. Team A is the victor.

What would you do. A fellow official in our area called me this morning to ask what I would have done...I had a couple ideas.. I will post them later

ok guys and gals Have at it.... and happy feasting LOL :D

That's an obvious technical foul. What could be the question here? :confused:

There is no warning for that delay, especially with less than 5 seconds to go. I would assess a T.

If Team B had a player available and I felt that A did it "unintentionally", delay of game warning on Team A. That is interfering with the ball after a goal whic is 4-46-3. Give Team B an endline-run throw-in. The only thing I'm not sure about is how much time to put back on the clock. If a Team B player was right there, I'd probably assume that he would have grabbed it immediately and give them 3 seconds.

If Team A did it intentionally, technical foul.

Z




[Edited by zebraman on Dec 22nd, 2004 at 11:45 AM]

I know what I would have done
 

Chuck,
I agree with you, I would have the T as an unsporting act. The reason I posted it is this. The guys doing the game did nothing....

There is a case book play that talks about reaching through the boundary in an obvious attempt to keep the ball from becoming alive in the closing seconds of a game. It is an automatic technical foul without any warning.

final seconds of the game I'd T for delay of game, no warning necessary in this case.

Don't get me wrong, I agree that a T is in order, but for delay of game you have to have a warning first don't you ?? There is no provision that allows for a delay of game T without the warning is there? If it is a T it is the unsporting variety correct??

Re: I know what I would have done
 

I hope this was a middle school girl's game.

BITS nailed it.

BOUNDARY-PLANE WARNING – LAST SECOND TACTIC
9.2.11 SITUATION: A1 is out of bounds for a throw-in. B1 reaches through the boundary plane and knocks the ball out of A1's hands. Team B has not been warned previously for a throw-in plane infraction.

RULING: B1 is charged with a technical foul and it also results in the official having a team warning recorded and reported to the head coach. (4-46-1; 10-1-10)

COMMENT: In situations with the clock running and five or less seconds left in the game, a throw-in plane violation or interfering with the ball following a goal should be ignored if its only purpose is to stop the clock. However, if the tactic in any way interferes with the thrower's efforts to make a throw-in, a technical foul for delay shall be called even though no previous warning had been issued. In this situation, if the official stopped the clock and issued a team warning, it would allow the team to benefit from the tactic.

A warning would not be necessary in this situation as it was clearly an unsporting act for A1 to hold the ball intentionally thus preventing B1 from inbounding the ball. Some might try to issue a warning and put three seconds back on the clock which would give Team A an advantage in setting up their defense for the inbound pass.

I believe that a technical foul should be called (9.2.11) on A1 for a delay of game there is no warning for this per the case book referenced.

T and put 3 seconds on the clock. The T is not for delay of game but for unsportsmanlike conduct.

Cam -

Well, technically speaking, you are to be corrected....

Per 9.2.11 - COMMENT: In situations with the clock running and five or less seconds left in the game, a throw-in plane violation or interfering with the ball following a goal should be ignored if its only purpose is to stop the clock. However, if the tactic in any way interferes with the thrower's efforts to make a throw-in, a technical foul for delay shall be called even though no previous warning had been issued. In this situation, if the official stopped the clock and issued a team warning, it would allow the team to benefit from the tactic.

Thanks BBR
 

BBR,
Thanks for the reference. To answer other questions, no actually this was a varsity contest. Makes one wonder sometimes....

There's also 10-3-6a - "preventing the ball from being made live promptly or from being put in play"

10-3-6-a; delaying the game by acts such as..Preventing the ball from being made live promptly or from being put into play.
Two free throws & ball for division line throw in

While your citation is indeed correct, this situation also falls under 10-3-6a as was just mentioned by tonyp and FrankHtown. That was I was basing my ruling on but didn't take the time to locate the rule.\

So, there are two rules which can cover this situation. Both have exactly the same outcome so it doesn't really matter which one you choose.

Not exactly.

If the game goes to OT, by using the delay T the team now has a warning in the book as well, that may come into play in the OT.;)

Except that you DONT GIVE THE WARNING. So it's six of one, half a dozen of the other.

Sure you would, you warn after the T for breaking the plane and contacting the ball, I'd see no reason to NOT do it in this situation.

Of course we could double dip the kid and call it an unsporting T AND give them a delay of game warning.:D

Yep, you do.

If B1 slaps the ball while thrower A1 has it, it's a technical foul. It's also a warning if no warning has been previously issued. The scorer should be instructed to write it in the book and the coach made aware of it.

Duh...

Sorry. Too many gingerbread cookies with pretty little sprinkles.

third hand knowledge is not necessarily good knowledge
 

Ok in the original post I mentioned that this play arrived at my doorstep third hand...well upon further review some facts have changed....Keep in mind that this is now 2nd hand knowledge LOL (which is much better than 3rd hand I might add).. Team A is down by 5 they hit a 3 to bring it to withing 2 with 3 seconds left...it is Team A that indeed grabs the ball hoping for a delay call so that B cannot run out the clock without inbounding the ball...
So the officials just let A stand there with the ball and did nothing, which I believe was correct :D

Re: third hand knowledge is not necessarily good knowledge
 

That's OK cmathews,

It made for a much better scenario the way you incorrectly posted it the first time. :D

In all seriousness, your original post is the kind of post that I get the most benefit from on this board. The things that rarely happen, but that we may run into eventually. Having thought about them because of this board instead of being surprised by them on the floor is a benefit.

Z

BZ
I agree completely....However we have to be able to recall the discussion quickly enough so as not to stand under the basket and filter through all we read here LOL :D

You mean you don't have copies of the forum in your back pocket ready to consult at a moments notice!!:)