Tipsy tipoffs

[Jimgolf]

We had a ref yesterday who was having fun with the fans during the two CYO games he worked. He was apparently making humorous comments to the crowd about various calls, but I couldn't hear what he was saying. Two of the coaches said they smelled alcohol on his breath, and he seemed to be going out of his way to avoid game management (me). This is a D3 experienced ref doing HS level CYO games.

Meanwhile, I thought this was the best reffing crew we've had in my memory. They kept some close, physical games from getting out of control, and were professional in every way (signalling crisply, using precise mechanics, running the floor, getting into good position) except for the banter with the crowd.

Although CYO forbids alcohol at its games, I saw no real reason to look into it further, since I didn't personally smell anything and his performance was superior. Should I have looked into it further or spoken to him about it? If your partner was a little tipsy, would you say something to him or report it to an assignor?

[gordon30307]

Lucky for you noone got hurt. If he was impaired from a liability point you could have been in trouble. Plaintifs Attorney: Mr Defendant: " Is it not true that two coaches smelled alcohol on his breath". Defendant: Yes Paintifs Attorney: Why didn't you investigate further. Defendant: They were doing a great job. Plantifs Attorney: So when the official tripped and fell on the player and broke his arm that was a good job? You rolled the dice and got lucky. Also "bantering to the crowd" is unprofessional. I wouldn't expect a college official to do that. That should have tipped you off that you may have a problem.

[Jimgolf]

Originally posted by gordon30307
That should have tipped you off that you may have a problem.

I agree, but what should I have done? I'm hardly qualified to administer a field sobriety test. To my eyes, he seemed sober. The coaches' comments may have sprung from disagreeing with one of his calls. Suppose he in fact had a beer or two before the games. Is this enough to take action? If so what action?

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by Jimgolf

I agree, but what should I have done? I'm hardly qualified to administer a field sobriety test. To my eyes, he seemed sober. The coaches' comments may have sprung from disagreeing with one of his calls. Suppose he in fact had a beer or two before the games. Is this enough to take action? If so what action?

I believe there are medical conditions that can cause our breath to have an alchohol type smell to it. I would say there's not much you can do if you don't believe the guy's been drinking. OTOH if you're convinced he had been drinking then you should probably go talk to him about it and see if you can get him off the floor. In your case when it seems you disagreed with the coaches opinion you might have said something to the ref as well, just to convince yourself one way or the other.

BTW, I don't think I would include "banterng with the crowd" at a CYO game as solid evidence the guy's been drinking.

[gordon30307]

Originally posted by Jimgolf

I agree, but what should I have done? I'm hardly qualified to administer a field sobriety test. To my eyes, he seemed sober. The coaches' comments may have sprung from disagreeing with one of his calls. Suppose he in fact had a beer or two before the games. Is this enough to take action? If so what action?

I would have took the official aside and in a diplomatic fashion asked him if he was drinking. If he said no play on. If he said yes I wouldn't allow him to officiate. Being a college Ref. he should know better. If he was embarassed, well that's his problem. Just my opinion.

[rockyroad]

Originally posted by Dan_ref
[B

BTW, I don't think I would include "banterng with the crowd" at a CYO game as solid evidence the guy's been drinking. [/B]

I'm not even sure I would include "bantering with the crwod at a CYO game" as unprofessional conduct...nothing wrong with having some fun at some of our games - long as it doesn't interfere with doing the job...

[Mark Padgett]

Hey - I've worked lots of games "under the influence" - of Juulie, that is.

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by rockyroad

I'm not even sure I would include "bantering with the crwod at a CYO game" as unprofessional conduct...nothing wrong with having some fun at some of our games - long as it doesn't interfere with doing the job... [/B]

yeah, i agree.

[gordon30307]

Originally posted by Dan_ref

yeah, i agree. [/B]

I'm all for having fun as well. I have talked to individuals in the crowd. However, you have to be careful about you say. If someone takes it the wrong way or misunderstands you it can cause problems. In all of the college games that I have attended I have never seen a college official talk to anyone in the crowd. Just an abservation.

[rockyroad]

Originally posted by gordon30307
[B
In all of the college games that I have attended I have never seen a college official talk to anyone in the crowd. Just an abservation. [/B]

Seriously??? Never?? Not during time-outs? Not during pre-game or half-time warm-ups?? I would have to say that that is hard to believe...there is nothing wrong with talking with fans - as you said, one must be careful about what is said, and it absolutley can not be an adversarial conversation, nor can it detract from doing your job, but never??? Wow...

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by gordon30307

I'm all for having fun as well. I have talked to individuals in the crowd. However, you have to be careful about you say. If someone takes it the wrong way or misunderstands you it can cause problems. In all of the college games that I have attended I have never seen a college official talk to anyone in the crowd. Just an abservation. [/B]

I don't think we're talking about a college game here.
I think it's cyo.

And like rocky sez, there's nothing wrong with quickly exchanging pleasant comments with fans during pregame or half time.

[gordon30307]

Originally posted by rockyroad

Seriously??? Never?? Not during time-outs? Not during pre-game or half-time warm-ups?? I would have to say that that is hard to believe...there is nothing wrong with talking with fans - as you said, one must be careful about what is said, and it absolutley can not be an adversarial conversation, nor can it detract from doing your job, but never??? Wow... [/B]

No never. It takes a long time and hard work to get to that level. College Officials are vey well paid. They are evaluated by observers for post season assignments etc. It just wouldn't look good if they weren't totally focused on the game. Talking to spectators is not part of the job.

[ChuckElias]

I am certainly not at the top of the collegiate ranks, but I have, on occasion, exchanged brief pleasantries with a fan seated courtside during pre-game warmups.

Once the game starts I don't talk to or react to the fans. But I don't see anything wrong with a brief comment to a fan, particularly if somebody asks me a reasonable question, which actually happens quite a bit.

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by gordon30307
No never. It takes a long time and hard work to get to that level. College Officials are vey well paid. They are evaluated by observers for post season assignments etc. It just wouldn't look good if they weren't totally focused on the game. Talking to spectators is not part of the job.

I would have to disagree with you on this one. One of the situations that are different is that the fans are usually not that close to the court as they are at the other levels when talking about D1. I saw Tom Rucker come back and say something to a fan when he was going off the court after the Big Ten Championship game. Ed Hightower has said things going off the court to fans. I have even seen the other officials say hi or comment to fans when they walk by during pregame and even sometimes timeouts. Now they are not as close to the fans at many levels, but I have seen them talk. It is very little, but to say never is not true at all.

Peace

[Back In The Saddle]

I'm at a D1 game last year and this fan in the front row of the high dollar courtside padded chair seats with catered everything is standing, pointing, yelling, screaming and cursing this ref. He looks like he's just livid about a no call on some rough bumping down low.

During a break the ref goes over and talks to the guy. In about 20 seconds, the ref and this guy are laughing about something and the fan is seated and quiet the rest of the game.

I wish I knew what he said.