I am going thru NFHS Test and am looking at #40 and having tough time with it..at least finding a rule reference that would clarify..
I say T
"#40 - Ball becomes dead when B1 touches A1's ft try while the ball is on upward flight outside the cylinder.."

first, ball would not become dead because B1 crossed lane line before try hit rim or ended, violation would only be penalized if try missed..2004-06 handbook shows ft try ends when the attempt touches the floor <b>or any player,</b> so I would say True because ball doesn't become dead until it is touched..that is what causes ball to become dead..now I want to find rule reference that really covers this situation..

Or am I wrong on the T/F?

The answer is true.

The question is describing goaltending.

Can't have goaltending when a try is on its upward flight, can we?

Not if it's a try for field goal, but we can if it's a try for a free throw.

9-12
A player shall not commit goaltending. Goaltending occurs when a player touches the ball during a field-goal try or tap while it is in its downward flight entirely above the basket ring level and has the possibility of entering the basket in flight, or an opponent of the free thrower touches the ball outside the cylinder during a free-throw attempt.

Ahh, a clear-cut case of RTFM :D Has the definition always read that way? It's the first time I've noticed the bit about goaltending on a free-throw.

Chuck:

It looks like I am going to have to climb up into the attic to answer this one.

MTD, Sr.

Stick with Alleve, my friend. :)

I don't think it's been GT for very long. I think I remember when the rule was changed to include "touching a FT outside the cylinder" was added to the definition of goaltending; so it was probably within the last 10 years or so. I'm just guessing, tho.

MTD, it ain't worth it for that. It has likely read that way for years and I'm just really unobservant.

However, if you're willing to go to the attic, I have a couple of historical questions. I'm writing up some stuff on the jump ball rule. When I was a kid we would jump all held balls. What year did that change (i.e., when did the AP arrive)? Well beyond my memory, a jump was held after every basket. When did that change? Any interesting reminiscences? :D

The answer is True.

A player cannot touch the ball on its' upward or downward flight on a FT if in the officials' judgement, they believe that the ball has a chance of going into the basket.

It is a Technical foul (Rule 10 Sec 3 Art 10).

does this ever happen
 

Has anyone acually seen or called goaltending during a free throw attempt?

don't see how it could happen with NFHS RULES because they can't leave the lane line till it hits the rim..but stranger things have happened...i myself have not seen it even attempted :)

It can only happen if the defense does it. This is b/c the ball does not become dead during the FT when the defense commits a lane violation.

FT try is released.

B1 steps into the lane.

Delayed violation

B1 jumps and touches ball before ball touches rim.

Goaltending -- award 1 point
Tecnical Foul -- shoot two additional FTs

If the offense attempted to GT the FT, the play would be dead immediately when the player stepped into the lane, therefore the GT would be ignored. No T.

Actually, I can think of a few ways where it <em>could</em> be possible for the offense to commit a live ball GT on a FT.

If there is a defensive lane line violation, a subsequent offensive player in the lane is NOT a violation. The ball remains live until the try is made or missed. That offensive player could still commit GT.

There are also a few FT shooters who line up non-center on the FT line. It could be possible for a player on the lane to touch the ball without having their feet cross the line before they touch the ball.

Good point, Camron. I was assuming that the player doing the goaltending would be the first one into the lane, but that's not a valid assumption. Nice catch.

Except that 4-22 specifically says "... or an OPPONENT of the free thrower touches the ball ..." ;)

I know the rule book just says player, but how can an offensive player commit a goaltending?

Every lob pass for a dunk would qualify as goaltending.

Goaltending can not occur on a lob "pass". Goaltending can only be called during a field goal try or tap.

Good point, Bob. I was assuming that Camron had read the rule, but that's not a valid assumption. Nice catch. ;)

So. . . I was right in the first place, but for the wrong reason?

You are assuming shot or pass in many cases. The offense is trying to put the ball in the basket what advantage is gained by goaltending?

OK, then what do we have IF a teammate of the FT shooter does touch the ball outside of the cynlinder? The try would end at that point (definition of FT ending) so at a minimum, it would be a FT violation since the try ended without being successful or hitting the rim. Is that all?

As Bob pointed out, it appears it is NOT a GT violation.

Since B1 violated first, should we have offensive GT and then give a replacement FT for B1's lane violation?

I'm not sure I get what you're saying - but advantage has nothing to do with it. GT by rule can only occur on a shot.

You're more likely to have BI on a lob pass.

Actually, I think it is (or should be). IIRC:

1) Pre-1997, the rule read that anyone could GT on a FT.

2) The rule was changed so that players couldn't enter the lane until the ball hit the basket or backboard.

3) The GT rule was changed to refer only to defensive players, since the ball was immediately dead if an offensive player entered the lane (either an offensive violation or a double-violation).

4) The FT rule was changed to penalize only the defense if the defense entered first, followed by the offense.

At this point, the GT rule should have been changed back so that either team could GT on a FT, but the change wasn't made.

IMO, an oversight by the rules committee. Not of major concern because I've never seen nor heard of GT on a FT, much less by the offense, much less following a lane violation by the defense.