I have what may end up being a stupid question, but what the heck!

In the back of the Rules book is the signal for a "hand-check." Is there ANYTHING in the rulebook about the specifics of what a hand-check is?

The word(s) hand-check do not appear in the rule book. It only appears in one place in the case book.

10.6.1F. Play: A1 begins a drive toward the basket with a quick dribble and step to evade B1. B1 momentarily hand checks A1 and forces A1 to take a wider approach. Ruling: A hand-checking foul on B1. Even though the contact was only momentary it did give B1 an opportunity to get into better position and forced A1 to take a different route toward the basket.

Hey Paul - how are things down in the southern part of the state? Here's some info on the handcheck mechanic.

We used it for a ton of years, then a few years ago the signal was eliminated and we were instructed to use the illegal use of hands signal for a handcheck.

It really caused some problems because coaches thought we felt a player got "hacked" when obviously he didn't. Some refs used the pushing signal because it was more representative. Upon numerous requests from refs, the signal was reinstated.

Now, if we could only get signals approved for "over the back" and "reaching", we would reduce coach yelling by 20% ;)

You'd have to have two over-the-back signals, and two for reaching. One each would be for the legal movement which involves no contact, and one each for the actual fouls. What you said a few days ago is true: Many people think "over the back" means that any play from behind is illegal even if it involves no contact. I've seen parents yell about "over the back," even when the ball was so far behind their little Jonnie that the supposed fouler had to reach back to get it!

So you could have one signal for the legal move like how we signal a "tip" or "all ball", and another for the foul. Think the rules committee would go for it?

Julie - I think you're missing my point. The winky face should have been a tip-off. There are no such fouls as over-the-back and reaching, although every coach, player and parent think there are.

We're doing good here! (Did I tell you we finally got electricity put in the house?) ;)

Thanks for the comments on hand-checking. I rarely see it used and don't use it myself. Seems the other signals, illegal use, pushing and so forth handle most instances. And then there are all the non-approved signals officals use. I see the "forearm" signal quite a bit.

Quote:

We're doing good here! (Did I tell you we finally got electricity put in the house?) ;)

That must take one hell of a big hamster ;)

Quote:

Thanks for the comments on hand-checking. I rarely see it used and don't use it myself. Seems the other signals, illegal use, pushing and so forth handle most instances. And then there are all the non-approved signals officals use. I see the "forearm" signal quite a bit.

After umpteen years, I finally rid myself of the habit of keeping my fists clenched on a block call and now use the proper mechanic. However, I still find myself "swinging a forearm" away from my chest to indicate a PC foul in which the dribbler pushed the defender away.



[Edited by Mark Padgett on Dec 27th, 2000 at 04:43 PM]

I don't think those "tip" and "all ball" signals are supposed to be used.

Sorry, Mark, I can't seem to make the little "faces" work for me, so I ignore them in other messages. I did catch the irony (sarcasm?) in your post and was trying to respond in kind...

Bob, I never use the tip signal, I know its not legit, and I;m trying to be very, very legit.

Anyway, I was just kidding. I think I'll spend the next fifteen minutes trying to \get cute little smiley faces into my posts.

juulie

good one
 

juulie,
Welcome to the world of the misunderstood. ;)

mick

You should at least chided mark for misspelling your name! :) ;) :( !

use of the "tip" signal...
 

Here's a situation...

I'm at trail and I see a quick pass to the post area. A1 passes the ball and B1 tips the pass. The ball then goes untouched OOB. Isn't this an appropriate time to let your partner know that the ball was tipped by the defender?

This "mechanic" has saved me several times in those bang-bang pass situations. When my partner sees that I have a tipped ball, he knows to give it back to the offense.

And, yes, I know that this is not a "real" mechanic.:)

Thoughts?

When I'm communicating with the table or making a call, I use the proper mechanics. But I don't have a problem with a signal such as the hand tip as a communication tool between officials. When we have less than one minute to play in a quarter, we raise one finger to acknowledge that we are aware of the clock. That's not in the book either. Some guys tap their head, which I think looks really stupid.

I don't use the psuedo signals such as "full TO," "not closely guarded," "kicking the ball," or "she got all ball."

I found some notes that were taken last year at a meeting. I think it was the infamous, "Get a clue" speech that was highly talked about on another board. But one of the points was never to use the tip signal since it has an ambiguous meaning in basketball.

I agree on not using the tip signal (or any other) to indicate there was no foul and that the defender got all ball. However, I do use it on an OOB call to indicate that a shot was tipped coming out of the shooters hand and that the ball should go back to the shooting team. I usually accompany that with a verbal explanation indicating the same.

Re: use of the
 

Big Dave,
On my partners Line, if I see a tip, I just stand there like a stump, unless he looks at me, and then I give a direction.
The only tip I give is a "Foul tip", and only if someone is on base.
mick

I agree.... The less you "call/signal" of the unnecessary the better off you will be...

As officials, we are over criticized and underappreciated. Why should we go out of our way to explain the call? There is a sect that will disagree regardless which way we make our call.

Our association does not encourage the tip signal or other non-approved mechanics for the following reason. Take this scenario, A1 passes ball to A2 from trail's area (tableside) to the weak side (skip pass). B1, guarding A1, tips the ball and trail signals a tip using the tip signal. The lead official doesn't see the initial tip but the ball hits the floor and glances off of A2's foot (unseen by the trail official and benches) and the lead official comes out and awards the ball to B. Coach of team A immediately begins the "help him/her out" call because he saw the tip signal. By making the "tip signal" you have already pre-judged that the ball should remain with the passing team if an out of bounds play occurs even though you may not be able to see the whole play to conclusion. Our association preaches that you should give your partner the opportunity to make a call and then if necessary, i.e. you saw a tip that you believe your partner may not have seen, blow your whistle, get together with your partner and get it right. The tip isn't as bad as the "all ball" signal. How many times do you see an official make the "all ball" signal only to have the dreaded double whistle and the other official signal a foul!!!