Regardless of the Knight incident, this man is an excellent referee. 6 Final Fours, 3 National Championship Games. He is not publicity hungry. The Big Ten should have backed him up in the Knight deal.

Last night, he gave Barnes the first T, heard him out and gave him a chance to be quiet. Barnes not only continued but clearly said the magic word. Teddy Valentine had no choice, he made the ejection signal and quietly walked away. Excellent officiating. Barnes was on their case the entire 2nd half.

I totally agree with you in how Ted V handled Barnes last night. He gave Barnes more then enough chances to get himself under control, but when push came to shove Valentine had no choice but do what he did, and it was the correct thing to do.

In regards to Knight incident, the Big Ten should have stood behind Valentine more in that situation. Plus, one of the other officials had a great opportunity to step in and help Valentine and passed on it, and thought that was not right either.

Plus, the other thing that I liked about last night in the way Valentine handled things was the way he administered the ejection and the 2nd "T" to Barnes. Valentine was not "show boaty" about it, nor did he try to show Barnes up either. Valentine just quietly signaled the 2nd "T" and calmly pointed Barnes to the locker room.

Good Job Ted on a job well done and correct route taken.

Stop defending him please
 

Valentine is quoted in newspapers all over the country this morning as saying to Mouton upon being quetion for the cause after the fifth foul

"Shut the F--- up, this isn't the NBA"

alternatively the quote is

"Shut up, this isn't the f------ NBA"

Now, let's assume that Valentine has never missed as call in his entire life nor ever been suspeneded nor ever had his call publicly criticized by a conference.

He should be banned for life from officiating anywhere for saying that to a player. Nothing less is adequate.

That, gentlemen, is an utterly unpardonable sin. He has repeatedly let his mouth get in his way over the years.

Now, it is time for him to go forever.

Re: Stop defending him please
 

And hopefully the same will be with you.

Golly, was iIwrong to write out the
 

newspaper quote?

Do you condone his use of such language?

Was he right to say that? wow!

Should I go for telling the truth?

Any player who talked like that to an official that way would be ejected. There is no reason to talk that way to players. I'm sure he would not let players talk to him that way and he should not talk that way to them.

Assuming Mouton or so-called writer is telling the truth
 

First of all, Judge roy, don't get personal with me. Second, today is not only the first that I'm hearing about it, but whomever quoted Valentine must have bionic ears. Why? because CBS has made no mention of this in either game. In other words, either it didn't happen or somebody thought they heard something and it's a non-story. The former is clearly the case. Considering the reputation that Valentine has been given, if this was even remotely true, he would be fired immediately. No news outlet or paper has reported this. It's not even on the Internet. Don't waste my time with a fake news story. Bottom line, Barnes didn't give Valentine any choice and he used the magic words. Valentine did his job and walked away. Excellent officiating.

Don't put words in my mouth
 

I am an assistant high school basketball coach. We don't even allow our players to talk to the officials. So why would I condone officials cursing at my players? Clearly I wouldn't. But since our players don't say anything to the officials then they would never have reason to curse at one of our players right? If Valentine did it, clearly I wouldn't condone it. Not only, however, has no story been reported, it's not true.

The Dallas Morning News quoted him as saying "Shut the [expletive] up, you're not in the NBA." You can read the article here http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont....c53d278d.html.

Dear BushRef
 

That was that coach and that team, which was clearly undisciplined and OC. That's not us. And the rule is strictly obeyed on our squad. We assistants don't even talk to the officials. We play in the toughest conference in New Jersey (Watchung Conference). My first year, not only did we win the State Championship but we also won the Sportsmanship Award which was presented to us by the Local Referee's Board. Both the championship and sportsmanship banner hang up in our gym.

Uh, just because it was in the newspaper doesn't necessarily mean that it's true. Especially a hometown, biased newspaper. Probably the only two people that know for sure what was said were Mouton and Valentine. And I haven't heard Valentine's side (and probably never will). Until I do,......

Re: Dear Redoubtable1
 

Teddy's Comment
 

Assuming it is true that Ted V actually said that to Moulton what do you feel should happen to him?

Re: Dear BushRef
 

http://www.stopstart.freeserve.co.uk.../jump_clap.gif

Good job Coach.

Peace

Re: Teddy's Comment
 

Straight answer? I'd really want to know EVERY single word that Mouton used before I'd even try to answer that question. If Mouton was crying and whining at Valentine, maybe Valentine did him a favor by saying that to him instead of Ting him up. Anybody that thinks that today's D1 games don't have a lot of F-shots contained in them really hasn't been paying much attention, imo. As long as they're being used as adjectives, aren't screamed out, and aren't being used to belittle or denigrate an official, I think that they're pretty much accepted anymore. It's the old story. If they can't hear it in the stands, and you're not trying to make me look bad,.....

According to the Houston Chronicle "Mouton asked Valentine to explain to him the nature of the foul and two sources said the official replied by cursing Mouton"

http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/front/2470491

Re: Teddy's Comment
 

First of all, after reading the story, its sounds to me like this allegation is all hear-say.

If he did indeed say those words i don't think he should be fired, would a coach be fired for saying this to an official??? A coach would get ejected, so I feel in order to keep the penalties similar, he should either be fined his game fee, or suspended for one game. Nothing more.

From the article.
 

<b>He fouled out with 2:09 remaining.

Mouton asked Valentine to explain to him the nature of the foul and two sources said the official replied by cursing Mouton.

"It was a tough call at that point in the game," Mouton said. "I was playing my heart out, and it hurt because I wouldn't be around to help my team win the game." </b>

For one, this is not the NBA. What is a player even doing talking to an official at this level? Does anyone remember Rasheed Wallace getting the amount of Ts he does now at the NBA. Does anyone remember the Ron Artest given the St. John's crowd the finger when he was fouled out of a game? Or any crowd for that matter when he played in the Big East?

If that is what this is all about, then Valentine did him a favor and not T'ing his behind for even having the audacity or gall to approach an official about a call.

I had a game this year where a player went after an official about one of his calls. When the official got basically in the face of the kid, the coach got upset that the official said something to his player. And then said to me (I was standing in front of the coach), "he cannot say anything to my player." Not anything about the kid behavior or why the official responded to the kid in the first place. He got upset that the official did not T this kid and had words with him. Adults have gone crazy I tell you.

Peace

Re: Re: Teddy's Comment
 

At the college level and at that level of college, he would not be ejected. That would be normal conversation in many gyms. I remember a rant by Coach K (YES COACH K) when he called an official about every name in the book and did not get T up if I remember correctly.

Peace

I would like to see this in a newspaper that is not from the state of Texas.

Re: Teddy's Comment
 

Why should anything happen to him? Coaches curse players all the time. Coaches curse officials all the time. Why should an official be held to a higher standard than a coach?

I saw it in a Knight-Rider article last night. I can't find it now but I know that it was not in a Texas paper. If I remember right it was two Texas players (other than Mouton) that heard what Ted Valentine said.

Re: Re: Teddy's Comment
 

Simply because in the beginning of this thread Barnes is accused of uttering the magic word and Valentine having no choice but to eject him. Y'all can't have it both ways - either everybody can say it, or nobody can.

Re: Re: Re: Teddy's Comment
 

There's a difference in the way it can be used, Coach, and I'm sure that you know that. There's:

1) You're a [bleep]ing joke!

And then there's:

2) Is this a great [bleep]ing game, or what?

#1 gets a coach tossed. #2 gets a smile and "Sure is, Coach" from the ref.

As Dan pointed out, if it's an adjective and NOT directed at a person (and not at the top of your lungs), it's usually ignored.

So you're right that we can't have it both ways if we say that coaches can't use #1, but refs can. That's obviously an unfair double-standard. But it's totally consistent to say that nobody can use #1, and anybody can use #2.

Barnes (perhaps) used #1. Teddy V (perhaps) used #2.

Thank you Chuck.

But, if I remeber correctly from <I>"Bull Durham"</I>, there is no correct way to use one particular word! :D

You're not in charge here redoubtable.
 

The question is, did he use the F word to a player.
The person reporting it IS THE PLAYER - Mouton - to whom he said it. No bionic ears necessary.

Now, is that close enough for the player addressed by the profanity to have heard.

Now the quetion you won't answer. If he did say it, what should happen to him?

What in the name of Coach Knight is that supposed to mean? Last I checked, we were having a discussion with people expressing opinions. Free country, Judge Roy.

This was easy to handle. The coach was more upset with Ted's partners. Ted just took care of business.

I have to disagree here. Its one thing if a partner fails to back you up. Its up to the supervisor to handle your partner. Its a whole different story when your partner(in this case Ted V.) goes public about your partner's performance or lack of..

Valentine was suspended and banned for one year
 

from the Big Ten in that incident for his public remarks in an article in Referee Magazine.

The Big Ten also indicated publicly that the 2nd and therefore 3rd techs were wrong.

The rules committe changed the rules of the game as a result of that one play that resulted in the squabble.

Re: Valentine was suspended and banned for one year
 

Just as I thought. You're an official who usually posts on this board but doesn't have the balls to post under your normal name. You are gutless and spineless.

But since you brought it up, what has Valentine's interview with REFEREE got to do with this situation? Once again, nothing.

Quote:

The Big Ten also indicated publicly that the 2nd and therefore 3rd techs were wrong.

I beg to differ. The Big Ten, in their infamous wisdom, stated that the 3rd T should not have been called. But let's not leave out the fact that Knight was also reprimanded.

Quote:

The rules committe changed the rules of the game as a result of that one play that resulted in the squabble.

What does that have to do with anything? The play was called correctly in the game. Knight's dumbass didn't know the correct rule at the time. The fact that the rule was changed doesn't have anything to do with Valentine correctly ruling on that play.

Once again, spineless and gutless. How about a moderator taking a look at this guy's IP address and tell us who he is?

Don't doubt it but...
 

Dear Jurassic,
I'm not surprised. It's funny, though. The Dallas Morning News is the only news agency to quote Mr. Valentine as using this expletive. CBS Sports not only didn't, they didn't even report this as a story on Saturday or Sunday. The AP didn't and of course, none of the Ohio papers. Only a newspaper from Texas, covering a Texas team that played the entire game as if the officials owed them a trip to the the Final Four. Xavier not only outplayed and outcoached Texas but the clearly wanted the game more. The better team won. As far as the Dallas Morning News is concerned, the fact that no other major media outlet has picked up this story leads me to believe that this is a non-story. More irresponsible "journalism." Sounds to me like they were trying to put a shine on Texas' terrible performance.

Barnes was a whinyass when he was at Clemson. He hasn't changed since he got to Texas. I'm glad the ACC is rid of him.

If Teddy V said it, which I doubt,
 

If Teddy V said it, there's still a problem here. Mouton has the burden of proving that Teddy V said it. Who's his witness? A biased, hometown newspaper. It would be one thing if the AP had picked this up. If this is pressed, there must be an investigation but without more corroboration you basically have Mouton's word against Valentine's word.

An investigation? :confused:

You're kidding, right?

B-ball ref don't misunderstand
 

Even if there is an investigation, which I wouldn't condone on Mouton's word alone, without further corroboration, Valentine shouldn't be held accountable for this. He did his job. I just looked up his record yesterday. 6 Final Fours, 3 National championship games and suddenly now, he's cursing out players? No, I don't believe it. Give me some better evidence than two hometown papers and Mouton.

Even if he said, "Shut the _ _ _ _ up, you'e not in the NBA!" that's certainly not "cursing out players."

I don't call D1 but I do know that there's a lot of profanity on the floor. Beyond not knowing if this is true or not, we also don't know what Mouton said to provoke whatever response was made. My guess is that Mr. Mouton did not ask, "Mr. Referee sir, could you please tell me what I did to get a foul?" I'm thinking more along the lines of "That's bull$hit! I didn't touch him!"

Unless I misread the article, it doesn't say anything about what Valentine said to Mouton.

You misread.

No, BktballRef iIam NOT an official.
 

Nor should I be at this age.

I was a high school basketball official years ago for a short while.

I was a soccer official for a few years after I stopped coaching soccer at a very competitive level.

The other officials thought I was crazy because I never went out and got myself a yellow card or a red card.

I was also statewide senior discplinary administrator in soccer.

A player struck an official and torn his uniform. The report came to me. I banned the player for life and sent his card to Zurich, Swirzerland (FIFA Headquarters) - lifetime worldwide ban.

The next day the high school where he coached called me and asked if I had banned him. I said yes, no one assaults an official and ever participates in the game again. They fired him that afternoon.

So, I am no ref hater, though there are some I really dislike and think should not keep their striped shirt. I'd imagine that no one you know ever banned a player world wide for life for his conduct regarding a referee.

I am one concerned that the small number of bad people who happen to be referees may end up ruining the game for everyone.

If you haven't MEMORIZED the University of Michigan study on officials gambling, you should. It is a serious potential threat to sports - human frailities being human frailities.

There is a lot that could be done to make officiating better for all - officials included - but FIRST we must be sure there is no monkey business going on.

Don't forget, 14 NBA officls were indicted and found guilty of tax evasion in their official capacities. You don't acquire sainthood when you put that whistle in your mouth.

[Edited by Judge Roy on Mar 28th, 2004 at 07:38 PM]

Rob Roy, Judge Roy......whatever your name is.
 

What does any of that have to do with the fact you know nothing about rule one?

And the Michigan Study had to deal with all the gambling, not betting on games.

The NBA officials were accused of tax evasion for turning in first class airline tickets to coach class so they could pocket the extra money. They did not report the extra income to the IRS and that is what got them in trouble. No different than a business man that does the same thing and does not report the income. It has nothing to do with gambling. But if that is your concern, what about all the players and coaches that go to Casinos and do other things that have been proven. I can think of a few point shaving scandals and officials were not involved. Arizona State, Northwestern to name a few. But then again, you are worried about officials and you know nothing about them. Stick to soccer, most of us hate soccer in the first place.

Peace

Re: No, BktballRef iIam NOT an official.
 

So you're not an official.
That certainly sounds like an official to me.

If you're not anymore, I for one am glad.

Again, I think Teddy, who is otherwise a solid official, helps get himself in these situations. Call the first T and walk away, even force a switch away from the table if you need to get away. In the worst case scenario, another partner can give T #2. Let's not toss a guy with a double T with a few seconds left on the clock unless it's ridiculous behavior. Of course, none of us know the details of the conversation between Barnes and Valentine, but I'm reasonably confident most other top flight officials wouldn't have handled it this way. That kind of stuff puts a damper on what was a great ball game. The no call that set Barnes off was a good no call and Barnes sort of intimated after the game that he might think differently after a review of the replay. As an official, know the situation and learn to listen to some music in your head instead of a frustrated losing coach in the final seconds of an elimination tournament game. I think you'll earn far more respect from all parties involved afterwards.

According to Knight-Rider TWO Texas player besides Mouton reported what Valentine said. The story was also reported by the Houston Chronicle, Knight-Rider Newspapers, and the San Antonio Courier Express.

Any papers OUTSIDE of Texas?

I still haven't seen this on ESPN, CBS, or anywhere else but these few TEXAS newspapers. Do you not think if there was anything to this that ESPN would be all over it?

Re: Rob Roy, Judge Roy......whatever your name is.
 

Want me to describe a soccer game for you? Ninety minutes of complete boredom, that's what it is. They won't let you use your hands either, for Heaven's sake! That's un-American as far as I'm concerned. Whoever heard of any game where you can't use your hands? Football,baseball, basketball, hockey, lacrosse, field hockey, softball, cricket,polo, marriage, karate and kung fu and all that Eastern sh*t--- you name it-- you're allowed to use your hands. Oh no, not soccer though. And you hardly ever see anybody score. What's up with that? And when a miracle occurs and someone does score, whatinthehell do you see? The goober that scored runs around the stadium three times with his teammates chasing him, takes off his clothes and throws them up in the air, and then falls flat on his face kicking and screaming. His teammates then catch up to him, fall on top of him, and take turns screwing him dog-style. Makes you sick to watch it!

Soccer, BAH!

Has anyone else noticed that the countries who excel in soccer tend to be socialist or communist?

The Knight-Rider Newspaper was not in Texas.

It doesn't matter. Crude or not, even if he made the comment, he was right. It's not the NBA, and Mouton could likely have earned himself a T there. After an entire game of bi!ching and moaning, Valentine may very well have told him to shut up.
Or, since no one is picking this up (aside from Knight-Ridder and texas papers), it's possible that the players' memories may not be perfect here.

Your absolutely correct. I went back and re-read it and saw the sentence. I had my annual eye exam on Wednesday and ordered new glasses -- looks like I needed them sooner.

Judge Roy
I am a former soccer guy, and if you really reffed without a yellow or red card, you must not have had any clue what you were doing. Certain types of fouls in the run of play require a red card, others a yellow. Cards are not the same as a T, which is reserved mainly for dissent and dead ball acts. You seem to equate the two.

If you really reffed soccer, you would know this and wouldn't make a ridiculous comment like that.

Save your breath, Coach. Royboy is outa here. We gave him this:

http://www.animationfactory.com/anim...ard_md_wht.gif

LMFAO..........That is how I pictured this guy....seriously!

Re: Stop defending him please
 

Who are you? The internet version of Judge Judy?

WoW!!!!!
 

Why on earth is it necessary for the pack to jump on this guy for having a different opinion???? You folks tend to get out of control when a differing thought process comes your way. Isn't he allowed to share his thoughts and opinions without ridicule, you can share your's as well - but he's not an idiot because he disagrees with you. Are you all Liberal Democrats or what??? Thinking no one is as smart as you, give it a rest...Holier than thou.

I, like most idiot fans, changed channels after Texas missed their last attempt to tie the game. When I flipped back 6 FT's were being shot. CBS Studio crew was very opinionated on the matter, they felt Teddy V should have walked away - are they all idiots as well? My guess is Teddy was right, I'm sure Barnes was out of his head with frustration. I know he wanted a foul on that rebound and didn't get it.

I appreciate the loyalty to fellow officials on here, but just because a guy is on TV a lot doesn't make him better than anyone else. He could have been wrong. We don't ever need to tell anyone to "Shut Up," this isn't MLB. If Teddy was that upset and offended by the player, he should have T'd him. I don't think Mr. Valentine got where he is by doing players "favors."

Let the stoning of the crazy minority opinion man begin!!!!!

mnref, roy is getting pounded because he asked for it. He asked some questions, and refuses to acknowledge the answers. Instead, he rambles and rambles and rambles.

Re: WoW!!!!!
 

Some of these wanabes, are not offering opinions. They just come here to ridicule or let off some steam from their frustration from there favorite team losing.

Well Dah.. Yes, they are when it comes to officiating.

I am not loyal to Teddy. I didn't like him because he went public about another official. But, what is he wrong about? The coach wanted the two T's. Even if Teddy went to the other side, the next official would have given the next T. The coach wasn't mad at Teddy, he felt the other official should have called a foul on the rebound. Of course this had been building up throughout the game.

Re: WoW!!!!!
 

See the point you are missing here, we are not sticking up for Teddy as a person. We are sticking up for the fact that we do not know the entire story. And when you do not know the entire story, you cannot tell us what you would have done or what should have been done if you have very limited knowledge. We have all been in the situation where a "he said, she said" situation has taken place and it would be wrong for any of to say, "I would do this" if we have never been in that situation.

If I am not mistaken, none of us have been on National TV with a coach that is imploding in front of you. It is real easy to say would would walk away, but you do not know what Barnes called Valentine? You do not know if Valentine was sticking up for a partner? You do not know if this was something that carried over from the regular season (Valentine does work Big 12 Conference games), we just do not know.

Who cares if you have an opinion, but you better come correct and be willing to have others challenge that opinion. I for one know that very well.

Personally I think it is very unprofessional to rip fellow officials when we do not have the entire story. Just the way I was raised in this game of officiating. It is one thing to debate a call on some merits, but when we do not have the answers, you deserve to have officials point that out to you.

Peace

I think it is more the tone than anything, as well as the fact that the individual in question jpoined the board with an inflammatory post. A big No-NO!

I would agree that Ted Valentine probably could have avoided the second T by walking away, and I also think that he should have done so. If somebody else then drew Barnes ire and saw fit to whack him a second time, so be it. With 3.9 seconds left, after such a great game, try to finish the game with the bench intact. Simply walking away might have done that. And simply making that case rather than calling names at the outset might have led to a good discussion of the point.

That said, none of us were there, we don't know what passed between Valentine and Barnes. So I can't say (nor can anybody else) that I would have done . . . (fill in the blank) or that Valentine was a self-aggrandizing jerk. That last kind of judgmental comment makes it hard to have a reasonable discussion of the situation, and lead to everybody piling. And it doesn't help that he enters the board throwing bombs, rather than looking for answers.

See the point you are missing here, we are not sticking up for Teddy as a person. We are sticking up for the fact that we do not know the entire story.

Personally I think it is very unprofessional to rip fellow officials when we do not have the entire story.

[/B][/QUOTE]Exactly!

3.9 seconds
 

Here are my 2nd guesses - without having been there, admittedely:

You know its a "do or die" game, and its evident Texas is going to lose - obviously Texas' Coach is going to be upset. With that knowledge couldn't you T him once, walk away shoot the throws and finish the 3.9. Instead it looked like he stayed for a conversation that looked reasonable and ended up tossing the coach.
Lastly, if I remember from the Referee Mag article; I thought Mr. Valentine stated that he thought it best that the same official shouldn't T and Run a Coach. If he steps away, and Barnes continues - then his partner takes care of business and this discussion would be unnecessary. I don't see the benefit of T'ing and hanging around waiting for an apology, or a hug, or anything positive to come from a frustrated coach. Just my thoughts.

With all that being said, Barnes may have said, "You're going to have to toss me you___________!!! Fill in your own mean words.

That's the point. Barnes may have said something to Valentine after the initial T- maybe asked him a reasonable question- and Valentine decided to stay there and hear him out. Also maybe Valentine WAS 100% wrong in the way that he handled this play, too.But we basically don't know. We can't judge the guy without knowing the whole story. That just isn't fair to him. And, like or hate his style, the guy is still a good official imo.

Exactly!

[/B][/QUOTE]

Ditto.

So maybe I'm missing something here, but for all those "he should have walked away" commenters, at the point he tossed the coach, Barnes was between Valentine and the table, and an assisstant coach was between Valentine and the court...so he was basically boxed in and COULDN'T "just walk away"...add to that the fact that Barnes was unloading on him, and you get to the conclusion that Barnes needed to leave...very similiar to the Eustachy (sp) situation a few years back...

Wrong about red and yellow cards
 

I don't need a card to talk to people and caution them. I don't need a red to send off a player if he needs it.

I ONLY need a card to hold myself above people as if I was some fantastic authority and to humble them.

That is unecessary in an official but many here seem to adore that sort of opportunity and cheer it in other officials.

That is part of the problem.

The best officiated games would result in the official - after changing to street clothes - being unrecognizable by the crowd as they left.

Re: Wrong about red and yellow cards
 

Wrong again. While the above is ideal, it dosen't have anything to do with how the game was officiated. Officials may do a great job and get noticed because they had to take care of business. i.e. T's. I've seen other officials do less than a good job and noone noticed. So, again you don't have a clue. :D

You back? I thought you got laughed out outa here. "Show me in the rule book-show me in the rule book...". Heeheeheehee.... Thick-skinned l'il fanboy, aren't you? Not too bright, but you're a glutton for punishment.

This one has to be part cockroach. Almost impossible to get rid of him.

perfect article
 

Technically, Valentine was out of bounds
Rick Morrissey

March 28, 2004

ATLANTA -- What do you look for in an NCAA tournament game? Suspense? Effort? Performances that rise to the occasion?

Or do you look for a referee to assert himself in the final seconds of a close contest?

Most of us turn on the TV in the hopes we'll see something special in the tournament. We don't fill out our brackets for the office pool and say to ourselves, "I hope Ted Valentine hands out a few technicals when it matters most. There's no such thing as 'too much Ted."' We don't pay attention to March Madness with the expectation a referee might put his mark on a game.

But that's exactly what happened in the final seconds of a regional semifinal game between Xavier and Texas on Friday night. And it was outrageous.

With 3.9 seconds left and Xavier leading by three points, Texas' P.J. Tucker was called for a foul. Xavier's Romain Sato had two free throws. Texas coach Rick Barnes exchanged words with Valentine, who quickly served two technicals to Barnes. Six free throws later, it was over, even though those same 3.9 seconds glowed on the clock.

Nothing says "NCAA tournament" like a coach being escorted off the court by security, does it?

What had been unlikely—Sato missing both free throws and Texas hitting a three-pointer to tie the game—became impossible. A referee made sure of that.

Now, I don't know what Barnes said to Valentine. But short of using a racial insult, I can't think of one thing he could have said that would have deserved two T's at such an important juncture in such an important game. Given that Barnes' teams at Texas primarily have been made up of African-American players and that Barnes is considered one of the classier coaches in college basketball, it's hard to believe he would have said something racially insensitive to Valentine, who is black.

What could Barnes have said to Valentine?

That the game was fixed? Not worth a technical with 3.9 seconds left.

That Ted needed to change his name to Tommy ("Deaf, dumb and blind")? Not worth a technical.

cont'd
 

That Valentine might want to consider wearing a thong off the court too? Not worth a technical.

None of it worth a technical in a game to decide who goes to the Elite Eight. A calm, savvy referee understands he's not bigger than the game he's calling.

"I was not displeased with any particular call," Barnes said after the game. "I had wanted to talk with them the whole game and was just surprised they would finally talk to me. What happened at the end of the game did not need to happen."

No it didn't.

Valentine didn't have much to say about the controversy after the game other than, "The rules speak for themselves." The rules are one thing, common sense is another. A referee shouldn't have this kind of impact in this big a game.

The Dallas Morning News reported that when Texas' Brandon Mouton asked for an explanation on his fifth foul with about two minutes left Friday, Valentine said, "Shut the [expletive] up, you're not in the NBA."

People were a little skittish talking about what happened Friday night, lest they someday feel the wrath of Ted. Even on the broader subject of the role of officials late in big games, there was hardly a peep.

"I have to be careful about that one," Xavier coach Thad Matta said Saturday. "The only thing I can say is, I didn't see what happened. At that point, I really didn't care what happened. I just told Romain, 'You have like 19 tries, man. You just have to make one."'

Valentine has a reputation for a being a tough guy, not such a bad thing for a referee. But he also has a reputation for having skin as thin as tracing paper.

Tough and sensitive is a terrible combination for an official in college basketball, which is filled with coaches who believe it's part of their jobs to argue every call.

Valentine made a name for himself in 1998 by ejecting then-Indiana coach Bob Knight during a game against Illinois. It was seen as Knight getting his comeuppance for bad behavior and Valentine enjoying the come-upping.

The punishment for Valentine should be no NCAA tournament assignments for a long time. A referee has to recuse himself from the possibility of overshadowing the game in the final seconds. On Friday, Valentine asked where the spotlight was.
Copyright © 2004, The Chicago Tribune

really like the thong thing
 

eom

Re: perfect article
 

Swampe:

This is an OPINION piece.

It reflects what ONE person thinks of this incident.

It is not an official NCAA press release saying that what Valentine did was wrong.

In other words, it carries ZERO weight.

i know
 

but it fits my opin perfectly !!!

did
 

u like the thong thing to?

When is somebody gonna unload Judge Royboy's illegitimate son above? This is getting ridiculous- allowing these trolls to go on for this long.

come on
 

you have to admit "the thong thing made u chuckle at least"

Re: come on
 

One wonders why you're so hung up on this thong thing. There are probably better forums for you to discuss the wearing of thongs with other men. Perhaps you'll get the hoped for response on one of them.

yep
 

but did u chuckle

Nope. You're not funny and everybody's pretty much sick of you. Go away. Call if you find work. Maybe you can be Judge RoyBoy's boytoy.

forgot
 

ref's are trained not to laugh or have a sense of humor-- so sorry

We should never hear Valentine's side. Officials should never talk to the media.

Nah, we just like our humor a little more, well, funny. Now, go away.

Re: yep
 

Here's a chuckle!!


FANBOY ALERT!!!

http://www.ebaumsworld.com/forumfun/gay4.jpg

swampe4 and Judge Roy, the boy toy! :D

Opinion piece, yes...but
 

It wasn't written in a Texas newspaper....maybe we can read Mr. Valentine's side of the story in Referee Magazine...Oh, wait; I don't think he'll do that again!!!