Hello all. Over the break my team participated in a x-mas tourney. At a stoppage in play I asked one of the officials if he would keep his eye out for carrying the ball, specifically our opponent's PG. He responded that he had noticed it as well but would refrain from making a carrying call until she used it to gain an advantage. I realize if the officials called every rule violation they seen, the games would quickly turn in a 3 hour tour and I appriciate when they do turn a blind eye to some stuff. However, I'd never heard an official respond in that fashion. Is this common?

Is it common to call it this way? Yes. Is it common to say this to a coach? Well....

"If I see it I'll call it coach."

What you say
 

When you do call it, they stop doing it. In most cases, it is just a bad habit. In the worst case scenario, the coach will take them out because of the turnovers. As an official, it is not bad PM to mention it to their coach before you address it directly.

I first question is, did the ball come to rest in her hand? Was the palm face up?

the palm doesn't have to be face up, you can cup the ball on a crossover and accomplish the same thing, it is the coming to rest in control that gains an advantage...

I have heard an official tell a coach "they aren't gaining an advantage, I will call it when they do" I have mixed emotions. I think you need to address it quietly with the offending team when you see it (assuming there is no advantage)..if that doesn't work call it once and see if that works. I guess if that is the reason you aren't calling it, it probably doesn't do any harm telling the coach this, but if they make a move and do it and gain an advantage you better be right on top of it...

That's not how I call it. I call it when I see it, and I can usually tell within a minute or two if I'm going to have to call it. Players that carry usually habitually dribble that way and come close a lot. If I call it early and he's wide open, it's gonna be blatant. I've called a few this year, and without fail the kid complained to his coach only to get, "He's right, it was a carry," from his coach. :)

nothing better than hearing that from the bench, whether it be about a carry, a foul, or anything in general....

Don't take stock in the coach agreeing. The last time i made this call was two yrs ago when the kid did the AI move.

Great point. IMO the best thing to hear from the bench is nothing, either way.

I don't need the coach's agreement to validate my calls. I just think it's funny when the kids complain to the coach about calls only to get rebuffed. It was funny from a spectator's perspective. At the JV level around here, there are a few point guards who watch too much of the Sixers on TV. Worse yet, they watch that street ball on ESPN and see the players do worse stuff than the AI move and get away with it.

Adam

I would recommend never tell a coach or player how, why, or when you will make a call. A couple yrs. ago, the R at one of my HS games told the coach he was going to call something a certain way. Sure enough, the coach ended up getting a T for getting excited about something that wasn't called.

I really do not want to get into the discussion about palming. But one of my long time partners has a great solution when a player or coach asks him to watch another player: He politely tells them he isn't interested in being told about the other team's players, but rather he wants to know which one of their players do things that are illegal.

I'm sure that comment goes over great with a coach.

My partner is a minister and is a women's observer in the MAC, is just knows how to handle a coach.

It doesn't matter if his name is Moses, it's a stupid thing to say.

This is the Minister Mark talked about and I just joined today and am making my first "preaching engagement"... or should I say my first post. The tactic Mark says I used in this situation was made to a coach who is also a fellow basketball official. We have officiated several times together so we were just having a little fun by antagonizing each other. His team was far behind and playing so poorly he was trying for some comic relief and knew me well enough that I would play along. Never at any time did anyone else hear what we were saying so no felt demeaned or insulted. I would never say this in any other situation as it normally tends to be inciteful rather than insightful.

Bottom line is we should never tell a coach we purposely ignored a violation. I get along well with coaches because of communication. Always brief and courteous. If they ask me a question I will answer it. If they ask me to watch palming in general I tell them I will. If it involves a specific play I will tell them what happened to make it a call or no-call. These communications can and must be done without disrupting the flow of the game.

Have I had times when the communication broke down? You bet. If situation warrants, take care of business. Sometimes this can be done with a simple "I've heard enough" or use "T" as a last resort. Whatever is necessary, do it without emotion and as anoymously as possible. We are not there to show up a coach



[Edited by Daryl H. Long on Jan 5th, 2004 at 11:23 PM]

Welcome to the board Daryl.

Thank you for clarifying, Daryl. That was exactly my point, in saying that it would be a stupid thing to say. Mark made it sound like something you use quite often. Glad to hear that isn't the case.

Welcome to the board.

Welcome
 

May all your games be blessed! ;)