Finally got to work my first high school game this week! Needless to say, I was excited. Sophomore boys game. It was also my partner's first HS game. That was both good and bad, I think. Good in that I had to step up and be a leader. I didn't feel like a new guy because we were both new I was the one who knew the most about the pre-game rituals, etc. Bad in that I was counting on my partner, who should have been a grizzled veteran, to set the tone for how tight we'd call it. He preferred to let a lot of contact go in the post, and a lot of hand checking, and sadly I followed suit. By the end, I was unhappy with how that part went. But overall, things went very well. It was a lot of fun. Only T'd one coach ;) Am looking forward to my next one.

One question: who is responsible for alerting the visiting team when it's time to return after half time? At 0:30 left on the clock, we talked to the home coach and he sent somebody to get them.

Congrats on getting through the game and having some fun with it.
In a soph game, I would say to go ahead and get the fouls if you see them...even if your partner isn't getting them, especially since he was a "new" guy to. Those games can get pretty rough and to just "let em play" at that level can really get out of control fast.
Game management, or someone from the table, should be the ones responsible for notifying the teams and the officials at halftime. Hawks Coach might have some information on what time he likes to be notified...officials around here usually like to be notified with about 3 minutes left on the clock during halftime.

RD

We ask the table to blow the horns 3 times at the 3 minute mark. This is for us as well as both teams.

I carry a stop watch in my jacket. A Back up timer and a halftime timer... i start it before i put my jacket on and tell the table to start thier clock as soon as me and my partner are both ready. This way my clocks usually 30-40 seconds ahead of the game clock. We get back on the cour when start heading back out on the floor when I get down to 2 min and that usually puts us out there with about a min or two to go before halftime is over. As far as the visiting team? hmmm... they should be keeping track of all that themselves. I did have an incident though and asked the home coach to send someone to go get them and he said "shouldnt that be there problem" so yeah. I usually try tell the visiting coach to watch his time so he's back out in time. Hasnt been a problem usually butwould love to know how this is handled by others.

Gentlemen, it's the referee's responsibility to make sure both teams are notified 3 minutes prior to the start of the half.

Thank you, Tony.

Game management should do it.
 

In my area the teams are ultimately responsible for knowing when to come on the floor. We cannot even guarantee that we are informed when the proper time is to come out onto the floor. You tell the table to do it, but if they do not come or they are not coming at the right time, we have to check ourselves.

If it is done right, the game management takes care of all that.

Peace

2-12-1
Note when each half is to start and shall notify the referee more than three minutes before this time so the referee may notify the teams, or cause them to be notified, at least three minutes before the half is to start.

It doesn't matter whether the referee does it or he delegates the task to someone else, ultimately, it is the R's responsibility.

Rulebook vs. Reality
 

If you want to pass a test, then you can have the Referee do the dirty work. If you want to live in the real world, like I had to Monday-Wednesday, then the game management or table personnel does it. Maybe things are handled differently in your area, but as an official, we do not touch this area. Often times, we do not even know where the teams are located, so I can tell you this is not something I am going to worry about. I will admit during the lower level Saturday games, we might not even go back to our locker room, depending on the school and what floor the game is being held at. But during varsity contest, I am not tracking down teams to tell them what the time is on the scoreboard. They can tell time. ;)

Peace

Exactly. I verify when going to the table that the scorer/timer will notify the teams (or have someone do it). Thus ends my "responsibility." Most importantly, I make sure they notify US at 3 minutes so we're back on the court. Game management reality is not always the answer to a test question.

Rich

Re: Rulebook vs. Reality
 

Jeff --

No one is saying the R has to notify the teams.

But, the R has to be sure the teams are notified.

What do you do if you get back on the floor and one (or both) teams aren't there? I go to the table and ask if they notified the teams. If not, then someone goes and we, umm, make an allowance if they're late ocming back.

If they've been notified and are still late (by more than 1 minute) coming back, then we can assess the T. I've never had to assess the T, but I have started the clock ticking.

PA coach would probably be a better source for what coaches want - I coach outside the more regular "school" ball. It's only at major events that we get a full halftime. When we do, I am so used to a pretty short halftime (3-5 minutes) that we are never late. I am only guilty of "maximizing" 30 sec TOs :)

My own thought is that most coaches probably have a feel for how long they have at haltime without ever checking a clock. If they overextend, they have to know they are doing it. So even though the notification is a requirement, i am willing to bet that it is not any surprise to those being notified. You really develop an internal clock and you know what you can get done in your allotted time. If you don't, you can't possibly make effective use of the time.

As a completely tangential side note, I do like having the full halftime. It gives you more time to talk as coaches before you go to the team, and allows a little more emphasis of each point you want to make so you aren't racing from point to point. But the short halftimes give you the good habit of not putting out too much info, because players can only focus on a couple of major things anyway. That's a good habit when you get more time.

Rulebook vs. Reality
 

And you never heard me say that you never mention it to anyone to inform the teams. Just saying that much of the responsiblity falls with the people who are in charge of the game site or the people at the table.


Again, if you do that it does not mean it has not already been done. I am not going worry myself all night because I did not specifically tell someone at this particular time to go get the teams. Sometimes it is the home team that is late.

I treat this just like football, if I can see them coming out to the floor or playing field, I am not going to have a heart attack over it. The rules in football says that the Referee and the Umpire are suppose to go into the locker room and have our normal pregame meeting, but that never happens. I put this "responsiblity" in the same category.

This is the last thing I want to do. But usually they do not inform us to when to come onto the court, then informing the teams. There are many more times when the officials are late and coming onto the floor under a minute than the teams.

Peace

We may be spliting hairs...I stated it was the game management's or table's responsibility to notify the teams and officials...I should have said it is one of their DUTIES

You quoted the rule yourself,Rule 2 SECTION 12 TIMER'S DUTIES only you left out The timer shall:

Sure, it is our responsibility ultimately, but it is the Timer's duties in real life and according to the rule book.

RD

Gentlemen, play semantics all you like. It is the referee's responsibility to either notify the teams or make sure that they are notoified at the 3 minute mark. It is not game management's responsibility. It is not the timer's responsibility. IT IS THE REFEREE'S RESPONSIBILITY.

The timer's responsibility, by rule, is to notify the referee.

No one is saying that the referee must go to the dressing room and get the team but he must ensure that someone has notified them. If you don't follow through with this, then you CANNOT issue a technical foul to the offending team. Hopefully, even those who don't think it's their responsibility would get off their butt and find out what's going on before they whacked somebody.

[Edited by BktBallRef on Nov 29th, 2003 at 10:11 AM]

If you say so.
 

OK, whatever you say.

Whacking someone for not being on the court is going to have several factors involved. As I stated, the players are on the court most of the time in my games than the officials. Why, because we are usually told last by the "people who do that thing." Again, I have worked all week long, I have only been the Referee once and not a single partner that was the Referee worried about this once. I am still waiting for anyone to worry about the "timeout" situation we talked about most of this year, you claimed was so important. I guess in your neck of the woods you worry about this, it appears with the rest of us we do not. If you say so, it is our responsibility, but it seems to get done without us telling anyone or worrying about it. ;)

Peace

BktBall -

I can't imagine whacking somebody period over this. Eventually, I will be finding out why the team isn't on the floor -- the only way this would ever be a technical foul is if I got some kind of blasting (We'll come out when we're ready!) from a coach. Can't see that happening, at least not at the varsity level or above.

This is such a non-issue, really. I don't care if the teams are out at 3:00. I care once the clock expires. Cause once it does, we start the second half and it's hard to do that properly with one team.

Jeff's right, too -- around here we're usually the last ones on the floor as we're the last notified. I don't like being the last on the floor, but I'm not going to stand with an eye at the door to make sure the teams don't sneak onto the court without me.

I'm admittedly not a stickler when it comes to administrative issues. If the lineups aren't in the book at 10 minutes, I make sure they get put in at that point. Of course, being at the table at about 11:30 means we get things started even before we reach 10:00. If a player shows up late and isn't in the book when reporting, I get the player in the book without a technical if I can help it. If that's wrong, by rule, so be it, but running the game is more important than worrying about minutiae, in my opinion.

Speaking of, I have boys game this afternoon. Need to start polishing the shoes.

Rich

Rich, while it's a non-issue for you and me, it's not a non-issue for the original poster in this thread. He had a question that required a correct answer. What would you tell him? "Ah, don't worry about it. Somebody will probably get'em."

[Edited by BktBallRef on Nov 29th, 2003 at 01:51 PM]

I think it does a poster no good to give him a black-and-white rules answer and then not discuss the intracacies involved. You and I both know what the rules say as do many of the other people that post here. To quote the rules and not put in any real-world context does a newer official a disservice.

Here's an example: Let's say a poster asks -- The R finds the book does not have the starters marked at the 9:30 mark. What do you do?

Do you tell him that it is an administrative technical foul or do you mention some preventive alternatives?

Rich

Both Bob Jenkins and I gave him the rule and the real world answers. My comment was addressed to your remark that it was a non-issue. That simply isn't true when someone doesn't know how to handle it. Out of 100 games, this may happen once, so you must know what your responsibilities are and what needs to be done.

I'm done. Hope you had a good game.

Thank you, everyone. Since this was my first HS game, I was unsure how this usually works. From the discussion, it sounds like usually it just does work, cause everybody's used to how it's supposed to go. From now on, as part of my half-time routine, I'll make sure I ask the timer to make sure both teams are notified at the 3:00 minute mark...and not lose any sleep over it ;)

You're exactly correct, BITS. "Let the teams and us know when we're at the 3 minute mark." Don't just assume it will be done.

Went to the table at halftime and asked the timer who was going to notify us and the teams. Looked at us with confusion, naturally. Finally agreed to do it himself.

We were notified and came out to an empty floor. One team arrived with less than a minute on the clock. Horn went and viviting coach asked me what he could do since he had a player being taped that was starting the second half. Just as I was telling him we would allow a substitute, the player came back. He thanked me for giving them a little extra time and we got the game going.

Anyone else see the 14-foot boxes laid down wrong?

Rich

I have an assistant coach with the responsibility to go check the clock a few minutes into the halftime and report the time back to me.

Only once did I have any issue with the three-minute rule. At an away game we had a terrible first half and had a lot to cover in the break. All of the coaches were involved and we never did check the clock. We came out to a clock showing less than a minute, and I didn't want to go straight from the talking to the playing, so I went to the officials, told them no one notified us at three minutes, and could they please reset the clock to 3:00, which they did. We shot around for a couple minutes, rallied back, and lost in OT.

For what it's worth, when I was coaching varsity basketball back in the 90's, we were ready to play for the second half (as the visiting team) and the home team was late. They weren't there at the end of the 10 minute half-time, nor were they there for the minute that followed. I lobbied for a "T" and the referee, knowing that I knew the rule, started the second half with a "T". That is the one and ONLY time I have ever seen that occur. The only reason I think I got the call is that I was aware of the rule. So for you coaches that read these boards, learn the rules for your sake and ours.