I'm having a lot of trouble with the new strong side mechanic. I never really did get comfortable with crossing the key to "go strong side." And now it's even more necessary, and I feel even less comfortable.

Friday night, my partner and I kept discussing it and working on it, but had a number of questions. We both began to see how important it was: the ball gets below the 3-point line, and if there are several people above the ball, trail often doesn't have a good view of the ball. But in that case, it's hard to have eye contact with the partner to see when to switch, and who's looking where.



So here are some questions:

1) When does lead GO? Wait until the ball is actually in the new primary area, or just when it's headed there?

2) I think looking at partner just prior to the hustle across might be the wisest thing, a sort of, "Here we go!" agreement. Does that seem reasonable?

3) There were several times Friday evening, when the ball was across the key from the lead, in the newly-christened Primary, and all 10 players were below the 3-point line. This would mean that lead would have all 10 players, and trail none. So trail needs to pick up someone, right? But who?

4) In which case, at what point does trail shift to the farther angle, picking up any weakside players who were previously covered by lead?

5) When does lead hustle back across? How does trail know when to pick up the ball again?

6) If trail is taking a drive all the way to the basket, does lead wait to cross until the drive is either ended in a shot, or interrupted by defense, thus settling the ball down low? If lead goes across anyway, does the ball switch to lead's attention? Or does lead go across, but leave the ball to trail?

These were all questions that we talked about -- after the situations happened, and we hand't done it correctly.

Next scrimmage is Tuesday evening -- I hope to get some of this worked out before then. Thanks for help!!

<font color = red>mick </font>

So here are some questions:

1) When does lead GO? Wait until the ball is actually in the new primary area, or just when it's headed there?

Ball goes below the free throw line and the post play is on the opposite side of the lane.

2) I think looking at partner just prior to the hustle across might be the wisest thing, a sort of, "Here we go!" agreement. Does that seem reasonable?

No. In 3 man you learn to watch your partner(s) with your periferal vision. Same is true here.

3) There were several times Friday evening, when the ball was across the key from the lead, in the newly-christened Primary, and all 10 players were below the 3-point line. This would mean that lead would have all 10 players, and trail none. So trail needs to pick up someone, right? But who?

Look at your charts in the officiating manual. There is always someone to watch off ball.

4) In which case, at what point does trail shift to the farther angle, picking up any weakside players who were previously covered by lead?

When he knows his partner is in position on the strong side.

5) When does lead hustle back across? How does trail know when to pick up the ball again?

The lead needs to hustle back obviously when the ball comes back to the other side of the floor, but before then, if the ball goes back to the top of the key, I hustle back right then.
b) periferal vision.

6) If trail is taking a drive all the way to the basket, does lead wait to cross until the drive is either ended in a shot, or interrupted by defense, thus settling the ball down low? If lead goes across anyway, does the ball switch to lead's attention? Or does lead go across, but leave the ball to trail?

You never want to be caught in no mans land(under the basket) during a basket attempt. Stay put and let the play happen then decide if you need to get back across.


Hope this helps Juulie. The mechanic takes some practice. One thing I would do when you start a game is look and see what defense they are in. If they are playing man to man, I wouldn't go strong side as much as when they are in a zone. In zone you want to overload a zone and get a mismatch so there is a tendency to get all the players on one side of the floor. In man to man, they ususally spread out more and the ball likes to bounce around so you won't see it settle anywhere. Stay put and let your partner cover that side of the floor. Remeber that as you move across the paint you need to continue officiating. Don't focus on where you are going but instead focus on the matchup you want to officiate. Watch how on TV the official always has his head pointed at the lane while he crosses over to start the rotation in 3-man. That is how you want to do it in 2 man.

I love this new mechanic and i pregame the dog out of it every game because I want to make sure my partnerd oesnt think i dont trust them! I dont go over if theres just one person. if theres 2 players from each team or theres a crowd I go. I go based on judgement... if i can take a few steps deeper off the endline I will.. if my partner is having a hard time seeing or has some other off-ball stuff going on I'll come over... I usually pregame that ima point if im going over so that he knows i'll go back when the ball turns over. Sometimes we've pregamed to say- "coming" or "i've got you" just so wer know where each other is at. I wont go if they're playing a zone defense though... no point in crossing when the balls prolly gunnna go back to the top in second... And I dont go if the post play isnt heavy that way. I go over there even if the ball is say ad mid court just to get a better look at the post play. Not what the mechanci was inteded for i know but i can see better- espcially in these freshman/ms gyms were u only have 3 feet on the endline... I've been forutnate lately though... I've had 6-8 feet to work with...

First I want to say I believe the opposite of what Tim said. You should go more if the team is in a man-to-man than a zone. If you do 2-person and 3-person the first adjustment should be to step off of the baseline two or three additional steps space providing. When you go you haveo to trust your partner! If you make eye contact or verbalize something I just think you are missing something. As Tim pointed out correctly, you can't immediately begin to officiate where you are going while crossing the paint. You have to still watch all matchups as you progress across. I go across if a post play is imminent (did I spell that right?). If you have two post players over there on the block, go. If you have two guards that aren't going to post up then why go? If a shot/drive is in progress either step back to officiate rebounding action or take one large step towards wall if you have room. Opening up your field of vision is very important in officiating but more so when you only have 4 eyes on the court! It is also good for the Trail to take one step onto the court farther to look weakside when the lead is on strongside. If not a physical step then a mental step. This is similar to the Trail's mechanic in a Women's 3-person game. It is also like Pro ball with 2-person (CBA).

mick --

It looks as though you're saying I should use body language to communicate with partner, as in "square up." I understand, and appreciate your pointing it out. I've heard it before but haven't really digested it in the past.

I think you're saying, more or less, that as lead I should cut across when I would have last year, but be more aware of the ball as it drops down into strong side, and demonstrate to partner new primary coverage by "squaring up". As trail, I cover normally, until I see partner square up, and then hustle for an angle on whatever needs attention. Does that sound like a good summary?

[Edited by rainmaker on Nov 24th, 2003 at 10:51 AM]

YU,P, you own it.

Let's say the ball went low, Trail side, and you cross-over because of a matchup (like last year), and not because of the ball, If when you cross-over you are squared up on that matchup, your partner oughta stay on the ball and give it up only when you are on ball (Body positioning) and not give it up just because you are on strong-side.

This is difficult sometime, when your partner is on another wide match-up and the ball goes in his direction. A foul can happen that you may not want to call because it was in your partner's lap, but (oops!) he wasn't even looking there. Trail saw it, yet gave it up to nobody.

From Trail, take it until your partner grabs it.

mick

First,
I don't think your reason for going strong side should be any different this year then last. You should go strong side because you need to. Your need should not be based on the ball coming below the freethrow line and inside the arc. It should be because the ball AND post are over there. To me the only time you square up and take the ball in that area is if you are already over there.

For Instance
I am working normal and the ball is on T side of the court. Team likes to dump the ball into the post on that side. The post player is over there so I go to officiate the post. If the ball enters the "NEW" area in dicsussion, I as L am supposed to pick it up.

In My pregame the L will only pick it up if it's passed in there. If it's dribbled I think the T needs to stay with it.(they have the benefit of seeing the whole play).
So I am open for discussion on this subject.

Ron I like the way you are thinking. Rainmaker and Mick, I don't think this "squaring up" as you are describing it is a good thing or the correct thing. To me it has is screaming of "looking where you are going to end up" instead of officiating as you go. You can overlook officiating as you go until somebody catches an elbow and is laying it a puddle of blood with a $1,000 worth of dental work. The answer will be "I don't know what happened" becuase you were looking across the paint already. Now, that is harsh and extreme but it can happen. You should only have to square up when the ball is in the "new" area that belongs to the lead this year. Otherwise you body should be at an angle because you have to cover the sideline on the weakside. So in summary, as the Lead we still have many responsibilities before we ever get into a position to "square up" without handling these responsibilities things can get out of hand and we could possibly wear the arrow out because we didn't see what happened.

I wasn't very clear, I guess. I believe Ron and Rainmaker and I are on the same page. But, hey, I've kicked 'em before.
One "squares up" <u>on the match-up</u> you are looking at.
Once you cross over you may square up back at the paint at an angle to see the post play and the weak side.

With your torso directly facing what you are looking at, you are squared up. It's kinda a Legal Officiating Position. ;)

mick

Mick,
I believe when someone says square it refers to shoulders squaring up parallel to the endline no the play you are officiating. I believe we are on the same page.

Let's vote, Ron.
Start a thread. :)
mick

I was reading “squaring up” as meaning either, “Shoulders parallel to endline, attention straight ahead”, or “Torso facing direction of attention”. Either way, body position strongly situated to indicate where attention is. Feet maybe slightly further apart than normal and planted to help emphasize where I’m looking. It’s a way to signal partner where I’m looking.

I’m assuming, trail adjusts to lead’s shifts, rather than the reverse? I mean, trail stays on ball (in his primary) until lead indicates otherwise?

MY two cents---

Ask yourself this question-what do you do when you are working the traditional position of being opposite on the floor?

You are Lead (lets say table side) and your partner is Trail on the opposite side of floor (balanced) and you have all 10 players and the ball in the primary... How do you referee there? You have the ball and Trail has off ball...

So now with this strong side mechanic you just move across the paint, You now have the ball in your primary and ref it while lead ref off ball from the trail. Trail has the perimeter, the weakside, and most likely backside (away from you)cutters. Trail may have to move slightly on top for an angle but wont get out into the middle too far--

One thing I will have to disagree with Tim on. I personally believe you will do more strong side officiating in a man-to-man defense or a matchup zone than basic zone. If a team is using a skip pass to break the zone you'll bounce all over the floor if you are not careful.

Remember the first guys to do strong side stuff were the NBA guys in a two man game who had the illegal defense that force the man/matchup zone D.

You dont want to be in a rush to get back, you work across just like you worked to get there. If there is a cut down the paint you cant be moving to pick it up. If there is a quick pass away from you then Trail can get it... If she is refereeing the D it is an easy call from Trail. You dont want to be moving while the ball is up. If you stay there you take the strongside rebounding and fouls your partner has the perimeter, weakside and shooter. You will not miss much- a layup away from you should be an easy call for Trail... If you miss a minor one there no big deal. You were working the right part of the floor..If a coach moans and complains the mantra should be "that's why we need three refs on the floor".

Two of the best guys that work strongside reside on this board --Drake and Stripes do a wonderful job at strongside mechanics. (You guys both owe me the advertising fees). I love working with those two and a few others because you trust them, they trust you. Strongside officisting requires more cooperation, and more knowing where your partner is, and quick visual confirmation.


Now the next challenge... and it is so much fun... Take a fast break that is opposite side of the floor from you --go down with them, officitate it and get across the floor to the other side of the paint and referee from the strong side while the player goes to the basket and there is a foul...

You will earn a bunch of points with coaches. The thing about this mechanic, although some coaches dont like it. Both officials are where they need to be to make the right call.

The only thing you need to make sure that both of you pregame well is if you are stong side and the floor is unbalanced, your sideline is now uncovered, and must be covered by trail (usually the skip pass or long rebound)
Trail blows the whistle and points direction, You go over and reset and throw in.

BTW on throw ins I go strongside, particularly if they have a habit of going down low. Think how good this looks when a ball is thrown into a low post player, she turn, shoots, gets whacked, and you are right there. Your partner did not call it fom Trail, you did not call is from across the paint..(the value of ATT and MCI stock just went down)

Relax and have fun with this. I have found that you see more of the stuff you need to see..

I have never heard of squaring up to a play. How do you stay "squared up to a play when a play is moving? How can you tell if your partner is squared up to a play with a group of say, 6 players? I have heard the term square up when it is referring to the endline. For instance with the ball in the corner on the Leads side you have to square up to the endline to officiate the play.

Once again I stress, without the proper pregame and practice you will be officiating where you are going to end up while you are passing players and matchups. Mick, Rainmaker, can you speak on this subject using your current technique? You have not mentioned the importance of endline positioning (depth and width), closing down or the Trail's adjustments. Squaring up has been the main issue and since every play is different inconsistent officiating cannot occur when communication is based on getting to a play across the paint to square up on it.

A Center or Trail, when working on a match-up, can <u>move and turn</u> to get a proper angle to see the space between the players. By drawing a line between the players, and setting the official's shoulders parallel with that line, the official may look staight ahead at the space (perpendicular to both lines) and be squared up on the match-up, regardless of the angle of the matchup with respect to the endline or any other line.
Action on the floor is rather <u>dynamic</u> while the end lines seem to stay in one place.

<i>"...have not mentioned the importance of endline positioning (depth and width), closing down or the Trail's adjustments."- tomegun </i>

I recognize the importance of these things and probably didn't mention them, polished shoes, water at 1/2-time or medical alert tags either.


<I>"Squaring up has been the main issue and since every play is different inconsistent officiating cannot occur when communication is based on getting to a play across the paint to square up on it."</I> - tomegun

I believe the issue was body language and how to tell if your partner is on ball. But, as I have said, I 've kicked 'em before.

mick

Clever, very clever but you did not address the question. The empire state building doesn't have anything to do with this either but the things I mention most definately have something to do with working as the L on the endline.
What you are referring to when you described getting angles on plays is just that, getting angles. You can say you don't want to get straight-lined or you want to see daylight between the players but "squaring up to the play?" I haven't heard that before. You still haven't mentioned the possibility of little Johnny getting mugged in the paint while you are trying to get across the lane and form a equalateral triangle with two players (I can be clever too). Who is going to watch that since you have to get over there, "square up", you partner recognizes this, and then your partner watches weakside. People, this happens pure and simple. We can try to exchange witty comments all day long but this happens. If this situation isn't part of the pregame it can be trouble. If the Lead crosses over and focuses on a area that has just become their primary there will be four eyes on the ball. Do you think squaring up will solve this?

Yes.
Exactly.
Yer gettin' close now.
mick

No my friend you need to get close. 4 eyes on two players isn't good and there is still no such thing as squaring up on a play. At least not at any of the camps I went to on the West coast or East coast. Once again you disregarded everything else I said and picked out one sentence without addressing anything else. The other things SHOULD be of some concern to you, to us!

What exactly are you geting at? Is your basic concern that Mick used the term "square up"? Are you saying he's wrong, that squaring up is never a good technique? I don't know about you but I find it is very useful in some 2 man situations. Or maybe Mick's left out other things that might be important? Howzabout you fill us in?

(BTW, no one really cares what camp you or I attended. Even though we all sometimes disagree it is assumed we all know what we're doing. OK? ;) )

The other things are certainly important. Do you need a bigger stick? http://smilies.networkessence.net/s/...m/sleeping.gif

Dan, a camp is where new mechanics begin to trickle down. One of the evaluators at a camp I've attended was mentioned on this board. I didn't say it in any bragging manner especially since I paid to go to these camps myself. What I was trying to get across is I have never heard the term squaring up when it comes to a play or players. I have heard the term squaring up when it comes to the Lead's position in relation to the end line. When it comes to plays/players I've heard terms like accept the play, open up to the play, get an angle on the play, don't get straight-lined, see daylight and others. I just want to make it clear to you that I would, by no means, try to big-time anyone by mentioning I've been to this camp or that camp. What is being avoided is the heart of the matter. If you can visualize moving across the paint and there is a play in your new primary. I say new because the Lead's primary changes once he/she is across the paint. The Trail is watching this play because it was in their primary before the lead came over. So, the Lead should have came over because of iminent post play or most of the players are on that side. Iminent post play - they are right in front of the Lead. What happens if the lead bypasses all of the players in between the old position to the play in the new trail which could be right inside the 3-point arc? Also, what happens if the lead watches all match ups on his/her way over and then squares up to the play? Vision has just been cut off! So, a response would be "but the lead moves out so they can still look into the paint." Exactly right. Movement on the endline by the lead is made to increase our field of vision. If we "squared up" on plays at the lead we wouldn't need to move, we could just move our bodies so we are "squared up." Why would you "square up" on a play at the lead and cut your field of vision off? The answer would be for me to move across while reffing in progressions across the paint. Once settled with a wide field of vision go to a matchup in "new" primary when there is a change in player control, meaning A1 passes to A2. This way if the Trail had the play from the start they can stay with it all the way like in 3-person. Once there is a change of player control the Trail can look weakside and the Lead can look in the "new" primary. Without squaring up on the play floor coverage is better because the field of vision is improved. This, or something like this, makes more sense to me.

Not only does lead need to do these things, he needs to let his partner know that he has done so -- usually by body language / positioning relative to the play. That's all "square-up" means.

(sarcastic dialect comment deleted)

I like the way the heart of the matter is avoided, square up and you cut your vision. Cut your vision and you say "I didn't see it" time and time again. You do need body language or something like that but "squaring up" isn't body language it is something that can be detrimental to the mechanics of the game. Sort of like saying "I will bail out so you know I'm trying to get down court." What about the officiatin you just left behind when you bail out or "square up?"

(additional sarcastic dialect deleted)

excellent discussion
 

I don't often contribute to this board, but usually find some time to check in on a reg. basis and find it very useful. So I thank each of you who have taken the time to comment and allow the rest of us additional learning opportunities.

IMO, this thread has been an excellent example of taking a subject (and in this instance, imo, a very important one) and examined it from almost every angle possible. Hopefully we have all gained additional info. that will allow us to perform our job more proficiently and professionally.

Bob's last comment, I think, was right on and an excellent clarification of the apparent disagreement.

Tom -- slow down a little. I've got the feeling that you are using the words "square up" to mean something different from what others are saying. If you could physically describe what you mean by "square up" it might help the dialog.

Re: excellent discussion
 

That doesn't surprise me!


Rainmaker, by "squaring up" I take it as moving your body so you are facing a play and your partner has no doubt that you have it.

Can someone please examine both sides and make some comments based on what would happen if someone "squared up?"


Wow, is all I can say.

I have to go ref.

Re: Re: excellent discussion
 

Why does that need to cut off vision? I don't understand what you are seeing in your head.

tomegun, you said:
"I like the way the heart of the matter is avoided, square up and you cut your vision. Cut your vision and you say "I didn't see it" time and time again. You do need body language or something like that but "squaring up" isn't body language it is something that can be detrimental to the mechanics of the game. Sort of like saying "I will bail out so you know I'm trying to get down court." What about the officiatin you just left behind when you bail out or "square up?""



My understanding of mick and bob's comments are what I have used to guide my usage of this coverage. That is: "squaring up" so that my partner knows what area or match-ups I now have covered, this allows him/her to adjust their coverage accordingly (and of course we have pre-gamed all this).

The fact that I communicate that with my body language by squaring up to the play or players does not automaticaly mean I have cut my field of vision. I can be squared up and still have depth or width to provide adequate field of vision.

"Squaring Up" as is being dicussed in this situation IS body language. Your indicating that "you do need body language or something like that..." seems to put you on the same page of needing to communicate to your partner.

The squaring up, like any technique/mechanic/positioning, can be used properly or improperly.

How do you propose to communicate to your partner: "I now have this area or match-up and now you can cover weakside etc."? That communication needs to happen and happen as quickly as possible, esp. in 2 man mech.

No more so than any other time an official is "on the ball" -- whether at T, C or L.

I would like to see this done consistently without cutting off your vision (not by me).

It will cut off your vision because the area inside the arc is now the Lead's and if you "square up" to a play in this area who will be watching the weakside/paint while you are transferring responsibility?
Bob, this shouldn't happen in a 3-man game because when the lead and trail should be connected by an imaginary rope, when the lead goes the trail comes down so you will have two C's for a short time. The new C now has the weak side. Who watches this weak side while the trail has the ball and you are squaring up to a play near the arc in a two man game? If it is body language then you are using your body. To maintain your field of vision you would have to be near the sideline so you can still see back into the paint. Instead of me explaining what I mean by squaring up why doesn't someone explain it to me how all of this can happen while someone still watches the paint/weak side?

Yes, Tom, now I see your point, and it's the part I'm having trouble myself being smooth about.

Okay, so here I am at Lead, minding my own business in my primary, with Trail over there on the far side of the paint, above the arc. Now, I see that the ball has dropped down below the arc, and there's a rough pair of post playyers, working for position. But I've got two pairs over here on my side too. What am I supposed to do?

Last year, I was supposed to slide across but looking at an angle back across the paint, seeing these post players on "strong side" but still keeping the other two pair in my line of sight, just in case.

This year, from asking various people this question, it appears that we are supposed to "square up" to take the ball and the competitive match-up, and release the weak side players to Trail, who has to adjust her position accordingly.

I don't like it. But then, I don't like the little skip step that so many boys take right before the shot, which ought to be called a travel, and absolutely never is. When I'm God, things are going to be different around here!!

Do you have a projected timetable for this?

Nothing more specific than, "Not any time soon!!"

Just as in three-person, you don't officiate your new area until you get there; you keep officiating your old area.

That said, you can't watch everything all the time. If I'm going across, it's because I deem whatever is on that side to be "more important" than whatever is on this side. And if / when I pick up the ball it takes T a second to find the competitive matchup back on the other side, so be it.

This is obviously just my opinion, but some of you have made this way more complicated than it really is. First of all, just to be completely clear, when I say "squaring up" it means "the official has his/her shoulders parallel to the boundary line". Until this thread, that's the only definition of "squaring up" I've ever heard, and so that's how I'm going to be using it. Ok, technical terms are out of the way, so. . .

In my experience, the decision for the Lead to go ball side is a fairly easy one. There's only two reasons to for the Lead to go ball side in a 2-whistle game:

1) The ball has been passed into the low-post, or is very likely about to passed into the low-post; or

2) There are two or more players banging for position on the strong side, and there is nobody banging for position on the weak side.

That's it. If neither of those things is true, then stay put. If the ball comes below the FT line in a 1-on-1 situation, then stay put. It's the Trail's primary anyway. Let the Trail take it all the way to the basket.

Now, once you go ball side, you are responsible for everything inside the 3-point arc and below the FT line extended (that's a change this year). So forget about squaring up. Yes, that means that you may have the ball and the bodies in the post, but there is no reason for you to turn your body. Officiate this play exactly as if you were on your "normal" side of the court. Keep yourself angled in toward the lane area. If the play moves toward the 3-point arc, then you move toward the 3-point arc; but stay angled toward the lane. Mirror the movement of the ball.

As to the Trail's responsibility when the Lead comes ball side, the Trail has everything that the Lead doesn't have. So if the Lead came ballside to officiate banging bodies, but the ball is still above the FT line, then the Trail has the ball. If the Lead came ball side to take the entry pass to the post, then the Trail has the other players. Once on the court, this should not need to be communicated. In pre-game, it should be made clear that when the Lead comes across, s/he's either going to have the ball or not; in either case, the Trail has everything else.

Again, just my opinion. Keep it simple.

Chuck, where have you been all of these pages? I totally, totally agree with what you are saying. If you look at this entire thread you will see I said some of the same things. I think we could work together on this and be on one accord!

I hope what I think is going to happen doesn't happen...........................................