Soliciting games/discrimination

[chels]

1. What do you think of a member of your board approaching youth
leagues,summer highschool leagues and offering his services as an assignor to get officials to officiate these leagues at a fee less than our board now charges. We are an IAABO board but
believe that unless they are scholastic games we cant do anything about it.
2. This official and a few of his friends also are claiming discrimination with regards to not getting enough varsity games.
3. What appearance standards do your boards have with regards to facial and acceptable hair styles. How do you enforce them without crossing into discrimination. None of this has to do with religious issues.

[ChuckElias]

Originally posted by chels
1. What do you think of a member of your board approaching youth leagues,summer highschool leagues and offering his services as an assignor to get officials to officiate these leagues at a fee less than our board now charges. We are an IAABO board but believe that unless they are scholastic games we cant do anything about it.

I'm not a lawyer, and I don't know your by-laws or your membership rules, or the agreements (if any) that you have with these various leagues; so it's very difficult to comment intelligently on this question. So, I'll comment unintelligently, and just give you my guess.

Unless you have some sort of exclusive assigning contract with these leagues, I would think that anybody could offer his/her services as either an official or an assignor to the league(s) in question. Around here, there is a sort of agreed-upon assignor for most leagues and he assigns only IAABO officials to those leagues. But for some leagues, they get who they can get. And if another organization came to the league and said, "We'll do your games for $15 per official, instead of the $20 that you're paying now", I'm not sure there's anything really wrong with that. Unless you have some legal reason that prohibits another prospective assignor from trying to outbid your organization, I don't think there's much you could do about it.

Would I like it if somebody tried it within my board? No way. But I'm not sure there'd be much I could do about it.

2. This official and a few of his friends also are claiming discrimination with regards to not getting enough varsity games.

Is the assignor discriminating against them? Let's not pretend it doesn't happen. If they are good officials but not getting schedules commensurate with other officials of similar ability, then that's wrong. If they're just frustrated b/c they want better games without going to camp, or meetings, or whatever, then oh well.

There will always be people who face genuine discrimination. There will also always be people who try to use the issue of discrimination to their advantage, even when it doesn't really apply. The problem is figuring out which is the case.

3. What appearance standards do your boards have with regards to facial and acceptable hair styles. How do you enforce them without crossing into discrimination.

We have guidelines, not rules. Officials are discouraged from any facial hair at all. But we have several varsity officials who have either a mustache or a goatee. Some of these officials are of African descent, but some are not. It's not a racial issue. I think the bottom line around here is, "We really don't like facial hair; but if you're a good enough official, we'll tolerate it."

If you try to put a rule in place about facial hair, that's ok. But you better make sure that: 1) you enforce it uniformly across all racial lines; and 2) that the rules do not prohibit anything that might be reasonably construed as "aimed at" one particular racial or ethnic group. For example, if 99% of all goatee wearers on your board are black, and you only prohibit goatees, you will be in trouble, and deservedly so.

Don't know if any of that helps you, but those are my 2 cents. Good luck.

[cmathews]

I agree with chuck, and I won't bother to comment unintelligently on most of the topics...The facial hair issue though I do have a comment for. I believe it should be a general appearance. There are some people that can wear a full beard and appear very clean cut, there are some that have no facial hair at all and appear to be slobs...at various times I have fallen into both LOL :P. Some folks wear facial hair to cover scars or birth marks/defects, and I think that when you start down this particular path you are opening up a can of worms that may be hard to get the lid back on...

[Mark Padgett]

Originally posted by cmathews
There are some people that can wear a full beard and appear very clean cut,

Damn - not the look I was going for.

[Indy_Ref]

Originally posted by chels
3. What appearance standards do your boards have with regards to facial and acceptable hair styles. How do you enforce them without crossing into discrimination. None of this has to do with religious issues.

The unwritten law...do not wear facial hair. As soon as I see a D-I tournament official wear a beard, then I'll assume it's acceptable!

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by chels
1. What do you think of a member of your board approaching youth
leagues,summer highschool leagues and offering his services as an assignor to get officials to officiate these leagues at a fee less than our board now charges. We are an IAABO board but
believe that unless they are scholastic games we cant do anything about it.

That is clearly unethical. But I do not know of any of my associations that have a "policy" against that kind of practice. Our associations around my block are more geared toward HS ball. So what someone does with some JH or AAU game is really up to them.

Originally posted by chels

2. This official and a few of his friends also are claiming discrimination with regards to not getting enough varsity games.

Well, without knowing any details, I really cannot comment. Other than maybe if your association gives games as a normal practice, they might want to get out of that practice. The assignor should not be affiliated with one group. That might cause some legal conflicts that would put your association at risk. All my associations took "assigning games" out of all their constitutions for this very reasons. They want to have members of the associations, not "employees."

Originally posted by chels

3. What appearance standards do your boards have with regards to facial and acceptable hair styles. How do you enforce them without crossing into discrimination. None of this has to do with religious issues.

They associations have no written standard about any appearence issue. Of course there are personal standards and standards that a particular assignor might have, but out associations are there to "teach and train," not to make demands on the membership about personal issues. The main factor of being a member of an association, is to be licensed with the IHSA, that is about it (and pay your dues of course ).

But I will say this, the only ones wearing any kind of facial hair at the top levels are African-American male officials. I never see any white officials at the D1 or NBA level wearing facial hair. Of course at the HS varsity level, you see guys with facial hair, but it appears to be much more common around African-Americans. Danny Crawford, NBA Official is from my area, and he has a mustache that is well trimmed. He is by far not the only one like that. I really have to think hard about who in any of my associations out of the African-American officials that do not have at least some facial hair. But I really have to think hard of the white officials that have any facial hair. So at the very least, there is some cultural differences.

Peace

[chels]

Why did you take,"assigning games" out of your constitution?
I don't follow you. We are a dual board. IAABO for boys and
NYSGBA for girls.
Thanks

[tomegun]

Distrimination, politics or whatever you want to call it has been a part of this business for a long time and will continue to be a part of it at all levels. I think you should just try to be the best official you can be and sooner or later someone will use you more.

[ChuckElias]

Originally posted by tomegun
Distrimination, politics or whatever you want to call it has been a part of this business for a long time

Is that when somebody refuses to keep his beard neatly trimmed?

[tomegun]

Uh, what had happened was.............................

Discrimination. That made me laugh at the right time of the day. If I type some more crap later will you make me laugh again?

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by chels
Why did you take,"assigning games" out of your constitution?
I don't follow you. We are a dual board. IAABO for boys and
NYSGBA for girls.
Thanks

We are independent contractors. If we work for anyone, it is the schools and the conferences, not the official's association. If the assignment chairperson thinks you are good enough to work for him, then they can hire you, no matter what membership that you hold. Because if the mission of the association is to "assign" games and something goes wrong on any game that is "assigned" by the association, they can sue the official and the association for any action that took place. So to avoid that "impression" of being an employee, they took that wording out of the constitutions. In reality, most officials get there games from many different sources, and being a member of an association does not help me personally and many other officials in getting assigned in a particular conference. I work for more than 5 assignors in my area, only one might be an active member in any of the associations I belong to.

Peace

[TriggerMN]

Andre Patillo is a much-seen African-American official at the D-1 level who has a big moustache. He's also got quite the front porch, which probably wouldn't allow someone to break in. However, he's great to watch, commands authority, and is one of the best in the biz.

[oc]

Originally posted by JRutledge

We are independent contractors. If we work for anyone, it is the schools and the conferences, not the official's association. If the assignment chairperson thinks you are good enough to work for him, then they can hire you, no matter what membership that you hold. Because if the mission of the association is to "assign" games and something goes wrong on any game that is "assigned" by the association, they can sue the official and the association for any action that took place. So to avoid that "impression" of being an employee, they took that wording out of the constitutions. In reality, most officials get there games from many different sources, and being a member of an association does not help me personally and many other officials in getting assigned in a particular conference. I work for more than 5 assignors in my area, only one might be an active member in any of the associations I belong to.

Peace

If you are in more than one board do you have to go to meetings and training for both/all?

I am in one-want to join a second but don't have time for all the meetings.

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by oc


If you are in more than one board do you have to go to meetings and training for both/all?

No. The only requirement for any of my associations that I am a member in, is to pay my dues. Other than that, it is up to me to attend the meetings if and when I can. I attend almost all the meetings that are held.

Peace

[dblref]

Originally posted by tomegun
Uh, what had happened was.............................

Discrimination. That made me laugh at the right time of the day. If I type some more crap later will you make me laugh again?

Just read Chuck's comments and you will always laugh -- particularly when he thinks the Bosux will eventually win a world series.