Covid
 

Does your State require full vaccination in order for you to qualify to officiate post season play?

Haven't heard about that here in Ohio.

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Not in ohio but theres people in the ohaaa admin that would require it in a heartbeat if we didnt have an official shortage.

Omicron ...
 

Connecticut interscholastic athletic officials must sign sworn affidavits (honor system, nobody's checking vaccination cards) that they are fully vaccinated, or complete the necessary paperwork with the Connecticut state association (CIAC) that they have a medical contraindication or firmly held religious or spiritual belief. Unvaccinated officials must undergo weekly COVID testing.

Officials, players, coaches, and fans will all wear masks at all times, however, enforcement for players will not be the responsibility of the officials this year, but the responsibility of game management. Masks will be required, regardless of vaccination status.

Unlimited numbers of masked fans will be allowed. Locker room availability for officials to change and shower will be decided by individual school systems, so we’ve been instructed to show up in uniform.

Full regular basketball season, out of state trips are allowed, and a state tournament is planned.

Protocols above will be evaluated on December 23, 2021, and there may be changes (vaccination status, masks, etc.) if appropriate or necessary.

At this time, of our 270 local members, 55 have chosen not to officiate due to COVID.

I wouldn't work under those conditions either

COVID Protocols ...
 

Too strict, or not strict enough?

Some are floating the idea that after December 23, 2021, only unvaccinated players (and officials) will have to wear masks.

I'm all for masks, but due to privacy concerns, I'm for everybody continuing to wear masks. Private businesses are free to do whatever they want to do in terms of "mask discrimination", but schools are government controlled public places, no need to put a "label" on a minor that says "not vaccinated".

Adolescents have enough to deal with, even without COVID, no need for unneeded additional stress.

Now the leper on whom the sore is, his clothes shall be torn and his head bare; and he shall cover his mustache, and cry, ‘Unclean! Unclean!’ He shall be unclean. All the days he has the sore he shall be unclean. He is unclean, and he shall dwell alone; his dwelling shall be outside the camp. (Leviticus 13:45-46)

They're utterly useless. Its feel-goodism at best, unfortunately its most likely simple harassment by those that really don't have a clue or just like the power trip they've been on for almost two years.

Yeah, and from experience I can tell you it’s a double standard for officials and players/coaches wearing their masks properly. Players wear them like chin straps and nobody bats an eye, but when officials do that they get turned in. Exactly the reason I told my high school assigner I won’t be officiating in a mask this year and that if he wants to use me, I will only go to schools without such mandates.

Fortunately none of my college leagues are requiring masks this year although there is one league where we are supposed to put them on when not actively officiating (it’s laughably stupid that I have to pull my gaiter up during a timeout when I’m 25 feet away from the team huddle).

It’s totally theatrical most of these restrictions.

HS: all have been consistent in requiring/reminding fans to wear masks and for officials when not on the court

College: only have had one school that has been strict in requiring us to wear masks while not on the court.

Have had multiple college supervisors (and one commissioner) remind us we should be masking whenever we engage the table personnel and if we have lengthy engagement with coaches.

Have not experienced any power trips, unreasonable requests, harassment or any other hyperbolic situations. Mostly adults being adults, like life should be.

No. But I work a D2 conference that does. If you are not vaccinated there, you cannot work. High schools do not even require testing, but we have to wear masks all the time for the games.

Peace

The Mask Of The Red Death (Edgar Allan Poe, 1842) ...
 

It's a respiratory droplet infection.

While the efficiency of various types of masks can be debated, there can be no debate that wearing a mask is better than not wearing a mask, for both the mask wearer (protecting one's self, and others) and for those that don't wear a mask in the presence of others who are masked who may have COVID, either symptomatic, or asymptomatic.

Mask wearing is a simple, common sense, and low-cost strategy to mitigate COVID transmission, with few serious side effects.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8084286/

Would mask wearing have prevented 800,000 deaths? No it wouldn't, but even a decrease of 1,000 deaths would have made mask wearing worth it.

Doctors wear masks during surgery for a reason and it's not to look cool.

I would love to know how they plan on figuring that out!

Surgeons don't wear gaiters! ;)

Proof Of Vaccination ...
 

While HIPAA only prohibits healthcare providers and healthcare businesses from disclosing protected information to anyone other than a patient without their consent, school systems are not covered by the law, but are covered by ordinary, common sense, privacy laws concerning minors.

School systems can require, by state law, proof of various vaccinations (Diphtheria, Tetanus, & Pertussis, Polio, Chickenpox, Measles, Mumps, & Rubella, Hepatitis B, and Hepatitis A) for attendance, with all allowing medical exemptions, and some allowing religious exemptions.

It wouldn't be too much of a stretch to make COVID vaccinations or masks required for interscholastic sports. Connecticut interscholastic sports already require proof of a recent physical exam in order to participate.

However, for various reasons, I'm fairly certain that this idea won't fly. Maybe voluntary mask wearing, or everybody wearing masks, but nothing beyond that.

Surgeons wear surgical masks to keep from spitting their gum or sneezing into someones open body cavity.

Absolutely no study has shown that surgical masks do anyrhing for respiratory viruses. Real-time data has shown that masks in highly compliant countries and states where massks were mandated did little to reduce cases. Even fitted n95 have limited effectiveness and need to be changed often

Peer Reviewed Studies ...
 

Read the National Institute of Health article again. Certainly better than a study one finds on Facebook, Twitter, Instagraph, or My Space.

This study cites dozens of studies that say the same thing, masks work.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8084286/

The effectiveness of masks in population-wide scenarios has been proven to be significant … community-based research has demonstrated the efficacy of cloth masks in slowing down the spread of COVID-19 ... For the general public, the use of cloth masks in public settings, such as grocery stores and places of worship, especially in regions with known or suspected widespread transmission, or in situations where physical distancing is not possible, has been encouraged by the WHO and many policy makers ... consistent and proper usage of facial coverings can help minimize symptomatic transmission of SARS-CoV-2 during close contact ... COVID-19 transmission rates are generally lower in countries and regions where citizens are accustomed or required to adopt universal masking, such as many parts of Asia. Simulations and mathematical models have also predicted that the adoption of universal masking would substantially curtail the spread of COVID-19 ... observational studies have presented real-world evidence that suggests mask-wearing helps mitigate community transmission of COVID-19 ... face mask mandates reduced the number of newly reported SARS-CoV-2 infections between 15 and 75% within the first 20 days of their introduction ... study focused on 15 states and Washington D.C., in which all able individuals were mandated to wear a face mask in public settings. Similarly, it was found that face mask mandates were associated with a lower COVID-19 daily growth rate, and that this effect increased over time after the mandates were put in place ... study found that within the first few weeks after the mask mandate came into effect, the average weekly number of newly diagnosed SARS-CoV-2 infections decreased by 25–31% ... mask mandates accounting for an estimated 36–46% reduction in weekly case numbers ... all available epidemiologic evidence suggests that community-wide mask-wearing results in reduced rates of COVID-19 infections.

https://tse2.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.7...=0&w=220&h=166

Rabbit Holes ...
 

The National Institute of Health is not a social media rabbit hole.

I agree with Raymond on one point. If the National Institute of Health can't change one's opinion of masks, then BillyMac posting on the Basketball Forum certainly can't change anyone's opinion of masks. I've got six years of undergraduate and graduate education in science, but it's mostly in geology (Sheldon Cooper's least favorite science). And while I never played a medical doctor on television, I do have an obstetrics and gynecology MD (and Master of International Public Health) daughter; and a COVID (testing and vaccination site supervisor for past twenty months) nurse (RN, BS, MS) daughter; who I get my expert medical advice from, expert advice that I'm willing to share. Nevertheless, BillyMac posting on the Basketball Forum certainly can't change anyone's opinion of masks.

This discussion is going down the rabbit hole.

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Mask Police ...
 

Unfortunately, I also find this true in my games this year. Had a point guard play 32 minutes with a mask under her chin last week. I didn't say a word, not my job this year.

Last year I had to remind several players over the course of a shortened season to wear their masks properly, with only two, or three, "sit a ticks" for failure to comply.

While I like that I don't have to be the "Mask Police" this year, I also feel less safe. I wish that game management would do their job properly.

I absolutely refuse to be the mask police in games I officiate (of course, I won’t work anywhere I have to officiate in a mask anymore). It’s bad enough that we have to enforce fashion police rules.

Car 54 Where Are You ...
 

Agree and agree. Last year we didn't have a choice if we wanted to work. Took some flak from a few parents in the bleachers for doing my job. Glad that they put the responsibility on game management this year, but still wish that they would do their job properly.

Mandatory Physical Exam ...
 

At the middle school that I taught at, such a mandatory physical exam discovered a previously undetected major heart problem in one of my students who was trying out for cheerleading. Parents told me that it saved her life.

NIH is not a credible institution. Name a state or country that has reduced covid by instituting a mask mandate. I read your rediculous study and it's not surprising in its rediculousness if you read it critically. Especially going back and looking at charts of cases that exploded again after that initial reduction claimed by the study

I can show enough charts from the WHO to fill a stadium that shows that there is no corresponding reduction of cases from from the institution. Especially when conparing their results to neighboring states that did not institute mask mandates

Best thing to do for covid is do the normal things to boost your ommuse system, find a doctor that actually treats for covid(not one that tells you to wait till you have to go to the ER and go on a ventilator).

Who's On First ...
 

Big WHO fan, OK, let's hear from WHO:

On June 5, 2020, the WHO released new interim guidance concerning the use of masks amid the COVID-19 pandemic ... For the general public, the use of cloth masks in public settings, such as grocery stores and places of worship, especially in regions with known or suspected widespread transmission, or in situations where physical distancing is not possible, has been encouraged by the WHO and many policy makers.

Vaccinated ...
 

... like getting vaccinated.

American Journal Of Preventive Medicine ...
 

I can't, but the American Journal of Preventive Medicine can:

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2021-...on-covid-.html

Twenty-seven countries with face mask policies and 17 countries without face mask policies, covering a combined population of nearly one billion people, were included in the study ... The top 50 countries according to the United Nations Development Programme Human Development Index, which measures life expectancy, education, and standard of living, were targeted because of comparability and reduced chance of selection bias. Four countries in the Southern Hemisphere (New Zealand, Australia, Chile, and Argentina) were excluded to avoid potential seasonality characteristics. The United States and Canada were excluded because their public health policies are made at the state/province level and a unified national policy does not exist in those nations. Data from the remaining 44 countries were used to model COVID-19 mortality ... A study of the impact of national face mask laws on COVID-19 mortality in 44 countries with a combined population of nearly one billion people found that over time, the increase in COVID-19 related deaths was significantly slower in countries that imposed mask laws compared to countries that did not. The study, appearing in the American Journal of Preventive Medicine, published by Elsevier, shows that masks provide a supplementary layer of protection that could prevent unnecessary COVID-19 deaths.

...like getting the virus.

Natural Immunity And Acquired Immunity ...
 

Agree, but studies show that natural immunity (having COVID) isn't as strong, not as long lasting, and may not be as effective against all variants, as acquired immunity (vaccinations).

Also, the natural immunity of having COVID depends on how severe one's COVID symptoms are. Severe symptoms usually lead to better natural immunity, asymptomatic usually leads to little natural immunity.

Vaccines are consistently strong across the board.

My grandson had COVID (slight symptoms, no hospitalization) before he was eligible for a vaccine. He has since been fully vaccinated (for his age group). His pediatrician says that his antibody levels are now off the chart.

https://tse4.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.9...=0&w=300&h=300

where are the moderators?

OK, let’s try to get back on track here. It just seems ridiculous to me that a state association can require vaccinations for officials, as independent contractors, but not for players and other participants. Officials with exemptions seem to not be recognized by requiring vaccinations with no mention of any exemptions.

Could it possibly be that the higher ups are limiting the playoff pool?

Just trying to understand how this can be enforced.

Thank you. I get enough of that crap elsewhere, can't we just talk about officiating?

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Across The Board ...
 

Our state association (CIAC) based it's protocols (see post #4) in full coordination with the State of Connecticut Public Health Department. Officials, players, coaches, and fans are under the same protocols. Same thing last year, across the board, but with slightly different protocols than this year. My local interpreter actually had a seat at the table when the CIAC (we have a CIAC Officials Association) came up with the protocols, both years. We were kept in the loop all along the way.

Please see #30
I didn't intend for it to go there

I'm not calling anyone out, nor upset at anyone. I just feel things are starting to get heated so we need to move on.

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Post #30 ...
 

One of my favorite posts in this thread.

Nice to get back to our local programming, i.e. basketball officiating.

https://tse3.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.8...=0&w=300&h=300

**** **** ****

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Working Hard Or Hardly Working ...
 

Last year (before vaccination) 40% of our local guys chose not to be assigned games due to COVID.

This year (with vaccinations) 20% of our local guys chose not to be assigned games due to COVID.

We also had a ton of guys retire over that time period, with many saying that while they were thinking about retiring, COVID was the tipping point that pushed their decisions.

Over the past few years our local membership has gone from 320 members (active and inactive) to 270 members (active and inactive), baby boomers now getting too old to run up and down the court, pulling up roots and heading south for warmer temperatures, cheaper taxes, early bird dinner specials, and pickle ball courts.

Trainee classes have been in single digits over two consecutive years.

Still covering the same 70 high schools and many middle schools.

Every year officials get a year older and the schools stay the same age. Wait ... I'm being told ... Players? ... Really? Never mind.

https://tse1.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.z...=0&w=227&h=183

We were specifically asked to keep that with the school and coaches. We play no role in that even though the participants are to be masked.

Peace

Just The Facts Ma'am ...
 

Same here in Connecticut. Last year officials were the "Mask Police".

https://tse2.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.l...=0&w=181&h=165

JRutledge: Do the coaches, site directors, and athletic directors in Indiana and Illinois do good job of making sure that the players are wearing masks properly because game management is doing a poor job of doing that so far this season in Connecticut.

I would disagree....not for ~0.1% reduction. The burden being imposed upon millions (even billions) is just too great for that small impact.

That said, I believe masks are much more effective than that in stopping the ejection of potentially virus carrying droplets into the air. It really isn't that hard to understand. I still hate wearing it, but you really can't argue against the fact that they stop people from spraying stuff into the air. It is basically like covering your nose and mouth when you sneeze/cough. Anyone arguing that masks do nothing must also be arguing that no one ever needs to cover their mouth/nose when they sneeze and should be ok with someone sneezing on them.

And that’s exactly the way it should be and the way it is this year in my area. Unfortunately last year we were tasked with being the mask police which was completely ridiculous and next to impossible.

“If it saves just one life” is quite literally the worst argument ever for imposing a certain restriction.

Numbers ...
 

Yeah, my numbers were faulty (I almost changed it to 10,000 in my original post).

But with 800,000 deaths and millions on ventilators, hospitalized, or just very sick, what would be the "tipping point"? 10,000 dead? 50,000 dead? 100,000 dead? For a simple, common sense, and low-cost strategy to mitigate COVID transmission, with few serious side effects?

Make It Personal ...
 

In general, I agree with you, but it depends on the restriction, and I doubt that this young lady, her parents, and siblings, would agree with you.

It's very different when it's made personal.

As the basketball coach, I had parents (some with no medical insurance) complain every year about mandatory annual physical exams for students who simply wanted to try out for the team, with no guarantee to actually make the team.

Back in the late 1960's, when I was in high school, we got free annual pre-tryout physical exams in the nurses office by a school appointed doctor.

Remember a friend of mine's older brother having a previously undetected major heart problem discovered during such an exam, preventing him from trying out for the football team.

Knee Jerk Reaction ...
 

Agree that it's often stated (see Connecticut's Ethan's Law) as a knee jerk reaction, but I'm pretty sure that most supporters of a restriction do not mean it literally, but figuratively, and that the restriction would actually save many lives. But how many? And at what cost? Aye, there's the rub.

When did I say that the mask requirement was the same in both Indiana and Illinois?

Peace

Game Management Support ...
 

You didn't, but you didn't differentiate states/protocols either ("we") and just left us guessing which one you were talking about. I was just asking how much support you were getting from game management in both states, even if the protocols are different? Feel free to differentiate states and protocols if you decide to reply.

Because it was irrelevant. We were not asked to tell players what do do with masks. If you want to know there was no requirement in Indiana at all to wear masks and still we were not asked to manage that. Illinois masks are required, but again we are asked not to manage that. Do care what game management supports, not our job from the state level to tell kids what to do. That is all on the coaches and teams. If they do not wear a mask properly, we say nothing.

Peace

I don't know the number. I'm sure it would be different for everyone.

We could have saved the equivalent of all of the deaths over the same time period by eliminating smoking and there is no redeeming element to smoking and eliminating it doesn't cause harm to anyone.

Free Country ...
 

States, and the federal government, have tried written warnings, advertising restrictions, excessive excise taxes, location restrictions (restaurants, car rentals, hotels, etc.), age restrictions, suing tobacco companies, etc., but it's a "free country".

Remember when all cars had ash trays and cigarette lighters?

I've been watching black and white Perry Mason (if one likes court shows, it's as good as Law and Order) reruns on cable lately, and everybody is smoking all of the time, everybody just lights up. Watch network television today and it would appear that nobody is a smoker.

I've always maintained that some believe that everyone is very intelligent and can make all of their own good choices in all matters (health, finances, consumerism, etc.), while others believe that everyone is really stupid and the government needs to make most choices for them, but the reality is actually somewhere in between those two extremes. But where? Aye, there's the rub.

Caffeine And Nicotine ...
 

My Dad would beg to differ with you. Eliminating smoking negatively affected my Dad's quality of life. Claimed he picked up the habit getting free cigarettes from the Army during WWII. For the sake of his grandchildren's health, after forty-five years of smoking, he gave it up cold turkey. But to his dying day (not lung cancer) he said he always missed the cigarette he had with his cup of coffee every night after dinner. After a hard day at the office, it was the favorite part of his day. Caffeine and nicotine. That was good living. It didn't get any better than that for him. The simple pleasures of life.

And it makes no difference if he had smoked weed, shot heroin, taken quaaludes, or downed a couple of shots of whiskey after dinner for his enjoyment and quality of life… :rolleyes: He would have felt the same way about it.

Your story just demonstrates that people will do as they desire in the self-harm category with the timeframe of their upbringing and those societal norms having a large influence upon which personal vices are chosen.

You just described drug addiction.

Addiction ...
 

Yes I did, and purposely without mentioning the word addiction.

I'm not a smoker, but some have told me that the combination of nicotine and alcohol is similar to the feelings my Dad had about nicotine and caffeine. I have a friend who only smokes when drinking. Tells me that he has no desire to smoke any other time.

I was addicted to caffeine (five mugs (not cups), black coffee, no sugar, by early afternoon). Gave it up cold turkey (coffee, tea, cola) after I had my heart attack. Had the jitters for several weeks afterward.

Can eating high cholesterol foods, high sugar content foods, or high caloric foods be considered an addiction if one is on the road to a heart attack, stroke, or diabetes?

Does the government, or a health insurance company, have the right to limit one's food intake?

Can one be addicted to social media?

Is there a "runner's high"?

Is sex addiction real?

Enough, let's get back to basketball.

I've got a game this afternoon. New (middle) school and new partner for me. Have heard that it's great middle school league. Long drive, but I'm looking forward to it. I will be double masking (had a few partners do this last year, before vaccinations) to prepare for our family's Christmas celebration.