Assaulted last night

[Hawks Coach]

mplagrow
I agree that I cannot see a reason to include the elementary school game management in on a civil suit, unless it was clear that there had been some kind of problem before.

On any given day, there are a large number of games for this age group that have no game management at all. If there have been problems, you step up security. But I have never seen a physical security presence at an ES game, regularly seen it at MS and HS. The real responsiblity lies with the individual who has lost touch with reality and is assaulting a ref at a little kid's game.

[canuckrefguy]

Sorry, but this "civil vs. criminal" comparison is watering down the issue. Going and filing a lawsuit on a whim is not the point here.

Not every referee harrassment situation deserves criminal charges. But this one, as described, does - for the reasons I vented my spleen over before.

Many people, at many levels, screwed up big time here. People need to be held accountable.

[Indy_Ref]

JR,

How many times have you pressed charges on an individual(s) for a similar act that occurred before, during, or after a game? In your 40+ years of officiating multiple sports, I'm quite sure you've had some instances where you pressed charges.

Please post some of the instances here so we can learn how to handle these situations if/when we decide to press charges in our own future games. I appreciate hearing about some of the other official's experiences that have been posted here. How about hearing about some of yours?

Thanks.

[Hawks Coach]

canuck
I support the idea of filing charges against the perpetrator, but not civil nor criminal charges against a school or principal for this incident - if it is a single, isolated incident. This is a case of a person who lost perspective at an elementary school game.

If you were to file any charges against the principal or the school, you may as well file a preemptive suit against every rec or school league that operates without a physical security presence in the gym. There are lots of them in my area. And while you're filing charges, sue the officiating organization and the assignor for not ensuring that the leagues or schools are providing adequate security prior to assigning officials to games.

[Mark Padgett]

Originally posted by Damian

Again the main lesson is for the official to know when and when not to leave with a crowd around.

This is the same argument as it being a rape victims fault for wearing "seductive" clothing.

I leave when I'm finished. If someone assaults me, they're going to the Big House, baby!

[Indy_Ref]

Originally posted by Mark Padgett
If someone assaults me, they're going to the Big House, baby!

We might as well put them all in the Big House then...since there are several assaults coming down from the crowd over the course of the entire night!

I didn't realize 3-person mechanics was going to mean 2 officials work a game while the 3rd points out assaulters in the crowd!

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by Indy_Ref
JR,
How many times have you pressed charges on an individual(s) for a similar act that occurred before, during, or after a game? In your 40+ years of officiating multiple sports, I'm quite sure you've had some instances where you pressed charges.
Please post some of the instances here so we can learn how to handle these situations if/when we decide to press charges in our own future games. I appreciate hearing about some of the other official's experiences that have been posted here. How about hearing about some of yours?

I'll give you 2 examples from the last coupla years. Please note that I get involved in these because all complaints- both ways- get funnelled through me in our association. Btw, this may be a long post- to fully describe all details.
1)City League varsity boys finals last year: I assigned a very promising, young but experienced official to this game. For his partner, I made sure that he was paired with a take-charge vet. Game was held in a neutral site- a local community college gym- and the game was standing room only. At the end of the game, a male adult followed the young official to the dressing room,screaming and swearing at him. The officials asked gym security to get rid of the guy, and he was escorted out of the building. The fan was identified as a parent of one of the players, who was also a local high school teacher at another school, and had coached Frosh and JV ball at that school. I asked for incident reports from both officials, gym security and other people who had witnessed the scene. We sent these reports, along with a letter, to the committee that oversees high school sports for this league. We also sent copies to the involved fan/parent and the principal of the high school that employs him. Basically, we stated that this type of action was deplorable,and, unless we were given assurances that something like this would not happen again, we would not officiate any games that he was in attendance at-whether he was coaching or watching. We basically told them that if we felt a game wasn't safe for our officials, then we wouldn't be sending any. I also made sure that a long time acquaintance, the sports editor of the local paper,got the story also. He wrote a column on it, without identifying the fan, but deploring his actions.The upshoot was that the fan was completely embarrassed, apologized in writing to everyone that he could think of, and even wrote a "letter to the editor" telling everyone how big an idiot he was. We received similar letters from his principal,the sports council, etc., all stating that they deplored his actions and that they would try to ensure that similar acts wouldn't happen like that in the future. Will it stop future incidents like this? I really don't think so, but it can't hurt- and I know one fan who's gonna behave himself from now on anyway. I hope.

If you think that the above might have been an over-reaction on our part, it flowed partly from this incident the year before:
2)Boy's varsity regional tournament here in town: I was the RIC(referee-in-chief) and assignor. Neutral officials for all games- couldn't be from the league representatives that were playing. The officials (one from my association) had just entered their dressing room after their game ended. Another official who had watched the game had just come to tell the guys that they had done a good job. All of a sudden, the door smacks open and hits the official who had just entered right in the back. It's a fan/father from the losing team who's totally p*ssed at one of the officials. This fan is swearing his head off, threatening the official and trying to get at him. The other official physically held him off, and security then came in and got the guy. Long story short? We laid charges for "threatening" and the school where the game was held laid "trespassing" charges against the fan/parent for going into the dressing room. One plea-bargain later, the fan pleaded guilty to both charges, paid a small fine, and agreed to be barred from his son's gmes until his son graduated.The down side? The threatened official was so shaken up that he said that he would refuse playoff assignments in the future if he was selected. I heard that he did change his mind on that eventually,and I'm glad because I thought that the guy was an excellent official.

Indy,by no means are these all the problems that I've seen over the years- but I'm out of breath. I've just seen so many promising,as well as veteran, officials quit because of the abuse, that I am kind of a fanatic now about not cutting anybody any slack.

[NWRef]

The following is an article published in the Fresno(CA) Bee

http://www.fresnobee.com/sports/hs/s...-8538971c.html

[theboys]

I can understand the desire to file charges, but I would first seek non-litigious avenues of reconciliation. As soon as possible, write down the specifics of the situation. Ask your partner to do the same. Then, meet with your assignor, again as soon as possible, to discuss the events and possible solutions. Then, with your assignor, contact the school, and have a meeting with the principal, the AD (if one exists) and the home coach. Tell them basically what Jurassic told the school officials in the first instance - that your association will no longer officiate games for the school unless action is taken. I would further tell them that if anything remotely resembling the incident happens again you will file charges, and the school and the program will appear in newspapers and websites nationwide. Nothing like adverse publicity to make a school administrator take notice.

I think parents/fans would respond much more positively if they were redressed by school officials. That way, it puts the school on your side, as well. If you pursue legal remedies, the school doesn't have to take a stand, per se, so the parent does feel like its a revenge situation. With the school driving the action, it takes on a more "official" role.

Good luck. As a reformed hothead, I'm truly sorry you suffered this kind of abuse. Just, remember, its not your fault.

[Indy_Ref]

Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
Indy,by no means are these all the problems that I've seen over the years- but I'm out of breath. I've just seen so many promising,as well as veteran, officials quit because of the abuse, that I am kind of a fanatic now about not cutting anybody any slack.

Great post, JR. I agree 100% on how your first instance was handled...and I could be "talked into" accepting the second. More so, because the fan made it to the locker room, yelled assaults, had to be restrained and ushered out by security. The fact that the fan made it to the locker room proves a breakdown in security.

For me, I guess, it's a fine line. In tnroundball's instance, I believe the biggest problem was game management. Word of advice: Any official just calling a heated/controversial game should have enough sense to hang out and not leave too quickly...while fans/spectators/players/coaches are hanging around. Also, any game management personnel worth their money ought to recognize when officials need a little extra protection and take the initiative to ensure their saftey.

Despite what happened to tnroundball, I still can't see filing charges against anybody in his particular case. I would say report the incident and let the assigner & game management take care of it. Had tnroundball gotten hurt or seriously threatened, then take care of it as in JR's case #2. I can certainly agree with that.

[Jurassic Referee]

For Indy, and anybody else that is interested and has a few minutes to spare, here is an excellent article from the National Association of Sports Officials website:

http://www.naso.org/naso_relations/specreports.html

Click on "Officials Under Assault". It's a pdf file.

[Edited by Jurassic Referee on Oct 27th, 2003 at 02:23 PM]

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by Indy_Ref
Word of advice: Any official just calling a heated/controversial game should have enough sense to hang out and not leave too quickly...while fans/spectators/players/coaches are hanging around.

I agree with you if there is some sort of control present in the gym. All those fans who assaulted tnrb outside, were only slightly inconvenienced by the walk. It might have happened anyway, just under the lights and in warmer surroundings, even if he had stayed in the gym. The secret is to judge the climate in the last couple minutes, and before the game ends, find some security or management to stick close to.

Originally posted by Indy_Ref
Despite what happened to tnroundball, I still can't see filing charges against anybody in his particular case.

I think you and some of the other post-ers are confusing filing a lawsuit vs pressing criminal charges. I'm not advising filing a lawsuit. I think that would probably be out of line in this situation. I do think pressing criminal charges is completely appropriate. A crime has been committed, and it is a crime which is rampant in our society and needs to be stopped. That is why the Assault on Officials Laws have been passed, and we should avail ourselves of every opportunity to let the general public know that this ain't okay!

[DownTownTonyBrown]

I know I'm entering this conversation prettylate in the show but...

Initially, when I read the scenario I had this vision of the BAD COP waiting by my car... You know... If I could make it through the crowd then the policeman would reluctantly do his duty to protect me.

For the life of me I'm still wondering where the game administration was? And why wasn't the police dispersing the crowd before the officials entered the fray? Perhaps there were some real issues (albeit inexcusable crowd response) that rose during the game and the adminstrator and the police felt justified in allowing the crowd to have their way.

I've been in the situation of these officials where I thought if I slowed down at all, the crowd would beat the holy crap out of me. And I was working the game with my wife so that tripled my concerns. We weren't touched and we ignored alot of comments, but game mangement was there and ushered us into a safe haven (and it was the home team that lost). Home Team Game Management saved our bacon.

There is something that has changed in my character and the way I handle myself since that game and today. I'm not sure how describable it is. I will try.

I have decided that it is my attitude that determines the attitude of the players, of the coaches, and of the crowd. Me; I determine the situation that I am in. The differences in how I act are subtle, small little things. I can show my disdain for having to make a call. The call was needed. But by displaying the nuances of "wish I didn't have to make that call" I remove the burden of guilt from myself and righfully place it on the players that committed the act. Watching a hot-head a little closer than every other player is an opposite tactic. And any call made on this player must be made with absolute indifference - there can be absolutely be no flavor of "gotcha." An official must display enjoyment at some points of the game, 100% professionalism at others, and a realm of empathy and dissatisfaction upon the need to make particular calls at other times. The tone of the game is not completely in the hands of the officials. There is sure to occasionally be anomalous behaviour from players, coaches, and crowd. It is the officials confidence and ability to address, as needed (and it isn't always needed), and then to subsequently deal with these anomalies that will determine the smoothness of game flow and acceptance of your judgements by the participants.

Again, I wonder what prompted this response from the crowd, and game management, and the police. I strongly feel that somehow this crowd of parents needs to be reprimanded. And that the officials may need to take a strong look at what their own causal factors may have been. JMHO

I feel the official's association needs to take a strong position to defend their officials and not validate these actions by saying nothing. The association should be in game management's (and the coach's) ear saying, "Intentional or not, you screwed up. You should have protected the officials. You should have ensured the parents were gone. You should have ensured the police were in the middle next to the officials and not waiting for them at the end of the gaunlet. You will make some efforts and some public reprimands and these efforts will meet the association leadership's approval or perhaps you can get some of those parents to officiate your games."

Maybe Lawref will work your games unless he is too busy disparaging and condescending the public. smilie included.

[Edited by DownTownTonyBrown on Oct 27th, 2003 at 04:05 PM]

[canuckrefguy]

Originally posted by Hawks Coach
canuck I support the idea of filing charges against the perpetrator, but not civil nor criminal charges against a school or principal for this incident - if it is a single, isolated incident. This is a case of a person who lost perspective at an elementary school game.

I also believe criminal charges would be hard to press against the school, and that it may not be appropriate. I acknowledged in my previous post that schools are in a difficult position. But they have responsibilities.

If, in the process, through negative publicity or whatever, the school is forced to re-examine its policies on fan behavior, sportsmanship, and respect at sporting events, then that is what needs to happen.

The school didn't assault the ref, but they need to examine the possible root causes of this kind of behavior.

[tomegun]

My 2 pennies, tnroundballref has courage. It is easy to make calls for the home team. Right or wrong calls, he had some courage. Please be positive and learn from this. You will be a better official later for looking at it in a positive light.

Rainmaker was right about at least starting the steps to press charges. What are we trying to accomplish? At the very least we do not want this particular fan to do this again. She hit him for crying out loud! With witnesses! She should be banned from the games as long as her child plays ball in this school district. Who cares about a fine, the money isn't going to the ref anyway.
There are children that probably know about this and if nothing happens vs. something happening can help mold their attitude towards officials in all sports for the rest of their lives! It could impact tnroundballref's career and all games/officials at this school and this child's games.

If this is as clear cut as it was posted it will help the game to press charges. For those that do not agree I would like to ask you one question. What good is it going to do if charges aren't pressed?