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-   -   Another example of the NBA officials not caring about enforcing rules (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/105275-another-example-nba-officials-not-caring-about-enforcing-rules.html)

Nevadaref Thu Feb 04, 2021 02:49pm

Another example of the NBA officials not caring about enforcing rules
 
Frequently NBA officials turn a blind eye towards violations when there is no defensive pressure or a player isnít gaining any advantage.
The throw-in by Porzingis in this clip highlighted on ESPN.com is another clear example of illegal action which an official simply ignores.
The entertainment league obviously doesnít desire for this to be called and have a possession taken away from a team.

Someone else can post a link as Iím not certain how to do that for this particular video.

AremRed Thu Feb 04, 2021 09:15pm

Are you sure the reasons you cite are correct? Maybe he just missed it.

Raymond Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:41pm

http://espn.com/video/clip?id=30830253

Rich Fri Feb 05, 2021 10:39am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1041351)
Frequently NBA officials turn a blind eye towards violations when there is no defensive pressure or a player isnít gaining any advantage.

The throw-in by Porzingis in this clip highlighted on ESPN.com is another clear example of illegal action which an official simply ignores.

The entertainment league obviously doesnít desire for this to be called and have a possession taken away from a team.



Someone else can post a link as Iím not certain how to do that for this particular video.



I know even in HS varsity games I don't stare at the ball handler when there's no pressure. Those traveling videos embarrass the officials but I could see that happen to me as I'm looking for the next competitive matchup.

Sometimes it's not a big conspiracy.


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BillyMac Fri Feb 05, 2021 10:42am

NBA Rules ???
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AremRed (Post 1041361)
Are you sure the reasons you cite are correct?

I'd love to see this in slow motion, but is this a violation in the NBA because I'm not 100% certain that it's a violation in NFHS?

It certainly "looks" odd and like it should be a violation, but I believe that he releases the ball before is right foot hits the court inbounds. There is no boundary plane for inbounders (feet, ball, hands, or body) in the NFHS, just defenders.

The running start makes it look odd and the start of the bounce pass looks very much like the start of a dribble, but it isn't.

Just saying, I'd love to see this in slow motion.

BillyMac Fri Feb 05, 2021 10:48am

No Pressure ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich (Post 1041365)
... even in HS varsity games I don't stare at the ball handler when there's no pressure ... I'm looking for the next competitive matchup.

Agree. In many cases our partner should be looking for those matchups, but it's tough for one to observe eight players over an area possibly two-thirds of the court, or more, and I often take a peek upcourt.

https://live.staticflickr.com/3775/1...8029f778_m.jpg

crosscountry55 Sat Feb 06, 2021 08:54am

Related event. I had a team yesterday, down by 20 3rd quarter, lazily not take the ball out of bounds after a field goal (one of those mental errors a team makes when they are frustrated). No defensive pressure. A1 passed to A2 who started to advance the ball. ďTweetĒ...I called the violation.

A few years ago, or if itís not a varsity game, I probably let this go on the basis of situation, time, and score. After the game my R (much older) said I should have. But, meh....these days everything is on video (NFHS.net, YouTube, etc.), plus you never know whoís watching, so I made the call.


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bob jenkins Sat Feb 06, 2021 09:15am

Quote:

Originally Posted by crosscountry55 (Post 1041383)
Related event. I had a team yesterday, down by 20 3rd quarter,

Plus, it's better to learn this lesson when the team is down by 20 and it doesn't cost them anything than to learn the lesson when they are down by two and it costs them the game (or they blame the ref for costing them the game)

Rich Sat Feb 06, 2021 09:22am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 1041367)
Agree. In many cases our partner should be looking for those matchups, but it's tough for one to observe nine players over an area possibly two-thirds of the court, or more, and I often take a peek upcourt.

https://live.staticflickr.com/3775/1...8029f778_m.jpg



I have two partners in every game and I still don't stare at unpressured ball handlers.


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Danvrapp Sat Feb 06, 2021 09:47am

Quote:

Originally Posted by crosscountry55 (Post 1041383)
Related event. I had a team yesterday, down by 20 3rd quarter, lazily not take the ball out of bounds after a field goal

Could you have gotten away with a whistle and a quick "Hey...take the ball OOB!" Without knowing the details of your play, what rule did they violate? If the player was never OOB to pass it in, what violation occurred?

Nevadaref Sat Feb 06, 2021 10:25am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danvrapp (Post 1041386)
Could you have gotten away with a whistle and a quick "Hey...take the ball OOB!" Without knowing the details of your play, what rule did they violate? If the player was never OOB to pass it in, what violation occurred?

9.2.2 SITUATION C: A1 scores a basket. After the ball goes through the net, B1
grabs it and makes a move toward the end line as though preparing to make a
throw-in. However, B1 never legally steps out of bounds, both feet remain
inbounds. B1 immediately passes the ball up the court to a fast-breaking teammate, who scores a basket. RULING: Cancel Team B's goal, throw-in violation on B1. The ball was at B1's disposal after the made basket to make a throw-in. B1 must be out of bounds to make a legal throw-in. (7-4-3; 7-5-7)

crosscountry55 Sat Feb 06, 2021 10:33am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1041387)
9.2.2 SITUATION C: A1 scores a basket. After the ball goes through the net, B1
grabs it and makes a move toward the end line as though preparing to make a
throw-in. However, B1 never legally steps out of bounds, both feet remain
inbounds. B1 immediately passes the ball up the court to a fast-breaking teammate, who scores a basket. RULING: Cancel Team B's goal, throw-in violation on B1. The ball was at B1's disposal after the made basket to make a throw-in. B1 must be out of bounds to make a legal throw-in. (7-4-3; 7-5-7)


Archive Challenge: There was an interp a while back that clarified the violation occurs at the point Team B begins to advance the ball.


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crosscountry55 Sat Feb 06, 2021 10:34am

Another example of the NBA officials not caring about enforcing rules
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Danvrapp (Post 1041386)
Could you have gotten away with a whistle and a quick "Hey...take the ball OOB!"?


Not in a varsity game.


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BillyMac Sat Feb 06, 2021 01:07pm

Smile, You're On Candid Camera ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by crosscountry55 (Post 1041383)
... these days everything is on video ...

Regarding every grandmother in the stands now having a video camera in their cell phones, the biggest change for me is the rebounding situation where A1 makes some "over the back" contact with B1 with both players touching the ball before it goes out of bounds, off B1's finger first by a split second.

Back before the proliferation of video cameras I could simply call this play off A1 and give Team B the ball for a throwin. Win, win, win situation. I didn't have any tough decisions to make, Team A head coach was happy because his player avoided a foul, and Team B head coach was happy because his team had the ball. Everybody was in on it, we all had an "understanding", we all knew the secret handshake, and everybody was happy. A wink, a nod, and a smile.

Forty years ago, here in my little corner of Connecticut, this technique was actually taught to rookie officials by highly respected veteran officials.

No more. Now I have to decide if the contact created any advantage/disadvantage, and if not, give the throwin to Team A.

By the book, as it probably should have been called forty years ago.

https://tse2.explicit.bing.net/th?id...=0&w=276&h=167

Rich Sun Feb 07, 2021 09:28am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 1041391)
Regarding every grandmother in the stands now having a video camera in their cell phones, the biggest change for me is the rebounding situation where A1 makes some "over the back" contact with B1 with both players touching the ball before it goes out of bounds, off B1's finger first by a split second.

Back before the proliferation of video cameras I could simply call this play off A1 and give Team B the ball for a throwin. Win, win, win situation. I didn't have any tough decisions to make, Team A head coach was happy because his player avoided a foul, and Team B head coach was happy because his team had the ball. Everybody was in on it, we all had an "understanding", we all knew the secret handshake, and everybody was happy. A wink, a nod, and a smile.

Forty years ago, here in my little corner of Connecticut, this technique was actually taught to rookie officials by highly respected veteran officials.

No more. Now I have to decide if the contact created any advantage/disadvantage, and if not, give the throwin to Team A.

By the book, as it probably should have been called forty years ago.

https://tse2.explicit.bing.net/th?id...=0&w=276&h=167



It's not every grandma in tne stands, it's that every school is streaming every game in the COVID era. HD cameras, announcers, the whole package.

I can watch almost all of the 32 games I've worked so far this season.


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Nevadaref Sun Feb 07, 2021 09:49am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich (Post 1041365)
I know even in HS varsity games I don't stare at the ball handler when there's no pressure. Those traveling videos embarrass the officials but I could see that happen to me as I'm looking for the next competitive matchup.

Sometimes it's not a big conspiracy.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

That would make sense if there were any other players on that half of the court, but in this case there arenít any. It is just the official, the inbounder and a teammate in the backcourt. The official isnít looking at a nearby matchup, he just isnít paying any attention to the routine, unpressured throw-in.

Rich Sun Feb 07, 2021 09:52am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1041400)
That would make sense if there were any other players on that half of the court, but in this case there arenít any. It is just the official, the inbounder and a teammate in the backcourt. The official isnít looking at a nearby matchup, he just isnít paying any attention to the routine, unpressured throw-in.


And I can see myself making that mistake in a moment, too. I'm just saying I don't see it as a nefarious plot to not call violations.

The better the play the better we expect them to do basic things.


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BillyMac Sun Feb 07, 2021 12:13pm

Is This Microphone Working ???
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich (Post 1041401)
... a nefarious plot to not call violations.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 1041366)
... I'm not 100% certain that it's a violation in NFHS? It certainly "looks" odd and like it should be a violation, but I believe that he releases the ball before is right foot hits the court inbounds. There is no boundary plane for inbounders (feet, ball, hands, or body) in the NFHS, just defenders. The running start makes it look odd and the start of the bounce pass looks very much like the start of a dribble, but it isn't ...

For those of us that don't officiate NBA games, is this an actual NFHS violation? If so, why?

BillyMac Sun Feb 07, 2021 12:22pm

Slight Murmur By The Fans ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich (Post 1041401)
And I can see myself making that mistake in a moment ...

I've had a few of these over forty years. I barely notice something "odd" in my peripheral vision, and there's a slight murmur by the fans, and I say to myself, I wish that I was paying closer attention.

Defensive coaches seldom complain because on routine no pressure backcourt throwins they're usually communicating with their players upcourt regarding defensive assignments. Of course, offensive coaches aren't going to complain for obvious reasons.

But there's always a few fans of the offended team in the bleachers, often near the endlines, who notice and complain, thus the slight murmur from the crowd in the cheap seats.

JRutledge Sun Feb 07, 2021 04:18pm

I see a lot of officials do not pay attention to throw-in legality and mostly after a made basket. This looked bad, but often it is too routine for many of us so we do not pay attention to the details.

I say this because I have called these violations with no pressure only to be argued how much they did not violate. It is actually kind of funny how lazy players are to make throw-ins sometimes.

Peace


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