Fun With Up And Down ...

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

However, if the ball simply slips from his grasp after he has become airborne, he may not regain control in the air and return to the floor as that is a traveling violation.

Originally Posted by BillyMac

2000-2001 BASKETBALL INTERPRETATIONS SUPPLEMENT #1 SITUATION 1: Al is an airborne shooter preparing to release the ball on a shot attempt. Instead of releasing the ball on the try, Al fumbles the ball (while still in the air) and drops it. Al then returns to the floor and secures possession of the ball. RULING: Traveling violation. While airborne the bail must be released for a try or pass. (4—43-3a; 94)

Note: My comments and questions below are not based on this actual video play where the ball was blocked by an opponent, but rather on the annual interpretation cited by Nevadaref (and what some of us wanted to call an "up and down" violation).

While the annual interpretation is very clear that this (ball slips from grasp while airborne) is a violation, I question why?

4-44-3: After coming to a stop and establishing a pivot foot:
a. The pivot foot may be lifted, but not returned to the floor, before the ball is released on a pass or try for goal.
b. If the player jumps, neither foot may be returned to the floor before the ball is released on a pass or try for goal.

Is this not a try for goal?

4-41: ART. 2 A try for field goal is an attempt by a player to score two or three points by throwing the ball into a team’s own basket. A player is trying for goal when the player has the ball and in the official’s judgment is throwing or attempting to throw for goal. It is not essential that the ball leave the player’s hand as a foul could prevent release of the ball.
ART. 3 The try starts when the player begins the motion which habitually precedes the release of the ball.

4-21: A fumble is the accidental loss of player control when the ball unintentionally drops or slips from a player’s grasp.

If indeed this is a try for goal (even with the fumble), the ball was released, thus allowing the player to regain possession, even allowing the player to start a new dribble if he had already dribbled.

A shooter is allowed to retrieve his own airball if the official considers it to be a shot attempt.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Note: My comments and questions below are not based on this actual video play where the ball was blocked by an opponent, but rather on the annual interpretation cited by Nevadaref (and what some of us wanted to call an "up and down" violation).

While the annual interpretation is very clear that this (ball slips from grasp while airborne) is a violation, I question why?

4-44-3: After coming to a stop and establishing a pivot foot:
a. The pivot foot may be lifted, but not returned to the floor, before the ball is released on a pass or try for goal.
b. If the player jumps, neither foot may be returned to the floor before the ball is released on a pass or try for goal.

Is this not a try for goal?

4-41: ART. 2 A try for field goal is an attempt by a player to score two or three points by throwing the ball into a team’s own basket. A player is trying for goal when the player has the ball and in the official’s judgment is throwing or attempting to throw for goal. It is not essential that the ball leave the player’s hand as a foul could prevent release of the ball.
ART. 3 The try starts when the player begins the motion which habitually precedes the release of the ball.

4-21: A fumble is the accidental loss of player control when the ball unintentionally drops or slips from a player’s grasp.

If indeed this is a try for goal (even with the fumble), the ball was released, thus allowing the player to regain possession, even allowing the player to start a new dribble if he had already dribbled.

A shooter is allowed to retrieve his own airball if the official considers it to be a shot attempt.

A fumble is a fumble, it is not releasing the ball for a try or a pass.

If it were the same as releasing for a try, then if A2 fouled B2 while the ball was airborne during the fumble, you have to allow B2 to shoot bonus free throws.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Raymond

A fumble is a fumble, it is not releasing the ball for a try or a pass.

Thanks Raymond. Great point.

So even if one were to consider this to be a throwing for goal, or a throwing for goal attempt, it's not the try itself, but it's only the actual release of the ball for a try, not a fumbling of a try (the release of a fumble), that allows the shooter to retrieve one's own airball.

The rule doesn't say: If the player jumps, neither foot may be returned to the floor before the ball is released on a fumble.

I see your point but I also see the real need for this annual interpretation to simplify and clarify such. Too bad the NFHS didn't consider this annual interpretation important enough to permanently be in the casebook.