Dribbler Bears Responsibility for the Contact
Sometimes as an official and an observer, I will invariably see these two scenarios:
1) A1 dribbling along the sideline with defender moving parallel and in close proximity, then A1 just keeps on dribbling forcing his/her way into a narrower and narrower opening/path betw. B1 [defender] and the sideline, until ultimately A1 has no more room and is dribbling OOB on the sideline. Invariably, the player turns in an exasperated fashion towards the official and beckons for a "force out". 2) A2 is slashing their way thru the lane and encounters B3 and B4 [who were there first] in a double-team help defense, then A2 made contact with them and trips over the leg(s) of B3 and B4, and falls down. Invariably, a "block" is called on B3 or B4 despite the defenders(s) having been their first. Invariably, I have seen fouls called on the defense; however, such calls disadvantage the defense---ostensibly unfairly. Has anyone else seen such and what has been the ruling or non-ruling? |
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Peace |
Force Out ...
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Force out was a real rule back in ancient times. https://youtu.be/HqynTsrlxvM |
One Is A Foul, One Isn't A Foul ...
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#2...where are B3/B4's legs? Inside the width of the shoulders our outside? It is hard to trip over the legs if the legs are inside the shoulders. If outside, that would be a block. |
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#1. I think there are just too many factors in play here for it to be anything but a HTBT. Is the defender square to the ball carrier in the parallel movement or shoulder/hip to shoulder/hip? As space is shrinking is the offense taking a path the d is matching or is the d angling in and making the o change their angle? Is this happening through presence or contact? Is the defender maintaining LGP throughout or constantly re-establishing? Sort of thing that each situation is going to be unique but I definitely have no interest in bailing out offense for trying to drive through a space that is too small to get through if that is the case.
#2 I think this one is often misdiagnosed by the camp of officials and their assignors who've decided that they don't want bodies on the floor without a call. Two players in LGP or at least a spot they are entitled to on the floor and and offense comes in ducking, diving, leaning, trying to find/create space and ends up clipping someone's thigh, hip etc and going flying on the finish. Its not a PC but because they feel like they have to have something they find something the defense did wrong. Not everyone is comfortable letting out of control offense create bumper cars in their games so they are coming up with calls on everything when the offense just goes hard at the basket. |
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I'm seeing a player running down the court and dribbling along the sideline with a defender also running down the court beside the dribbler and slowly veering into the dribbler such that the contact is never great but such that it eventually nudges the dribbler out. That defender is not moving laterally but towards the dribbler, slightly, losing LGP in doing so and committing a foul that put the offense at a disadvantage. And that is assuming the defender even had LGP to start with. Running down the court beside someone is usually not LGP. |
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