Tech or Throw in Violation? - Page 2

JeffTheRef · #16 (**permalink**) Sat Oct 18, 2003, 02:15am

out of bounds to avoid the 3-second call is just to make the 3-second call. Guerilla justice.

JeffTheRef · #17 (**permalink**) Sat Oct 18, 2003, 02:18am

before they wisely changed the rule, I occasionally would whistle that circumstance down and call traveling. Knowledgeable coaches knew without being told that they had just dodged a bullet.

Jurassic Referee · #18 (**permalink**) Sat Oct 18, 2003, 05:59am

Quote:

Originally posted by JeffTheRef
before they wisely changed the rule, I occasionally would whistle that circumstance down and call traveling. Knowledgeable coaches knew without being told that they had just dodged a bullet.

Oh my!

Knowledgeable evaluators would be shooting bullets at you for that one!

How about the other knowledgeable coach on the opposite bench in this situation? The one that knows that you just made the wrong call? The one that knows that he just got screwed out of the two foul shots that he should have had coming if you hadda made the right call? What could you possibly say to him? Helping one coach while you're screwing the other isn't really the way that the game is supposed to be called, imho! Using judgement is whether or not you're going to make a call- not making up your own rules.

Have you got any other rules that you like to make up, in lieu of using the ones already in the rulebook?

[Edited by Jurassic Referee on Oct 18th, 2003 at 06:11 AM]

ChuckElias · #19 (**permalink**) Sat Oct 18, 2003, 09:23am

Quote:

Originally posted by JeffTheRef
out of bounds to avoid the 3-second call is just to make the 3-second call.

Only if you're in the NBA. That's not justice, dude. That's just a screw-up.

JeffTheRef · #20 (**permalink**) Sat Oct 18, 2003, 09:41am

would expect I would exercise the same good game management judgment were it his moron involved.

"How about the other knowledgeable coach on the opposite bench in this situation? The one that knows that you just made the wrong call? The one that knows that he just got screwed out of the two foul shots that he should have had coming if you hadda made the right call?"

Jurassic Referee · #21 (**permalink**) Sat Oct 18, 2003, 10:46am

Quote:

Originally posted by JeffTheRef
would expect I would exercise the same good game management judgment were it his moron involved.

"How about the other knowledgeable coach on the opposite bench in this situation? The one that knows that you just made the wrong call? The one that knows that he just got screwed out of the two foul shots that he should have had coming if you hadda made the right call?"

Do you really believe that calling a player for travelling because they swung their elbows is good game management? If they took a punch at someone,what would you call then? A backcourt violation?

Sorry to disagree with you,but imo what you're doing is terrible game management.

JeffTheRef · #22 (**permalink**) Sat Oct 18, 2003, 01:55pm

Life is complicated. Basketball is complicated, too - perhaps somewhat unnecessarily so because the rules are not well written.

Of course that's easy for me to say. The weight of what is is a hell of a burden. To fix it, or scrap it and start over? That is the 'to be or not be' of engineering - whether of bridges, software, or rule-based systems.

That being said, some rules are excellent, some are mediocre - and judicious application can be useful.

"If they took a punch at someone,what would you call then? A backcourt violation?"

Nicely rhetorical. Of course not. I'd toss 'im. It isn't the rule governing fighting, or its application, that's at issue.

In some game, somewhere, some guy is right on the edge. Were the elbows exactly traveling faster than the waist? Is the action truly a reflection of 'criminal' emotion, or is he blowing off steam? You might warn him. Or you might - well, you might have, since because it was such a bad rule its no longer an issue, the penalty is changed - call him for traveling and smile when he protests and the coach tells him to be quiet.

Professional driver, closed course.

Jurassic Referee · #23 (**permalink**) Sat Oct 18, 2003, 02:27pm

Quote:

Originally posted by JeffTheRef
In some game, somewhere, some guy is right on the edge. Were the elbows exactly traveling faster than the waist? Is the action truly a reflection of 'criminal' emotion, or is he blowing off steam? You might warn him. Or you might - well, you might have, since because it was such a bad rule its no longer an issue, the penalty is changed - call him for traveling and smile when he protests and the coach tells him to be quiet.

[/B]

You might have called him for travelling. Very,very few other officials would have done the same thing,imo. The only officials that I have met that would do such a thing, fortunately, did not stay with our avocation very long. They certainly never progressed to officiate any meaningful games either.