Northern VA Officials Associations

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by ilyazhito

.. the MPSSAA does not prohibit officials from belonging to more than one association per sport. There are even officials in MD who belong to both IAABO and non-IAABO organizations for high school basketball ...

If an individual official is allowed to join two organizations, and is actually in two organizations, both that he likes, plenty of good assignments, no political drama, fair membership responsibilities, fees, etc., no excessive meetings, etc., why wouldn't he just pick one and stick with it? What advantages does one get by being in two organizations? Just because one is allowed to do something doesn't necessarily mean that one should do so. Don't the logistics become burdensome belonging to two organizations? Double the meetings? Double the annual membership fees? Maintaining two different availability calendars? Dealing with two assigners?

Again, this is a completely foreign concept to me so please be patient and bear with me.

[ilyazhito]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

If an individual official is allowed to join two organizations, and is actually in two organizations, both that he likes, plenty of good assignments, no political drama, fair membership responsibilities, fees, etc., why wouldn't he just pick one and stick with it? What advantages does one get by being in two organizations? Just because one is allowed to do something doesn't necessarily mean that one should do so. Don't the logistics become burdensome belonging to two, or more, organizations?

Again, this is a completely foreign concept to me so please be patient and bear with me.

People in the DMV tend to live in one jurisdiction and work in another. A guy I work football with in EBO, lives in Virginia and calls games for both Board 12 and Board 134, in addition to being on the Centennial Conference basketball staff. I believe that this gentleman can do this because he works in DC and can easily travel to both PG County and to the various private school games that Board 12 services.

Some officials might have a board close to home that they work with, and another board closer to work that they could also work for. When I went to class at the UMD campus in College Park, I was considering joining Board 134 in addition to Board 12, because I would be able to travel to other Prince George County schools, even without a car (I was already working high school baseball in Prince George County at that time) for exactly that reason. I ended up joining MBOA because they had contracts for schools in the District of Columbia and other suburbs that I could easily reach from home or class.


I'd say that if officials can manage the logistics of being both high school and college officials, or of working multiple sports, they can manage working in multiple boards.

The reason why I will also be in Cardinal this year is that I can get varsity experience if I do well on the evaluations that they will conduct for me as a transfer official, and get placed as either a swing or a varsity official (Most groups classify officials into non-varsity/subvarsity and varsity categories for assigning purposes. Cardinal also has swing officials, who can be assigned both subvarsity and varsity games. They work mostly a subvarsity schedule, but can work varsity if needed.). Even if I do not end up working varsity games this year, I will still have exposure to the Steve Gordon camp that Cardinal Basketball Officials Association runs every year, and the Summer Evaluation Program, where I can get training and feedback to help me move up to the varsity level, in addition to whatever other camps I might attend. I have more geographic flexibility this season than last season, because the graduate program that I am currently enrolled in is online.

LRZ, are you sure about IAABO officials in PA? AFAIK from reading the IAABO manual, there are IAABO boards that are at the same time chapters of the PIAA, such as Board 70 (the Central Pennsylvania Basketball Officials Association), who participated in filming the 3-man mechanics training DVD for IAABO. Unless I am mistaken, Board 65 (the Suburban Philadelphia Board) still exists and still services the Catholic schools in the Philadelphia area. Board 67 in Berks County still exists too, is known as the Berks County Basketball Officials Association, and services high school basketball in Berks County.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Why would anyone have the need to "formally" belong to a second high school organization?

Originally Posted by ilyazhito

People in the DMV tend to live in one jurisdiction and work in another ... Some officials might have a board close to home that they work with, and another board closer to work that they could also work for.

Good answer.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by ilyazhito

XXXXX XXXXX, a guy I work football with in EBO, lives in Virginia and calls games for both Board 12 and Board 134, in addition to being on the Centennial Conference basketball staff. I believe that Mr. XXXXX can do this because he works in DC and can easily travel to both PG County and to the various private school games that Board 12 services.

ilyazhito: You're fairly new to the Forum. Unless you got permission from Mr. XXXXX to use his name on the Forum, I suggest that you don't do so. You may want to go back and edit your post to delete his name. I made the same mistake when I first joined the Forum, the named person found out, and he was very displeased.

Our local board strongly discourages us from posting on forums like this under our real name, and strongly encourages us to post anonymously on such forums. I actually respect those who post under their own name, and don't hide behind anonymity. Even if a member choses to post with his real name, that doesn't necessarily mean that his colleagues would want their names posted.

BillyMac is not my real name, I'm really Dr. Frank N. Furter, a sweet transvestite from Transsexual, Transylvania.

[ilyazhito]

Just edited to remove the person's name. BTW, my username is based on my real name, so it is not hard to guess who I am, especially if you have an IAABO manual on hand with the directory.

I was expecting to hear something from our NoVA forum members like Player989random, but New England and the Mid-Atlantic members have been active instead.

[LRZ]

AFAIK, all PA schools throughout the state that are PIAA-affiliated (public, Catholic, charters) are officiated by PIAA-certified referees. There may be independent schools, private or charter, that use IAABO, although I do not know this for a fact. Secondly, IAABO boards may co-exist with PIAA chapters, but I think refs wear PIAA patches, not IAABO, for school games. Lastly, IAABO may assign some rec leagues, but, again, I do not know this for a fact, and all the rec leagues I work and know of use PIAA officials.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Our local board strongly discourages us from posting on forums like this under our real name, and strongly encourages us to post anonymously on such forums.

Originally Posted by ilyazhito

... my username is based on my real name, so it is not hard to guess who I am, especially if you have an IAABO manual on hand with the directory.

Here's the memo we go from IAABO International a few years ago:

With the onslaught of social media (Facebook, LinkedIn etc.) there are many ways for officials to become controversial very innocently. Officials love to talk, I am sure you know the old saying "tell a ref tell the world". How often does the conversation between officials start with "I had this play" and then we continue with one upsmanship and "I had this play" and so on. We were always concerned when we were having an adult beverage in an establishment talking basketball, being heard by someone as we made comments about a coach, player or even rowdy fans. Why wouldn't we have the same concern today where, instead of being out in public making comments we now make them online? The danger again is that we do not know who views these comments, and we do not know what they will do with these comments.

In regards to basketball, I have watched officials put up a play online and ask for comments from others and there may be responses from a number of officials that give their "opinion", many of which are incorrect rulings. It amazes me that officials did not ask their own interpreters who have been IAABO trained and most likely can provide the correct response and rule citation. The interpreter also has another resource and that Is Peter Webb who is IAABO's Coordinator of Interpreters and who will respond to each and every question with the correct ruling and rule reference within 48 hours.

My concern is that an errant comment made by an official can come back to haunt them, in fact most Division 1 conferences have added this clause to the officials contract. "The office must refrain from any public criticism of the conference, Conference staff, coaches, student athletes, and Conference athletic departments. This criticism includes communicating with the media, and other basketball officials, as well as any method of social or electronic media (Facebook, Twitter, Linkedin, email etc.). Any violation of this policy will result in disciplinary action being taken, which could include one or more of the following actions: private reprimand, suspension or termination".

This may filter down to the state athletic associations in the near future, thus the point of this article is to give our officials a heads up on what is happening in our officiating world. You just might want to give some thought to the above before you make that next "click".

Here, in my little corner of Connecticut (note the geographic non-specificity), my local board came up with much stronger language, to post anonymously.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

If an individual official is allowed to join two organizations, and is actually in two organizations, both that he likes, plenty of good assignments, no political drama, fair membership responsibilities, fees, etc., no excessive meetings, etc., why wouldn't he just pick one and stick with it? What advantages does one get by being in two organizations? Just because one is allowed to do something doesn't necessarily mean that one should do so. Don't the logistics become burdensome belonging to two organizations? Double the meetings? Double the annual membership fees? Maintaining two different availability calendars? Dealing with two assigners?

Again, this is a completely foreign concept to me so please be patient and bear with me.

No different than being in multiple College conferences. Keep your Arbiter up-to-date.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Raymond

... being in multiple College conferences.

Would one be in multiple college conferences because one probably wouldn't get enough games for a "full schedule" from an assigner from just one college conference?

Back when the University of Connecticut was in the Big East (otherwise known as the good old days) I could have sworn that Big East games were officiated by a small group of officials because I kept seeing the same officials several times a season, at Gampel Pavilion (Storrs UCONN campus), at the XL Center (Hartford, CT), or on the road on television. With the small number of guys that I kept on seeing over and over again, and with the large number of schools in the Big East, it seems like these guys had a pretty full schedule just the in Big East.

[ilyazhito]

One might get a full schedule, but John Clougherty, the former coordinator of the ACC, limited the amount of games that his officials could receive, ostensibly to keep them fresh, so many ACC officials would join other conferences to get games when there were gaps in their ACC schedules. The same thinking might have applied for other conferences as well.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Would one be in multiple college conferences because one probably wouldn't get enough games for a "full schedule" from an assigner from just one college conference?

....

Officials get in multiple conferences because officials don't make their own schedules nor do conferences pay the same fees, so officials make themselves available to multiple supervisors.

It's not rocket science Billy. We are INDEPENDENT CONTRACTORS. Are officials supposed to sit at home and only work games on nights that a specific conference has games? When conference play begins, half the teams are on the road and half are at home. That means that conference only needs at the most 24 officials. Should the same 24 officials work every game for a particular conference? How about D2 and D3 conferences? Who should cover those games? Don't you think a D2/D3 supervisor likes it when a D1 guy is available to work?

[JRutledge]

Well in basketball I belong to 3 different organizations in Illinois. I belong to one right now for Indiana (moved to the border a little over a year ago). All organizations are located in different areas, have different assignors that are members, have a different meeting night and have a different group of members in most cases. I joined each for different reasons as well. The one I have been a member of the longest was one of the first camps I attended this organization ran when I came to the Chicago area. We are truly independent contractors here. Associations do not assign games as it would violate laws in our state if they did so or treated us as employees. Associations here are training organizations that have networking elements to them.

Peace

[ilyazhito]

So your commissioners are not the same people as the assignors? It's interesting, because in the DC area, association commissioners are the assignors for the scholastic level, with assistant commissioners or additional commissioners assigning the subvarsity and/or recreational levels.

However, the Commissioners are not the ones in charge of the association, so maybe that allows independent contractor laws to be satisfied. The President and Executive Board run day-to-day activities in their association, and Presidents, Commissioners, and Executive Board Officers are usually elected. However, if a vacancy occurs before an election, the President may appoint a person to fill the vacancy, which is what happened recently in Board 12 when their longtime Commissioner retired a few months after being re-elected.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by ilyazhito

So your commissioners are not the same people as the assignors?

Right. Just like Jeff, I belong to 4 different associations and get HS assignments from about 10 assigners. Add in more for college.

In some areas, "assiciations" are set by the state and control almost everything in their area -- and sometimes officials can only belong to one association.

In others, associations are just a group of officials who like to get together (on a more formal basis that "meet at the bar after Firday's game") and you can belong to more than one and assigning is different.

In some, the state itself does all the assigning.

Some have variations based on sport.

There are 50 states and 52 ways of doing things. All that matters is you understand how it's done in your area (or areas if you work in multiple states).

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Associations do not assign games as it would violate laws in our state if they did so or treated us as employees. Associations here are training organizations that have networking elements to them.

My local association/board, is also primarily a training organization. We hire an assignment commissioner. He is an employee ($35,000.00 annual salary, one year contract) of our local association/board. We are always paid by the schools, conferences, or state, we never get paid by the local association/board. Never, ever.