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Old Fri Apr 06, 2018, 06:05pm
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Spin move - D2 Title game (Video)



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Old Fri Apr 06, 2018, 07:27pm
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it's a travel. But honestly, I just never see these called and I don't really care if they aren't. I still think it's impressive that players can do it and have the balance. It is a very difficult call to make. I think these videos are helpful though and I did tell a really good high school player who did a couple of similar ones that she was getting close to traveling and explained why. It's very difficult to do a spin move (no dribble) without traveling. I called her one on and she was good with it. I guess a part of me does not want to see refs go travel crazy by calling them. They don't happen a lot and I prefer we catch the ones that are more clear.
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Old Fri Apr 06, 2018, 08:37pm
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Old Sat Apr 07, 2018, 06:13am
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I think he traveled twice. The hop at the beginning of the move (although that one is close) and the spin.

And, yes, I call it when I see it.
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Old Sat Apr 07, 2018, 09:06am
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Originally Posted by bob jenkins View Post
I think he traveled twice. The hop at the beginning of the move (although that one is close) and the spin.

And, yes, I call it when I see it.
I agree. Always listen to Bob! I call it when I see it.

This season after the second time I called his center for travelling on her spin move. The coach didn't ask why. He just said " but that's what I taught her." I had a good laugh to myself, and moved on.
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Old Sat Apr 07, 2018, 11:25am
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I started calling it this year after a video session with my association convinced me that, absent a skillful extra dribble, these are always travels.

I can’t subscribe to the feeling that I shouldn’t call these. Change the rules if you want this move to be legal, but at the end of the day under the current rules, my calls are defendable upon video review.

I feel like violations aren’t as subjective as fouls. The only judgment I need to apply is whether or not I’m sure a travel occurred. Based on good training, I’m now sure one did 90% of the time I see this move. So…I call it.


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Old Sat Apr 07, 2018, 08:36pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins View Post
I think he traveled twice. The hop at the beginning of the move (although that one is close) and the spin.

And, yes, I call it when I see it.
Even though I haven't worked any games in quite some time, I still know enough to agree with Bob. As always, he is right-on.
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Old Sun Apr 08, 2018, 08:54pm
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Travel, obviously. The travel rate on these spin moves is higher than 99 percent. Ultra-rare is the proper execution under NFHS rules.

Nonetheless, I almost always lay off in my games because NOBODY wants this called a travel, rules be damned. Not players, not coaches, not fans, and most importantly, not assignors.
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Old Mon Apr 09, 2018, 08:25am
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Originally Posted by ODog View Post
Travel, obviously. The travel rate on these spin moves is higher than 99 percent. Ultra-rare is the proper execution under NFHS rules.

Nonetheless, I almost always lay off in my games because NOBODY wants this called a travel, rules be damned. Not players, not coaches, not fans, and most importantly, not assignors.
I find it interesting that this is still a travel by rule. FIBA changed their rule, and the NBA rules already allowed it. No one wants it called and now the NFHS and NCAA rule sets are the only ones where it is technically still a travel world wide.
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Old Mon Apr 09, 2018, 03:19pm
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Originally Posted by ODog View Post
Travel, obviously. The travel rate on these spin moves is higher than 99 percent. Ultra-rare is the proper execution under NFHS rules.

Nonetheless, I almost always lay off in my games because NOBODY wants this called a travel, rules be damned. Not players, not coaches, not fans, and most importantly, not assignors.
This, all of this.
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Old Mon Apr 09, 2018, 03:24pm
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Originally Posted by Pantherdreams View Post
I find it interesting that this is still a travel by rule. FIBA changed their rule, and the NBA rules already allowed it. No one wants it called and now the NFHS and NCAA rule sets are the only ones where it is technically still a travel world wide.
And we care why what FIBA does? Does not the best players in the world often come from this country? Unless I am missing something the best players in the NBA are American outside of the "Greek Freak." And it appears he traveled before the actual spin anyway. Is that part legal in FIBA rules?

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Old Tue Apr 17, 2018, 02:01pm
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Originally Posted by Pantherdreams View Post
I find it interesting that this is still a travel by rule. FIBA changed their rule, and the NBA rules already allowed it. No one wants it called and now the NFHS and NCAA rule sets are the only ones where it is technically still a travel world wide.
I find it interesting that we expect 3rd graders to not travel, but not the best athletes in the world. This is just laziness.

What's funny is that, until FIBA changed the rule, FIBA officials called a many more travels on the spin move than NCAA officials.
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Old Tue Apr 17, 2018, 02:35pm
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Originally Posted by EricH View Post
I find it interesting that we expect 3rd graders to not travel, but not the best athletes in the world. This is just laziness.

What's funny is that, until FIBA changed the rule, FIBA officials called a many more travels on the spin move than NCAA officials.
I understand your point but...the bottom line is:

For third graders, it is about their education. The best athletes in the world are about our entertainment.
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Old Tue Apr 17, 2018, 03:04pm
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Originally Posted by EricH View Post
I find it interesting that we expect 3rd graders to not travel, but not the best athletes in the world. This is just laziness.

What's funny is that, until FIBA changed the rule, FIBA officials called a many more travels on the spin move than NCAA officials.
I find a lot of things "interesting" in theory versus application. It is what it is and will change when the expectation of coaches, assignors, and all officials change at any given level.
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Old Wed Apr 18, 2018, 08:03am
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I find a lot of things "interesting" in theory versus application. It is what it is and will change when the expectation of coaches, assignors, and all officials change at any given level.
Just think about this though. Why does a FIBA or NBA player need a "gather step"? He doesn't. The defense is placed at a disadvantage (because he must move backward and keep himself in LGP) when the offensive player is allowed to continue moving (after a pass) or change direction (during a spin move) at full speed without dribbling. This was the reason for the pivot foot rule in the first place.

If we are going to give the offense more latitude, we should do the same for the defense. We should get rid of LGP altogether. If the defensive player is not moving toward the offensive player and the offensive player hits the defensive player in the torso, it should be a PC foul. This would put offense and defense on equal footing.

Last edited by EricH; Wed Apr 18, 2018 at 08:07am.
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