Play location
 

I know during the shooting of a Technical foul, the other 9 players do not have to be behind the half court line, but I can not find the wording for this anywhere. If someone could let me know where the wording is located, I would greatly appreciate.

NFHS 8-1-3: ART. 3 . . . If the ball is to become dead when the last free throw for a specific penalty is not successful, players shall not occupy any spaces along the free-throw lane lines.

8-1-5: ART. 5 . . . Any player, other than the free thrower, who does not occupy a marked lane space must be behind the free-throw line extended and behind the three-point line.

I believe these rules are the only language we have to go by. Technical foul free throws are just free throws that will be followed by a dead ball, as is true for intentional fouls or fouls that occur when or just after time expires.


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MBilica is right. You won't find ruling that specifies anything about players' location during a technical foul free throw, because that's not where the rules differentiate. The distinction in the rules is between players along the lane and players not along the lane.

Someone who has always believed that players must go to the backcourt during these free throws, and who refuses to believe otherwise, will ask you for a rule reference. The only answer is to quote these two rules and ask them to provide you with a rule reference that provides additional restrictions on any free throws where no one gets to be along the lane.

And just to show I can predict the future:

The next response will be that it's just good game management to get them back there.

The alternative is to make players go to their benches in order to separate them, again for good game management or something.

So, what we have with the game management argument putting them in the back court is that the players crowd along the division line, often right on top of each other. I don't think that is necessarily better with regards to game management.

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He's Predicting what someone who says players have to be behind division line would say when you point out that the rules only require them to be outside three point line and beyond FT line extended. They will come up with another reason to justify it.

If they are outside the three point line and beyond FT line extended they are complying with rules.

There is a pretty strong myth that players have to be behind half court. When my son was playing middle school, that myth was assiduously enforced....

In many areas, MS refs officiate myths rather than rules. Some of the myths are correct, others are not.

MS? I've seen it at HS and even college. Some people are just better at BSing than they are at being technicians.

Amen. Varsity and college officials are sometimes the worst offenders of officiating using myths. And these myths then trickle down to the lower levels.

Ive seen players just automatically go back there without any instruction from the officials. Just because they all go behind the division line doesn't mean it is the officials fault (in that game).

If they want to stand there, I'm not telling them to go somewhere else.

^^ This. Rare is the player these days who confidently remains in the frontcourt.

Like jpg, I don't get involved, unless I happen to notice a teammate nervously telling another to get behind the division line. That's when I may (depending on the temp of the game) take the opportunity to debunk.

I never said it was the officials' fault. I simply concurred with Camron that upper-level officials can be just as bad at perpetrating rules myths as lower-level officials.

True. I think it's more prevalent at the MS level (and below). It's definitely more excusable, because many MS assigners have horrible training programs. HS and college refs have no such excuse, IMO.

Sadly, very true. My son's CYO league claimed that it had certified refs for the "varsity" (read: 8th grade), but with ththe prevalence of myths (or imported NBA rules) being used in some games, I really wondered what that certification was. (We also got some very good refs. My daughter had a playoff game with a three man crew that clearly worked together -- I assumed it was a group that volunteered.)

Are these the officials doing this or the players themselves? I never tell players to go anywhere but not be on the line. They tend to go to the division line. So if you see them go there in my game, I did not have to tell them much of anything.

Think about it, is there really a reason to be right around the circle or 3 point line? I do not see one as there is no immediate rebound.

Peace

Possible Reason ...
 

Keeping both teams behind the division line would unfairly restrict the ability of one coach to privately confer with his players.

I have had coaches ask if they can confer with their kids? So it is clear that somewhere, somehow they feel they cannot do such a thing. That is not only on the officials, I am sorry it is not. Some things are done simply out of practice or assumption and it does not have to be us that is preventing them from being in certain places. Because if they go there, I am not telling them not to go there. That is their right.

Peace

this is a myth that starts early, and is perpetuated by officials who actually enforce it. For some reason, no one ever questions this. They question everything else under the roof, but this, they follow without question. Then, when we (the refs who know the rule) work a game, everyone just goes without being told anything.

+1

What are we supposed to tell them when they just go to a certain place and it is legal to be there? I have even had coaches talk to their players on the other side of the court. What are we supposed to tell them, "You guys can be right near the 3 point line?" If they go to the division line, I am not stopping them. And in a 3 person game, that is kind of where the Trail is going to be anyways.

Peace

I'm going by what I've actually heard other officials tell players/coaches, not inferring anything from what the players do on their own.

I'm not just talking about this situation but situations in general. There is a number of officials out there that perpetuate various myths.

I have also heard officials misuse the rule as well, do not assume that when players do something, they had to have been instructed by the officials on that particular game. And there are plenty of people that are not officials that perpetuate myths. Just like someone saying "Over the back" or "moving screen" that feel these are also rules, but they keep yelling at officials about them.

Peace

Kinda reminds me of MS/HS soccer games when players get hurt, coaches and some officials tell all the players to "take a knee". I have played, coached, and reffed for 20+ years and have never understood why.

I dislike players gathering at the division line for T. They tend to continue the banter from the previous play. I have seen games like this where a T was called during a T. Yuck!

Kids should just go to their benches, both for getting calm and receiving instructions, but as mentioned, no legal requirement for such actions.

I have posted about this before, but I had a partner a few years ago that not only required the players to all stand behind the division line, but told the coach on the other end of the court that he could not confer with his players because the coach on the bench on the end where we were shooting couldn't either. I guess he was trying to make things fair but he screwed up two rules (Or rule myths) at the same time.

I am also amazed that this is the only thing that no one ever questions when it is enforced. It's like we could tell them to go stand on their heads and they would do it. It has been on the Part 2 test several times too, including this year. I still hear people say they enforce it for "game management" reasons even if they know the rule.

How Often Does One See Calvin Coolidge Quoted On The Forum ???
 

Excerpt (below) from my Non-Pulitzer Prize winning article, Things Officials Should Probably Not Be Saying In A Game.

Calvin Coolidge once said, "The things I did not say never hurt me." Of course, he was not talking about basketball, but many officials would be smart to heed his sage advice as they communicate with coaches, and players.

"Everybody get behind the division line”, often said by an official before free throws for a technical foul, or an intentional foul, is also not rule based. According to the rule, the nine non-shooters shall remain behind the free throw line extended, and behind the three point arc, and do not have to stay behind the division line. In some cases, this may allow players to legally converse with their coaches.

Where did I suggest or say anything to make you think I want us to do something about it? I don't care where players go by the time they get to my game. You're arguing against statements I never made.

It sounded to me like you were implying that officials are the ones that give the players or coaches the bad information.

I called a T last week in a game and I did not say anything to the players at all. They migrated to the division line if I recall and no one told them not to go there by either the coaches or the officials. I think it is just one of those things that everyone seems to feel is the rule and they just do it anyway.

Peace

He did suggest there are officials giving the players/coaches bad information. But, he never said that we should do anything to counter that instruction. He only suggested that no players or coaches ever question that, they just do it.

Officials are indeed directing player to go there. I've heard it....in high school. What if you have a partner call a T on a kid for being in the frontcourt talking to his coach while the FTs are being shot? Are you going to just let that be?

I am sure there are officials "somewhere" that are directing the players on some level just like there are officials that do other things that are not rules based. But I just have not run into anyone in a very long time that even said anything to the players other than getting off the lane. Where they go I cannot think of a single official in any recent situation telling them to specifically go to the division line.

Well we can play the "What if" game all day. But I have never heard or seen anyone T anyone for where they stand during a T free throws, at least in any game I was working. Usually to work varsity ball here you have to kind of earn that opportunity and not make obvious rules mistakes. And I certainly never require players to not be in the FC. The closest thing I ever can remember to an official trying to prevent players from talking to their coach and that official was quickly corrected. I never suggested that I would "let it be." I just do not see this epidemic that you and others are suggesting seems to be a common problem. Even at the lower levels I do not see that kind of instruction. Players go to the division line on their own.

Peace

Get Back To Where You Once Belonged (The Beatles, 1969) ...
 

Players often don't recognize that an intentional foul has been called, or aren't familiar with the restrictions regarding non-shooter positions for such a foul. When they start to line up on the lane line, I just wave them back and say "Get back". I don't care where they go, as long as it's not in the restricted area. I'm not giving a rules clinic out there.

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