Thanks Jay
 

I didn't see the game. I didn't see the play.

All I know is this authoritative assessment was the first thing on my newsfeed tonight.

Jay Bilas ‏@JayBilas 2m2 minutes ago
HORRIBLE charge call on Jalen Jones. It was a secondary defender, not in legal guarding position, in the restricted area. HORRIBLE CALL.

Typical night at the office for Bilas.

Did the offensive player extend an arm or knee into the defender? If so, the RA is not relevant.

I just watched the play (3:54 of the 2nd half for those interested) and - while Jay Bilas may be annoying - he may be right. I say may because I'm not sure of the NCAAM interp on this particular play.

The defender in question switched to cover Jones and was on the RA when contact took place. The only issue is no one was guarding Jones before the defender switched so I don't know whether under the NCAAM code he's considered secondary.

As an FYI, the play in question under the NCAAW code would be a PC because Jones received the ball in the LDB.

Haven't seen the play, but I had something similar Saturday. Defense was playing a trapping zone and somehow left the opposing team's best player unaccounted for on the baseline. He received a long pass from way above the 3-point line. Someone slid over to take a charge in the RA. I did not consider that person his primary defender because no one was playing any type of defense on him prior to him receiving the pass. (And for the record, he received the pass just outside of the Women's LDB.

I looked at the video last night (on WatchESPN - can't find anything on espn.com) and wondered the same thing - Arkansas was playing their press/zone and Jones sort of got lost in it. Though to me, that means he beat his primary defender since the defender near the basket switched off another player to look to take a charge.

There's a case play similar to a player not being guarded in a zone:

A.R. 97. Team B is in a zone defense. A1, who is located on the perimeter of Team B’s zone, passes the ball to A2. A1 then cuts behind B1, who is the defender at the top of the zone, and receives a pass from A2 while just outside the restricted area. After receiving the pass, A1 then crashes into the torso of defender B2 who has established initial guarding position inside the restricted area. The Lead official calls a blocking foul on B2.

RULING: The official is correct. B2 is a secondary defender because A1 is deemed to have beaten B1 when he cut behind B1 on the perimeter of the zone defense. As a secondary defender, B2 may not establish an initial legal guarding position in the restricted area for the purpose of drawing a player control/charging foul when defending a player who is in control of the ball or has released the ball on a pass or try.

I also think the L missed that one. There was another charge with 1:00 to go on Caruso that ESPN writers, broadcasters ("I think that his feet were moving"), and Bilas were complaining about. I thought the refs got it right on that one.

As an aside - just want to say thanks JetMetFan for doing all your video posts. I really appreciate how you label each one, and then slow it down for the call. Can I ask what you use to capture and edit the video?

Here's the play...

<iframe width="960" height="720" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/TVw_KvC-9-0?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Looks like an RA block. I wonder if he considered this player a primary defender? That is the only explanation for that call.

Peace

Agreed with JRut. I also wonder why another official didn't come in with RA information.

Can a player be the primary defender on two different offensive players? If not then he is unquestionably a secondary defender.

I don't see why not. The primary/secondary is with reference to the offensive player and who is in position to defend him/her.

He was the only player in position to have a chance at guarding him.

The definition of a secondary defender is:

"....is a teammate who has helped a primary defender after the player has been beaten by an opponent because he failed to establish or maintain a guarding position. A defensive player is beaten when the offensive player's head and shoulders get past the defender."

It looks to me like he is a secondary defender. At least that is my understanding by normal practice.

Peace

The defender was a secondary defender. The reason he missed the call is simple. He did not realize the defender was in the RA. The C is more responsible for this mistake than the L. The C has to be engaged, and then bring the information to the L.

This is not possible. You can only be the primary defender on one offensive player. It might not be spelled out as so in the rules, but it is certainly implied based on the rulings about secondary defenders and the RA when the defense is playing zone and also on out numbered fast breaks.

Fast breaks and double teams of the low post aside, you must have a primary defender before the player in the arc becomes a secondary defender. The case plays show that a player has to go past/beat one defender before the player setting up inside the arc is called a secondary defender. AR 95 is the zone play. Offensive player is on outside of zone, runs past B1 and alley oop thrown to him. B2 sets up inside the arc and the crash occurs after the offensive player catches the pass. Block because of RA. Play says when offensive player ran past B1 that made B2 the secondary defender.

As far as the question about whether a player can be a primary defender on two offensive players---I believe it is possible however, there' only going to be one crash. In the example above I gave, if two players are standing on the perimeter of the zone and both of them run past B1, either one of them could catch the alley oop and if B2 is in restricted area when crash occurs he would be considered secondary defender. The offensive players ran past B1 making B2 the secondary defender of whichever one caught the ball. Rare but I think possible.

In this play in video the player didn't appear to run past anyone, he caught the ball and no one was between him and the goal. The defender helped, no doubt, but unless there was a primary defender at some point before, the player in the arc does not become secondary IMO. The player was clearly in the arc. I'm guessing he called the charge because he determined the defender wasn't a secondary defender.

Johhny may have access to more plays that prove I'm wrong. I'm just reading the rules and the current case plays. Havnt seen any special videos on it. I'd be interested to know if there are any others Johnny or if there was an interpretation on this play. Thx.

On the play in the video, 5 white is the primary defender. Even if he wasn't, the defender that tried to take the charge was a weak side defender who was guarding another player. He is therefore a secondary defender.

As a point of clarification, in an out-numbered fast break, all defenders are secondary defenders. It does not matter if the offensive player beats another defender or not.

Anytime a perimeter offensive player moves inside the perimeter zone defenders, he is considered to have beaten them, even if none of them were specifically guarding him at the time. When an interior defender or a weak side defender establish initial guarding position inside the RA, they are considered secondary defenders.

When Adams was the coordinator of officials, there were numerous examples of plays similar to the one posted here. In every case, the defender that moved from guarding one offensive player to another was considered a secondary defender.

Finally, I asked 15 other officials currently working D1 men's basketball if they can think of any situation where a defensive player could be the primary defender on more than one player. Every one of them said it was not possible and would not be adjudicated that way by them or anyone they knew. And yes, I know the sample size is very small.

It's clearly a help side play and the kind of thing the arc is for. That's why I thought there'd probably be more plays about it. My juco leagues don't require arbiter ncaa portal so I don't see the plays. I should probably get on there.

I still think in the example I gave, A1 and A2 both run by B1, then there was a catch and crash in restricted area it would be a block no matter which playerA1, or A2, caught the pass. It just really doesn't matter. There is only one crash by one player. If that player got by someone then the next defender is secondary.

I would like to see more info when zones are involved.

Exactly my point, you can be a secondary defender against more than one offensive player, but you can only be the primary defender of one offensive player.

I think we're saying the same thing a little differently. Are there zone secondary defender interps on ncaa portal?

Maybe, maybe not. But this player was in position to be declared the primary defender. He was between the offensive player and the basket the entire time. He didn't rotate over to get there. I think it is likely that he was just briefly screened off staying with the player he was guarding then got free of the screen. If we had more of the clip, I think we'd see the offensive player cutting under the basket with him following the entire way until he hit the screen. Then the offensive player got the ball and reversed into him. Thus, making him the primary defender all along. On top of that, it wouldn't be the kind of play the RA was intended to apply to.

Need to see if that defender was screened or switching. Need longer video.

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