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BillyMac Sat Nov 28, 2015 02:21pm

Four’s Company ...
 
Below is a near final draft of an article that I plan to have published in our local Board's newsletter. I realize that this is a local, "When in Rome ...", issue, but I would still like some feedback from Forum members (I am not a great writer. I'm a great lover, a great singer (there are two kinds of Irishmen, those who are great singers, and those who think that they are great singers), a great basketball official, but, unfortunately, I'm not a great writer.

Four’s Company

No, this is not a sequel to the late 1970’s, early 1980’s, television show, Three’s Company, adding a fourth character to the trio of Janet Wood, Chrissy Snow, and Jack Tripper. Rather, it’s about the importance of having four officials at the site of a typical junior varsity, varsity, doubleheader. There are educational, practical, and professional, reasons for having four officials at the game site.

For many years, it was a Board policy to have varsity officials show up early to observe, and rate, the junior varsity officials, and to have the junior varsity officials stay to observe, and rate, the varsity officials. Recent changes in the Board rating system has done away with the need for officials to rate nonpartner officials, but that doesn't do away with the need for four officials to be at the game site for as long as reasonably possible. According to the Board 2015-16 Member Expectations Policy, “Varsity members arrive early to observe subvarsity officials and subvarsity officials remain to observe varsity officials”.

The four officials at a high school game site should work together as a team. Varsity officials should arrive at the game site no later than the beginning of the second period of the junior varsity game, to observe the junior varsity officials. Junior varsity officials should stay, and observe, the varsity game until at least halftime of the varsity game, in order to learn by watching experienced officials. Many varsity officials will try to show up for the beginning of the junior varsity game, and many junior varsity officials will often stay to observe the entire varsity game.

Veteran officials should observe, and offer constructive appraisals, with specific suggestions, to less experienced officials. Less experienced officials should seek out, and ask for input, from more experienced officials. "So? What did you see out there?” is an easy way to start a pregame, halftime, or postgame, conversation. The continuing education, and improvement, of officials is vital to the continued success of the Board.

There are also practical reasons for having four officials at the game site. The overlap will insure that an official is available if one of the officials at the site becomes ill, or injured. In rare cases, an official may be late to the game due to unexpected traffic conditions, a flat tire, dead battery, etc. In extremely rare cases, an official may not show up for a game due to a miscommunication, or a scheduling, error. The Board does have One Person Mechanics Guidelines in place, but it is best if we have two officials working every game.

The third reason for having four officials at a game site deals with professionalism. If principals, athletic directors, site directors, and coaches, do not observe an overlap of officials over the course of a junior varsity, varsity, doubleheader, they may get the impression that the officials simply want to “get in, get out, and get paid”. This is not the impression that Board members want to give. School personnel at the game site notice such things as junior varsity officials, and varsity officials, observing each other, and discussing the game at pregame, halftime, or postgame. Officials acting in this manner will solidify the reputation of the Board as “The Best”.

Gutierrez7 Sat Nov 28, 2015 03:17pm

Great article and thank you for sharing. Below are my suggestions for your review.

Note: I cut and paste your article into "Word" and then repasted. Let me know if you want the tracked corrected version in Word.



Four’s Company

No, this is not a sequel to the late 1970’s, early 1980’s, television show, Three’s Company, adding a fourth character to the trio of Janet Wood, Chrissy Snow, and Jack Tripper. Rather, it’s about the importance of having four officials at the site of a typical junior varsity, varsity, doubleheader. There are educational, practical, and professional reasons for having four officials at the game site.

The four officials at a high school game site should work together as a team to educate each other. Varsity officials should arrive at the game site no later than the beginning of the second period of the junior varsity game, to observe the junior varsity officials. Veteran officials should offer constructive appraisals, with specific suggestions, to the less experienced officials. Junior varsity officials should stay and observe the varsity game until at least halftime of the varsity game, in order to learn by watching more experienced officials. Less experienced officials should seek out, and ask for input, from more experienced officials. "So? What did you see out there?” is an easy way to start a pregame, halftime, or postgame conversation. The continuing education and improvement of officials are vital to the continued success of the Board.

There are also practical reasons for having four officials at the game site. The overlap will insure that an official is available if one of the officials at the site becomes ill or injured. In rare cases, an official may be late to the game due to unexpected traffic conditions, a flat tire, dead battery, etc. In extremely rare cases, an official may not show up for a game due to a miscommunication or a scheduling error. The Board does have One Person Mechanics Guidelines in place, but it is best if we have two officials working every game.

The third reason for having four officials at a game site deals with professionalism. If principals, athletic directors, site directors, and coaches do not observe an overlap of officials over the course of a junior varsity, varsity doubleheader, they may get the impression that the officials simply want to “get in, get out, and get paid”. This is not the impression that Board members want to give. School personnel at the game site notice such things as junior varsity officials and varsity officials, observing each other and discussing the game at pregame, halftime, or postgame.

For many years, it was a Board policy to have varsity officials show up early to observe, and rate, the junior varsity officials and to have the junior varsity officials stay to observe, and rate, the varsity officials. Recent changes in the Board rating system has done away with the need for officials to rate nonpartner officials, but that doesn't do away with the need for four officials to be at the game site for as long as reasonably possible. According to the Board 2015-16 Member Expectations Policy, “Varsity members arrive early to observe subvarsity officials and subvarsity officials remain to observe varsity officials”. Officials acting in this manner will solidify the reputation and continued success of the Board as “The Best”.

BillyMac Sat Nov 28, 2015 03:28pm

Dostoyevsky, I'm Not ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gutierrez7 (Post 971063)
... The four officials at a high school game site should work together as a team to educate each other.

I already made the change. Thanks.

Dad Sat Nov 28, 2015 03:28pm

I'll do you a favor no one else will.

Don't try to write fancy if you have no idea what the rules of grammar are.

The article alienates way too many people and has zero net gain if published.

BillyMac Sat Nov 28, 2015 03:35pm

Help !!!
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dad (Post 971067)
Don't try to write fancy if you have no idea what the rules of grammar are.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 971061)
(I am not a great writer.)

I'm a retired middle school science teacher, and an environmental chemical analyst, not a writer, yet I was assigned to my local Board's Communication Committee. That's why I asked for help.

Now, ask me how to analyze the amount of Total Kjeldahl Nitrogen in a sample of effluent sewage water. I'll blow your socks off.

Dad Sat Nov 28, 2015 03:41pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 971068)
I'm a retired middle school science teacher, and an environmental chemical analyst, not a writer, yet I was assigned to my local Board's Communication Committee. That's why I asked for help.

Not writing fancy was the most helpful tip I could give you. You write like you'd talk to someone and just place commas all over the place. If you simplify your writing it makes it more engaging for the reader.

The topic is just something I would never let someone publish. While it may be something an individual finds important to them, it's going to spit in the face of anyone who isn't on board. In most demographics it's never going to sit well.

Dad Sat Nov 28, 2015 03:42pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 971068)
I'm a retired middle school science teacher, and an environmental chemical analyst, not a writer, yet I was assigned to my local Board's Communication Committee. That's why I asked for help.

Now, ask me how to analyze the amount of Total Kjeldahl Nitrogen in a sample of effluent sewage water.

It's obvious you're highly intelligent; Getting it on paper is an art form.

BillyMac Sat Nov 28, 2015 03:55pm

When In Rome ....
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dad (Post 971069)
The topic is just something I would never let someone publish. While it may be something an individual finds important to them, it's going to spit in the face of anyone who isn't on board. In most demographics it's never going to sit well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 971061)
... this is a local, "When in Rome ...", issue ,,,

"All politics is local" (Speaker of the U.S. House Tip O'Neill, 1982)

Although I've recently had an article published in the IAABO Sportorial, this article, Four's Company, is only for my local board. Since a recent change in our rating system, we have many officials who think that they can just show up, work their game, and leave. That my be 100% alright for many Forum members, but it's not alright here in my little corner of Connecticut.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 971061)
Board 2015-16 Member Expectations Policy, “Varsity members arrive early to observe subvarsity officials and subvarsity officials remain to observe varsity officials”.

This article is just a friendly reminder to our local officials that includes a rationale for our policy.

Dad Sat Nov 28, 2015 04:20pm

It's not friendly when it alienates most new officials. New professional referees with high potential don't like the idea of wasting an entire night learning nothing. They'd rather show up, do a great job, and go home with some money.

Everyone learns in their own way and I don't care how they do it as long as they make my association better. Being the best is about having the best, not about arbitrary expectations of an imaginary rationale.

Freddy Sat Nov 28, 2015 04:39pm

Huh???
 
With all due respect to the previous critique given... No, strike that. With NO due respect to the previous critique given... :confused:
What you were assigned to communicate, based on your board's wishes seems to have been clearly and forthrightly expressed. No overly flowerly language, no undue or harsh criticism, no calling people out unjustly, no "from the top down" pontificating (that's three commas in a sentence without a verb - :o). This, meant for a closed group of officials, seems fitting for wider distribution beyond that to associations whose expectations are similar. Now, you know me. I'm about the most stuck-up grammar nazi there is on this Forum. Ending sentences with prepositions, for instance, is something up with which we ought not put. And you and I have privately critiqued each other's work many times, so I'm ready to suggest improvements if/as necessary. However, as to any alleged violations of rules of grammar, I don't detect none for you to give your attention to. :D
Looks good. Print it.
:)

BillyMac Sat Nov 28, 2015 04:43pm

Check Your Local Listings ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dad (Post 971072)
New professional referees with high potential don't like the idea of wasting an entire night learning nothing. They'd rather show up, do a great job, and go home with some money ... not about arbitrary expectations of an imaginary rationale.

These are not arbitrary expectations, but it is policy on my local Board. Not observing the first game, or not staying for the second game, will impact an official's future assignments.

In the past this policy was carved in stone (with established penalties; assignment penalties, and cash penalties), now it's only carved in wood, so officials need to be reminded of their member expectations.

Again, this is a "When in Rome ..." thing, and I'm fully aware that local listings will be much different in other geographic areas.

Dad Sat Nov 28, 2015 04:56pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 971075)
These are not arbitrary expectations, but it is policy on my local Board. Not observing the first game, or not staying for the second game, will impact an official's future assignments.

In the past this policy was carved in stone (with established penalties; assignment penalties, and cash penalties), now it's only carved in wood, so officials need to be reminded of their member expectations.

Again, this is a "When in Rome ..." thing, and I'm fully aware that local listings will be much different in other geographic areas.

Goodbye potential.

There is no good reason to have this expectation except personal whims. They think it's practical, educational, etc.

At least they are moving in the right direction. I can't even fathom cash penalties.

Adam Sat Nov 28, 2015 05:22pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dad (Post 971076)
Goodbye potential.

There is no good reason to have this expectation except personal whims. They think it's practical, educational, etc.

At least they are moving in the right direction. I can't even fathom cash penalties.

There is an expectation in my area, in the two other metro areas I've worked, that JV officials will stay and watch a few varsity games every year. Do they have to stay every time? Absolutely not.

Rich Sat Nov 28, 2015 05:47pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dad (Post 971072)
It's not friendly when it alienates most new officials. New professional referees with high potential don't like the idea of wasting an entire night learning nothing. They'd rather show up, do a great job, and go home with some money.

Everyone learns in their own way and I don't care how they do it as long as they make my association better. Being the best is about having the best, not about arbitrary expectations of an imaginary rationale.

New officials working subvarsity HS games are not guys that, typically, learn nothing by observing more experienced officials -- if they're looking for items to take away.

I agree that having this as written policy is absurd, however.

Dad Sat Nov 28, 2015 05:47pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam (Post 971077)
There is an expectation in my area, in the two other metro areas I've worked, that JV officials will stay and watch a few varsity games every year. Do they have to stay every time? Absolutely not.

To be fair, this is entirely different.

To move up in our association you need to get three reviews throughout a single year. I have no problem with helping officials.

Adam Sat Nov 28, 2015 05:56pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dad (Post 971079)
To be fair, this is entirely different.

To move up in our association you need to get three reviews throughout a single year. I have no problem with helping officials.

It's different only in degree.

Refhoop Sat Nov 28, 2015 06:01pm

Four’s Company

No, this is not a sequel to the late 1970’s, early 1980’s, television show, Three’s Company, adding a fourth character to the trio of Janet Wood, Chrissy Snow, and Jack Tripper. Rather, it’s about the importance of having four officials at the site of a typical junior varsity, varsity, doubleheader. There are educational, practical, and professional reasons for having four officials at the game site.

The four officials at a high school game site should work together as a team to educate each other. Varsity officials should arrive at the game site no later than the beginning of the second period of the junior varsity game, to observe the junior varsity officials. Veteran officials should offer constructive appraisals, with specific suggestions, to the less experienced officials. Junior varsity officials should stay and observe the varsity game until at least halftime of the varsity game, in order to learn by watching more experienced officials. Less experienced officials should seek out, and ask for input, from more experienced officials. "So? What did you see out there?” is an easy way to start a pregame, halftime, or postgame conversation. The continuing education and improvement of officials are vital to the continued success of the Board.

There are also practical reasons for having four officials at the game site. The overlap will insure that an official is available if one of the officials at the site becomes ill or injured. In rare cases, an official may be late to the game due to unexpected traffic conditions, a flat tire, dead battery, etc. In extremely rare cases, an official may not show up for a game due to a miscommunication or a scheduling error. The Board does have One Person Mechanics Guidelines in place, but it is best if we have two officials working every game.

The third reason for having four officials at a game site deals with professionalism. If principals, athletic directors, site directors, and coaches do not observe an overlap of officials over the course of a junior varsity, varsity doubleheader, they may get the impression that the officials simply want to “get in, get out, and get paid”. This is not the impression that Board members want to give. School personnel at the game site notice such things as junior varsity officials and varsity officials, observing each other and discussing the game at pregame, halftime, or postgame.

For many years, it was a Board policy to have varsity officials show up early to observe, and rate, the junior varsity officials and to have the junior varsity officials stay to observe, and rate, the varsity officials. Recent changes in the Board rating system has done away with the need for officials to rate nonpartner officials, but that doesn't do away with the need for four officials to be at the game site for as long as reasonably possible. According to the Board 2015-16 Member Expectations Policy, “Varsity members arrive early to observe subvarsity officials and subvarsity officials remain to observe varsity officials”. Officials acting in this manner will solidify the reputation and continued success of the Board as “The Best”.[/QUOTE]

Pretty well written!
I am not privy to the format of your newsletter, but it may be helpful to some readers if the educational, practical, and professional reasons were in a bullet format with your definition/explanations/illustrations to follow: First educational.... leading me to practical... and concluding with professional or something like that?
I love that you only have three things: 1,2,3 and A,B,C are always easy enough for me. Well done!

Regarding the actual subject - which is what "Dad" seems to take issue with:
I'm grateful my association isn't run this way. This feels a little heavy-handed.... but if you're training and producing good officials: "When in Rome" baby!

Dad Sat Nov 28, 2015 06:06pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich (Post 971078)
New officials working subvarsity HS games are not guys that, typically, learn nothing by observing more experienced officials -- if they're looking for items to take away.

I agree that having this as written policy is absurd, however.

Agreed, but it highly depends on the association:

Do you have a good varsity official pool?
Who's good and who isn't?
Who has a bad habit newer guys will pick up?
What should you be looking for?

For a newer official it's so hard to get a good foundation, especially if you don't have much experience with the game.

Dad Sat Nov 28, 2015 06:11pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam (Post 971080)
It's different only in degree.

You get to research and choose two movies a year you think will be worth your time and be able to take some joy out of it.

You have to watch every movie that comes through a theater and despise movies for the rest of your life.

Are degrees fair here? :p

Refhoop Sat Nov 28, 2015 06:20pm

Pretty well written!
I am not privy to the format of your newsletter, but it may be helpful to some readers if the educational, practical, and professional reasons were in a bullet format with your definition/explanations/illustrations to follow: First educational.... leading me to practical... and concluding with professional or something like that?
I love that you only have three things: 1,2,3 and A,B,C are always easy enough for me. Well done!

Regarding the actual subject - which is what "Dad" seems to take issue with:
I'm grateful my association isn't run this way. This feels a little heavy-handed.... but if you're training and producing good officials: "When in Rome" baby![/QUOTE]

Adam Sat Nov 28, 2015 06:58pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dad (Post 971083)
You get to research and choose two movies a year you think will be worth your time and be able to take some joy out of it.

You have to watch every movie that comes through a theater and despise movies for the rest of your life.

Are degrees fair here? :p

Am I a movie reviewer by trade? :)

Dad Sat Nov 28, 2015 07:02pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam (Post 971085)
Am I a movie reviewer by trade? :)

Ouch

You 1: Me 0

BillyMac Sun Nov 29, 2015 12:54pm

Thanks ...
 
Thanks for the help with the format, grammar, spelling, punctuation, etc. guys.

After sending a copy to the upper-ups in my local board, they requested that I not publish the article, that this reminder about our board policy (even after changes in our ratings system) should come from somebody way above my pay scale, so I turned the article over to them. They may publish it under their names (more clout), or they may use the article as an outline for discussion at a future board meeting.

It's now in their hands (frankly, where it belongs). My intention all along was to bring the existing policy to the attention of our membership, it doesn't matter to me how it gets there.

You guys that helped me didn't waste your time. I sent them a nice final draft of the article to work from. Thanks.

Dad Sun Nov 29, 2015 01:08pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 971108)
Thanks for the help with the format, grammar, spelling, punctuation, etc. guys.

After sending a copy to the upper-ups in my local board, they requested that I not publish the article, that this reminder about our board policy (even after changes in our ratings system) should come from somebody way above my pay scale, so I turned the article over to them. They may publish it under their names (more clout), or they may use the article as an outline for discussion at a future board meeting.

It's now in their hands (frankly, where it belongs). My intention all along was to bring the existing policy to the attention of our membership, it doesn't matter to me how it gets there.

You guys that helped me didn't waste your time. I sent them a nice final draft of the article to work from. Thanks.

Now write an article on why you should be doing 3man. :p

BillyMac Sun Nov 29, 2015 01:21pm

It's The Coaches ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dad (Post 971110)
Now write an article on why you should be doing 3man.

Such an article would be directed at (get ready for a surprise) coaches. Here, in Connecticut, it's the coaches, actually the basketball coaches in the state coaches association, that are preventing the expansion of three person crews throughout most of the state.

The coaches lobby is very strong here in Connecticut, and the state interscholastic sports governing body doesn't take a step without their approval. The basketball coaches are lead by the winningest coaches, they're the most vocal, and for the most part, they all play very up tempo, full court, in your face, man to man defense, and they all believe (right, or wrong) that a third official will stifle this coaching philosophy.

It's not the athletic directors, or principals. It's not about money (it may be a little bit about money). It's not about training officials (just give us some lead time). The winningest, and most powerful, coaches don't want three person crews, so they don't get three person crews.

Dad Sun Nov 29, 2015 01:48pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 971111)
Such an article would be directed at (get ready for a surprise) coaches. Here, in Connecticut, it's the coaches, actually the basketball coaches in the state coaches association, that are preventing the expansion of three person crews throughout most of the state.

The coaches lobby is very strong here in Connecticut, and the state interscholastic sports governing body doesn't take a step without their approval. The basketball coaches are lead by the winningest coaches, they're the most vocal, and for the most part, they all play very up tempo, full court, in your face, man to man defense, and they all believe (right, or wrong) that a third official will stifle this coaching philosophy.

It's not the athletic directors, or principals. It's not about money (it may be a little bit about money). It's not about training officials (just give us some lead time). The most powerful coaches don't want three person crews, so they don't get three person crews.

This is really interesting and I'm not sure what to make of it.

BillyMac Sun Nov 29, 2015 02:11pm

Connecticut Really Is The Land That Time Forgot ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dad (Post 971112)
This is really interesting and I'm not sure what to make of it.

Our state interscholastic sports governing body doesn't mandate three person crews until the quarterfinal round of the state tournament.

Here, in my local area, we may use three person crews for a few league, or conference, finals. Regular season games? Very few, and far between, maybe for a few big city, or Catholic high school, rivalries.

The rest of Connecticut? I used to think that one of the other Connecticut local boards did a lot of three person regular season games, but I was recently informed by a Connecticut colleague that I was, sadly, mistaken.

https://c2.staticflickr.com/4/3775/1...8029f778_m.jpg

BryanV21 Sun Nov 29, 2015 03:32pm

So the officials get very little, if any, work doing 3-man mechanics before the biggest games of the year?

Yeah... that makes a ton of sense.

BillyMac Sun Nov 29, 2015 03:50pm

It Really Was A Big Night ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BryanV21 (Post 971118)
So the officials get very little, if any, work doing 3-man mechanics before the biggest games of the year?

Exactly. I observed an outstanding young official last year who worked his first state tournament quarterfinal game on the same night that he worked his first three person game. His partners did a lot of pointing, telling him where to go. He's a bright young man, a quick learner, had a great game, but it still didn't make a lot of sense.

Nevadaref Sun Nov 29, 2015 04:43pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BryanV21 (Post 971118)
So the officials get very little, if any, work doing 3-man mechanics before the biggest games of the year?

Yeah... that makes a ton of sense.

In many of the areas that make the switch to 3-person for the playoffs or the latter rounds of the postseason the lack of experience with the system is solved by bringing in college officials to work those contests.
Most of those officials will have worked significantly fewer high school games during the season than a high school-only official and the college game is called a little differently too. So this leads to a debate on the fairness of assigning playoff games to such officials. Does the association/state office reward the HS official for all of his effort the whole season or does it put the guy more familiar with the 3-person system out there for the biggest games of the year? What do the coaches want? I've heard the coaches complain that the playoff games are called differently from the regular season contests. I believe that they are correct, but I don't think that they fully grasp why. The explanation is two-fold. First, having a third official allows the crew to observe more and so more gets whistled. Secondly, the officials are mostly not the same people that they've seen all season. The college officials do call the game somewhat differently as they are used to emphasizing different aspects.

BillyMac Sun Nov 29, 2015 04:48pm

Vote Early, Vote Often ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 971122)
What do the coaches want?

In Connecticut, the coaches (all coaches, winners, losers, in the state tournament, not in the state tournament) vote for state tournament officials. The more votes an official receives, the deeper that official goes into the state tournament.

jpgc99 Sun Nov 29, 2015 08:57pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 971111)
Such an article would be directed at (get ready for a surprise) coaches. Here, in Connecticut, it's the coaches, actually the basketball coaches in the state coaches association, that are preventing the expansion of three person crews throughout most of the state.

The coaches lobby is very strong here in Connecticut, and the state interscholastic sports governing body doesn't take a step without their approval. The basketball coaches are lead by the winningest coaches, they're the most vocal, and for the most part, they all play very up tempo, full court, in your face, man to man defense, and they all believe (right, or wrong) that a third official will stifle this coaching philosophy.

It's not the athletic directors, or principals. It's not about money (it may be a little bit about money). It's not about training officials (just give us some lead time). The winningest, and most powerful, coaches don't want three person crews, so they don't get three person crews.

I bet there are more incorrect fouls being called than being missed. In two person, you have to guess a lot. In my experience, guessing usually leads to more incorrect calls than more incorrect no calls.

If I were in Connecticut, I'd put a long film together highlighting all of the incorrect calls that are a result of having poor coverage from only two officials. Have your board send that to the coaches.

Then you can take that official that is asked to sit around and watch a game and actually put him to work on the floor.

BlueDevilRef Sun Nov 29, 2015 09:09pm

[QUOTE=jpgc99;971139]I bet there are more incorrect fouls being called than being missed. In two person, you have to guess a lot.

Wrong.

If you are covering your PCA, you aren't guessing. Call what you see, no guessing allowed. Period.


I wish I had a cool signature

Rich Sun Nov 29, 2015 09:31pm

[QUOTE=BlueDevilRef;971140]
Quote:

Originally Posted by jpgc99 (Post 971139)
I bet there are more incorrect fouls being called than being missed. In two person, you have to guess a lot.

Wrong.

If you are covering your PCA, you aren't guessing. Call what you see, no guessing allowed. Period.


I wish I had a cool signature

Right. I have a bridge to sell right over there......

BlueDevilRef Sun Nov 29, 2015 09:38pm

Ok, glad someone caught my tongue in cheekness. But seriously, I don't guess. I call what I see as I see it and process it in my head. I might be wrong bc I saw it incorrectly but I don't guess. That can get you in a world of hurt.

I believe the statement "in two person, you have to guess a lot" is just an excuse to try to validate 3 man. I'd love to work more three but that doesn't mean that a two man game can't be called well by those officials.


I wish I had a cool signature

Rich Sun Nov 29, 2015 09:44pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueDevilRef (Post 971142)
Ok, glad someone caught my tongue in cheekness. But seriously, I don't guess. I call what I see as I see it and process it in my head. I might be wrong bc I saw it incorrectly but I don't guess. That can get you in a world of hurt.

I believe the statement "in two person, you have to guess a lot" is just an excuse to try to validate 3 man. I'd love to work more three but that doesn't mean that a two man game can't be called well by those officials.


I wish I had a cool signature

Oh, I called 2-man for over 25 years. You do have to make an *educated* guess from time to time. Player trips going around the corner and neither official sees it as well as you'd like, you can either put air in the whistle for a foul that you *know* happened but maybe didn't see as you liked *or* you can put air in the whistle for the technical foul that will come otherwise.

2-person was easier back in the 80s. The game just wasn't as fast and physical then. Back then 4 officials were used in HS varsity football games and now no such game would be worked with 4 officials. Basketball will get to the point (and is in many areas) where no varsity game will be called with 2. Has just taken longer than I'd like.

But for me, I'm 100% 3-person as of this season. Around here I can pick and choose what I work and I just don't work conferences that still hire 2 officials.

BlueDevilRef Sun Nov 29, 2015 09:55pm

I do envy that. I am new enough I don't get any of the big conf games which have three man. In softball, where it's not really needed, we don't do 3 man until district finals. Always a fun pregame to make sure everyone is on same page after not having done it since playoffs a year ago.


I wish I had a cool signature

Dad Sun Nov 29, 2015 10:04pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueDevilRef (Post 971144)
I do envy that. I am new enough I don't get any of the big conf games which have three man. In softball, where it's not really needed, we don't do 3 man until district finals. Always a fun pregame to make sure everyone is on same page after not having done it since playoffs a year ago.


I wish I had a cool signature

Dang, we 3man 2a JV around here. Only time it doesn't happen is about once a year where everyone everywhere wanted to have a game. Some freshman games are worked by three officials also. It's rare, but definitely needed for crazy rivalries.

Refhoop Sun Nov 29, 2015 10:35pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich (Post 971143)

2-person was easier back in the 80s. The game just wasn't as fast and physical then.

Officiating the UCLA 1-4 or the flex offense probably was a little easier.
The dribble drive attack motion offense w/ kick outs for 3's makes the game more challenging for any crew of officials.

HokiePaul Mon Nov 30, 2015 10:56am

I didn't get the Three's company reference (I've heard of the show but it was before my time and I've never seen it). Other than that though it seemed good and well written.

Gutierrez7 Mon Nov 30, 2015 11:42am

Quote:

Originally Posted by HokiePaul (Post 971185)
I didn't get the Three's company reference (I've heard of the show but it was before my time and I've never seen it). Other than that though it seemed good and well written.

Thanks Paul for making me feel really old and I think I'm young. Ha ha.

I was in love with Suzanne Somers, long before the "Thighmaster". Oops you probably don't remember that either. Ha Ha. To bad.

BillyMac Mon Nov 30, 2015 06:20pm

Children Should Be Seen And Not Heard ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by HokiePaul (Post 971185)
I didn't get the Three's company reference (I've heard of the show but it was before my time and I've never seen it).

Shut up.

BillyMac Mon Nov 30, 2015 06:22pm

Enjoy Gutierrez7 ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gutierrez7 (Post 971188)
I was in love with Suzanne Somers, long before the "Thighmaster".

https://sp.yimg.com/xj/th?id=OIP.Mbe...=0&w=300&h=300

griblets Mon Nov 30, 2015 06:29pm

Grammar Nazi
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Freddy (Post 971074)
I'm about the most stuck-up grammar nazi there is on this Forum. Ending sentences with prepositions, for instance, is something up with which we ought not put.

The grammar nazis I know would never use back-to-back prepositions in a sentence. :eek:

so cal lurker Mon Nov 30, 2015 06:52pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by griblets (Post 971246)
The grammar nazis I know would never use back-to-back prepositions in a sentence. :eek:

Most grammar nazis I know are like TV pundits talking about referees: they rely upon myths about about grammar that they picked up in childhood and never learned the real rules . . .

Dad Tue Dec 01, 2015 12:07pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by griblets (Post 971246)
The grammar nazis I know would never use back-to-back prepositions in a sentence. :eek:

I glanced at what he wrote and decided to ignore it.

Adam Wed Dec 02, 2015 11:44am

This thing has run its course and devolved.


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