Crew Chief?

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by kylejt

I know in LL, when you've got a game UIC, which isn't always the PU, he's got the final say so.

That might be true at the local level, Kyle. For example, a two-person crew may entail an experienced father doing the bases with his son doing the plate. So the expectation is for the father to be the UIC.

But LL rules, just like OBR, designate the PU as the game UIC. You cannot have the BU be the UIC, because there are certain responsibilities that belong to the UIC that cannot be delegated. For example, Rule 5.01 tells us that the UIC calls "Play" to start a game. You won't see a BU make the "Play" call from behind first base.

FWIW, when I umpire LL games as BU, and I have an inexperienced umpire doing the plate, I will advise him/her when it comes to things like calling games due to weather, etc. And it will be him/her, as the UIC, announcing those decisions. I won't take it upon myself to make those proclamations and usurp his/her authority.

[Rita C]

Originally Posted by Manny A

FWIW, when I umpire LL games as BU, and I have an inexperienced umpire doing the plate, I will advise him/her when it comes to things like calling games due to weather, etc. And it will be him/her, as the UIC, announcing those decisions. I won't take it upon myself to make those proclamations and usurp his/her authority.

LL rules have the adult have that authority if it's a junior umpire.

Rita

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by Rita C

LL rules have the adult have that authority if it's a junior umpire.

I don't recall ever seeing that in the LL rule book, Rita, at least not for regular season play. In the tournament section of the book it does say the UIC must be an adult.

What the LL rule book says is that if there is no adult umpires on the field, the league is to designate an adult as the game coordinator, and that game coordinator has sole authority of rule 3.10(b). But I couldn't find anything that says if the crew is made up of an adult on the bases and a junior behind the plate, the junior umpire is not the UIC for all intents and purposes.

Heck, I've seen junior umpires that could run circles around their adult partners.

[UmpTTS43]

There are responsibilities that fall under the PU and responsibilities that fall under the CC. Quoting the rule book is no good as it is fraught with errors and inconsistencies. This is another example of this. UIC in the rule book means PU at times and CC at times. Generally it is CC. Although the CC cannot overturn another umpires ruling, he is the final say when it comes to rules interps, weather situations, and the like. PU and BU are equals. If there are 2 umpires, one should be recognized as the CC and it need not necessarily be the PU.

The term UIC is commonly used during a tournament environment where there is one umpire that oversees the umpiring crews. Although that is the case, there is still a CC on the field.

Simply discussing terminolgy I know but there are differences.

OBR

[Rich Ives]

Originally Posted by UmpTTS43

There are responsibilities that fall under the PU and responsibilities that fall under the CC. Quoting the rule book is no good as it is fraught with errors and inconsistencies. This is another example of this. UIC in the rule book means PU at times and CC at times. Generally it is CC. Although the CC cannot overturn another umpires ruling, he is the final say when it comes to rules interps, weather situations, and the like. PU and BU are equals. If there are 2 umpires, one should be recognized as the CC and it need not necessarily be the PU.

The term UIC is commonly used during a tournament environment where there is one umpire that oversees the umpiring crews. Although that is the case, there is still a CC on the field.

Simply discussing terminolgy I know but there are differences.

OBR

Quoting the rule book won't help because "crew chief" isn't there.

[UmpTTS43]

Originally Posted by Rich Ives

Quoting the rule book won't help because "crew chief" isn't there.

Stating the obvious again? UIC within OBR is an antiquated term and is no longer used. Just because it is referenced in the rule book does not make it right. Consider it one of the 230+ errors in rule book.

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by UmpTTS43

Stating the obvious again? UIC within OBR is an antiquated term and is no longer used. Just because it is referenced in the rule book does not make it right. Consider it one of the 230+ errors in rule book.

UIC within OBR may be antiquated at the MLB level. But does it not apply elsewhere?

If there's a two-man crew working a MiLB A-Ball or Double-A game, is one of them really designated the "crew chief"?

[UmpTTS43]

Originally Posted by Manny A

If there's a two-man crew working a MiLB A-Ball or Double-A game, is one of them really designated the "crew chief"?

Yes. And it may change from game to game.

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by UmpTTS43

Yes. And it may change from game to game.

Really? What would prompt that? If the same two umpires work a four-game series, why would they change designation of crew chief from game to game?

I may be wrong, but I feel that completely substituting "UIC" with "Crew Chief" in OBR is not appropriate. The problem is that it's not an antiquated reference; rather, "UIC" blurs the responsibilities between the crew chief and the plate umpire.

I bring up the example from 5.01 again. It says the UIC will start the game by announcing "Play". That's not a crew chief's call unless he's behind the plate. And 9.04(a) specifically mandates that the UIC is behind the plate.

So if someone's going to make any changes to OBR to fix this particular error, they really need to articulate those responsibilities of the crew chief (e.g., calling games due to weather, etc.) and the plate umpire.