legal catch - out of bounds

[JimSmith]

ORB 7.04.c states that if a field falls into the dugout after making a legal catch the runners are advanced once base. I understand the definition of a catch. My question is what qualifications do we have for 'in the dugout' or 'in the field of play'? One foot in, one foot out? Both feet in?

Please specify rule number. ORB and/or NF.

[greymule]

The operative word is falls. OBR requires a fall into DBT, not a step like Fed (not sure about NCAA). Should a player catch a ball and then enter the dugout but remain on his feet, the ball is in play. He can throw somebody out.

Twenty years ago, I asked a soon-to-be MLB umpire whether a player could catch a ball, hurdle the fence, and throw the ball from "Row F" as long as he remained on his feet. His answer was yes.

Unless things have changed, I believe this still to be the (very unlikely) case.

[JimSmith]

Could you list the NF rule. It seems they do not post their rules online...

[PeteBooth]

Originally posted by JimSmith

Could you list the NF rule. It seems they do not post their rules online...

FED Rule 8-3-3d

A runner is awarded 1 base if B1 hits a Fair or Foul ball (fly or line drive) which is caught by a fielder, who then leaves the field of play by stepping with BOTH FEET or by falling into a bench, dugout, stand, bleacher or over any boundary or barrier such as a fence, rope, chalk line or pre-game determined imaginary boundary line.

Notice in FED the Term Both FEET, meaning in FED a fielder may sraddle the line meaning one foot in LBT and one foot in DBT.

In OBR BOTH FEET MUST be on LBT. Also, in FED notice the term stepping on DBT. In OBR the player can catch the ball in LBT then step into DBT and still make a play as long as he doesn't fall down.

In FED, once a player STEPS into DBT with BOTH Feet the ball is immediately dead. FED rule 5-1-1i

Pete Booth

[Rich]

I just want to point out that under OBR a fielder may go into a dugout with one OR BOTH feet and THEN make a legal catch.
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7.04(b) -- A fielder or catcher may reach or step into, or go into the dugout with one or both feet to make a catch, and if he holds the ball, the catch shall be allowed. Ball is in play.

If the fielder or catcher, after having made a legal catch, should fall into a stand or among spectators or into the dugout after making a legal catch, or fall while in the dugout after making a legal catch, the ball is dead and runners advance one base without liability to be put out.
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If the player falls in the dugout after making the catch, the ball is dead and all runners are awarded one base from the time of pitch. However, players from either team can hold up the fielder or catcher and if he doesn't fall the ball remins alive. the following is from 2.00 CATCH:

If a fielder, attempting a catch at the edge of the dugout, is "held up" and kept from an apparent fall by a player or players of either team and the catch is made, it shall be allowed.

Rich

[Bfair]

My understanding regarding lines separating LBT and DBT are as follows:

• Fed: the lines are in LBT. A fielder in LBT is not considered to be in DBT until both feet have touched in DBT. Once in DBT with both feet, the fielder is not considered back in LBT until both feet have touched in LBT.
  
  
• NCAA: The line is in LBT, and the fielder is considered in DBT anytime one foot steps over the line. He is back in LBT when no foot is touching over the line.
  
  
• OBR: The line is in DBT, and the fielder is considered in DBT any time his foot is touching or over the line. He is back in LBT when no foot is touching on or over the line.

I hope I've recalled this correctly.
I took the effort to look it up once, but don't intend to again.
That's how I understand it to be, and that's how it would be called by me if a decision had to be made regarding a fielder making a catch near such a line.

Amazingly, a Fed player moving from LBT toward DBT could actually cross the line by stepping over the line with one foot while the other is in the air (thus no part of his body in LBT), make the catch, and then reset a foot into LBT and continue to play with never being considered as leaving LBT. Since he was never in DBT with both feet, he was considered to be in LBT.


Just my opinion,

Freix

[bob jenkins]

Originally posted by Bfair
Amazingly, a Fed player moving from LBT toward DBT could actually cross the line by stepping over the line with one foot while the other is in the air (thus no part of his body in LBT), make the catch, and then reset a foot into LBT and continue to play with never being considered as leaving LBT. Since he was never in DBT with both feet, he was considered to be in LBT.

Not quite true, Steve.

To *make* a catch, part of the fielder must be in LBT, or the fielder must not have touched DBT (i.e., both feet in the air). If one foot is in DBT, nad the other is in the air, the fielder can't make a (legal) catch.

Once the catch is made, however, the fielder must enter DBT with both feet to be out of play. If he catches the ball in LBT, then steps into DBT with one foot (the other in the air), the player is still in LBT.

See 2.9.1 Comment

Originally posted by greymule
[B]The operative word is falls. OBR requires a fall into DBT, not a step like Fed (not sure about NCAA). Should a player catch a ball and then enter the dugout but remain on his feet, the ball is in play. He can throw somebody out./B]

My understanding is that the fielder, after making the legal catch, must re-enter to LBT before he can throw somebody out or make any subsequent play.

[greymule]

You may well be right that the fielder must get back into LBT to make a throw. Don't see it in the book, though. Maybe somebody knows for sure.

What would be the penalty for throwing from DBT?

Originally posted by greymule
You may well be right that the fielder must get back into LBT to make a throw. Don't see it in the book, though. Maybe somebody knows for sure.

What would be the penalty for throwing from DBT?

No penalty...but, ball then becomes dead whether the fielder falls or not. I'm sure you've heard of the "catch and carry." Well the catch must be in LBT, then the fielder's momentum can carry to DBT, and following play can occur as long as fielder returns to LBT before the throw.

7.04(c) does not specifically address this, and I can't find another authoritative reference, but that is the way our association teaches this ruling and the way all the teams in this area play it. If anyone can provide further rule or interpretation reference, please do so.