Well I stepped into the umpire's shoes tonight. Had a double header with 9-10 year olds.

It all went pretty smooth. Coaches told me that I was the best they had this year.

They did question me calling as many balks as I did. Told them they couldn't yell "SWING" in the field (I'm assuming that's a league rule...don't think that's mentioned in any rule book ;) ). And of course a few close calls that all coaches think they have a better angle on. The rest of it was due to me having a 14 yr old in the field who was tenative to do ANYTHING.

The balks I called were because pitchers came set and turned thier shoulders...constantly!

Also about this new ump. He wouldn't help me on anything. Run-downs...he would not take half of the play, so I ended up running back and forth...got tiring. One time I even had to run down to third base from PU and chase it between 2nd and third. That was pretty ugly.

And here is my question after my first night...
Top of 2nd inning 2 outs. Count is 2-2 pitched strike but catcher from my view looked like he trapped it. So F2 throws down to first, inning over. No big deal. After the game the board member on duty just asked about it. I said I had a bad view an that's a tough call. If you have a hard time seeing it how do you handle it?

Your partner should help you on that. If you look to him he should either give an out signal or point down. It sounds to me like you had a partner that either didn't have a clue or didn't care to, so it sounds like you handled it right.

"Turning shoulders" is not necessarily a balk. You must judge it to be a feint to first. Were the runners fooled? Were you? If not, let it go.

In FED, turning the shoulders whil in contact with the rubber is a BALK. However, at this level, I would give a few , "don't do that's", and let the coach take care of it.

Congrats on your 1st game Coach!

I have some thoughts and questions tho.

Questions first.

What rules are they playing under in the league there that you're calling Balks in 9-10 yr old division?

Are they leading off?

If not, why are you concerned with a pitcher turning his shoulders?

Why are you chasing down a rundown between 2nd and 3rd when your responsibility as PU is the Plate?

My thoughts.

As far as the rundown. Position yourself in foul territory between 3rd and home. You can see a swipe tag be in position to make a call at third, and also get back to the plate if need be. If your P isn't there to make his call at 2nd, let everyone go crazy on him, he will learn where to be the next time. Plus, you can still help out on the call if need be. If you're chasing, and there is a play at the plate and you're chasing to make a call, you are the one who is goin' to get the flack, especially when a run is at stake.

As far as the "SWING" batter, I don't allow it. Lil' League Rule 4.06 (2) (3). To me it is unsportsmanlike. Especially by the catcher when the ball is coming in the zone.

And to your question, "If you have a hard time seeing it how do you handle it?"

Wait! If you don't see it wait and let the players determine the play. If you don't make any call, they should know that they need to make a play.

And yet another Question. What rules are you playing under that on a dropped third strike, a batter/runner can advance in 9-10 yr olds?

Preventative measures might be in order.
 

I do not think you should just let it go. You might not call a balk, but it is to your benefit as an umpire to get them to stop doing it to some extent so you do not have to call it at all. So usually sending the catcher to talk to the pitcher works if I am the plate umpire and telling them myself as the base umpire works too. I just think it is good preventative officiating to let them be aware that their actions might be considered a balk at some point. But then again that is what I do and what works for me.

Peace

Follow-up
 

Thanks for all the replies.

Here is a follow-up:
""Turning shoulders" is not necessarily a balk. You must judge it to be a feint to first. Were the runners fooled? Were you? If not, let it go."
It is my understanding that if the pitcher is set he may not turn his shoulders to look towards a BR. Talked to UIC who was eval. me and he agreed that they were balks.

"What rules are they playing under in the league there that you're calling Balks in 9-10 yr old division?"
Well in the 9-10 yr old leauge they get 1 warning balk. You still call balk like normal but runners do not advance until the pitcher does it twice.

"Are they leading off?"
Yes and they are able to steal.

"Why are you chasing down a rundown between 2nd and 3rd when your responsibility as PU is the Plate?"
Because the rundown between 2nd and 3rd was the lead runner (no play at plate) so I was at 3rd to help my BU with a run-down. I then found out that he wasn't there to help me. I was able to keep a pretty good angle on everything and didn't want to have a call missed because of his screw up. I talked to him between innings about it and he seemed a little confused. UIC said that I worked my @$$ off on that stuff and I got a bonus ;) .

"What rules are you playing under that on a dropped third strike, a batter/runner can advance in 9-10 yr olds?"
9-10 yr olds is the first division where this is allowed in that league. Anything younger and it is an automatic out. I don't agree with it but that's the rule. About 80% of the time the catcher drops the third strike.

"In FED, turning the shoulders whil in contact with the rubber is a BALK. However, at this level, I would give a few , "don't do that's", and let the coach take care of it."
I allowed several "don't do that's" and just looked at the coach...he nodded and would talk to the pitcher after a glare at me. I eventually jus thought that after getting thier "warning balk" and a few glances at the coach I had to call them because it was so obvious. I guess maybe the other umpires just haven't been calling them and the coaches weren't used to balks being called. The coaches on 1st and thrid were mad when they weren't called but while in the dugout they were irritated that we did call em...difficult situation.

Thanks again.

I have never heard of a 9–10 league that allowed runners to advance on an uncaught third strike or allowed leading and stealing.

I strongly suspect that the people who designed the rules for those kids did not grow up playing baseball.

PONY baseball
 

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The "Mustang" division, 9-10's. I work this for 5 different city leagues. 3 of them allow lead off and stealing, balks are enforced( I tell coaches that "intent to decieve shall govern" is the way they will be called)The other 2 do it like LL, runners can't leave till ball reaches catcher, if they do, like SB, they are out! Better than those 2 pages of "if arunner leaves early...." that LL has. PONY allows either option for regular league play, come all-star tourneys, regular baseball. Guess which teams are having problems then......

If you are not sure if he caught it clean or not, and you get no help from pard, then it's not caught.

You are going to be sure if the ball is well away from F2 that he didn't catch it--that's obvious. So anytime you are unsure, it's because he's right there with the ball. With that said, even if your decision of considering it "no catch" is wrong, the BR should <U>still</u> be toast and an easy play---if not just a mere tag---for F2.

If he wants the guarantee of the catch call, make him prove it to you.
If in doubt, consider not caught.


Just my opinion,

Freix

Re: Follow-up
 

Unless you are playing FED rules (doubtful), your understanding is incorrect.

They may have been balks, but they were balks for feinting, not for turning the shoulders.

Or, the UIC may want balks called not in accordance with published rules (e.g., "house" rules).

Show me
 

<b>CDcoach:

It is my understanding that if the pitcher is set he may not turn his shoulders to look towards a BR. Talked to UIC who was eval. me and he agreed that they were balks.</b>


Read OBR Rule 8.05 and then show me the rule on shoulder turns. We'll talk when you finish your assignment.

Got me
 

Ok you are correct. Thank you for the correction.

Now for a question.

What exactly is a feint? Meaning that he turned his shoulder in a fake to get the runner to go back?

I stand corrected...learned something new. The shoulder turning was pretty jerky or I didn't call it. Correct?

A feint is a "fake"...a move that isn't...a deceptive move, sometimes legal and sometimes not.

One can fake a number or ways, one of which that we have traditionally banned is an intentionally quick or abrupt or "jerking" turn of the shoulder towards first.

If the shoulder turns slowly and deliberately as the pitcher glances over, I've got nothing. If it gives the impression that it was the beginning of a move that didn't happen...it's a feint and a balk.

Re: Got me
 

<i> you are working 9-10's, they will come set and look with thier head towards first, most, if not all, will turn some shoulder also...let that go. Now, at the very end of 8.05, there is a shaded area. Basically it states that "intent to decieve" shall govern. These little guys have minimul grasp of the mechanics of pitching, I will always nail the failure to come set(by far the most common)but the herky-jerky-still figuring it out mechanical issues....let em know(as well as the coach) between innings. Nobody wants a walk-a-thon or balk-a-thon(especially when the runner doesn't even know what is going on)JMHO</i>

Just a touch of philosophy here.
When working with youth (sub high school) as a coach, I wanted the ump to come to me with the problems. That way I could correct the players and they would understand what to do. I.E. not coming to a discernable stop in the stretch. Tell me what you see is wrong, then I can tell the kid "When you come set, puff some air out before throwing". That way the problem is fixed and I don't have the ump coaching my kids.
Working as a blue I was the same way. Spot the problem, let the coach know, coach fixes, we keep playing. As a blue, I don't know what terminology the coach is using with his kids and I could spend precious playing time trying to fix a minor problem. If I let the coach know between innings, he gets to fix it on his time without delaying the game.

Still have lots of problems with youth umps as many of them do not know their rules & interpretations and have shown very litle interest in learning. Wish those guys would learn to come to boards like this so they would be better.

Not my first option.
 

I disagree with you point of view on this. I do not think an umpire should come to a coach all the time. Reason being, because if a player does something really obvious, it is going to have to be called. If it is boarderline, I can use the catcher as the UIC or tell the pitcher myself when I am on the bases. Because the problem with telling the coach, the other coach might be complaining before we have a chance to say anything to you. It might need to be addressed immidiately and telling you will only complicate things. And depending on how much of an a$$ that coach has been during that game or previous situations, coming to a coach just might be adding fuel to a already big fire. As an umpire I might have an argument on my hands by just addressing you. So if I have a situation where I can say something and no one knows I even address an issue, that is a win, win for me. And please do not take this as we should never address a coach on situations like this, but I will admit that is not my first option.

I also have the same philosophy in the other sports I do. It would be to obvious in a football game to tell a coach that "#77 is holding." Because if he is holding, the other coach wants you to call it. So if you have a situation that is boarderline, I have no problem with an umpire or official telling a kid they are coming close to that line.

Peace

Maybe combine it?
 

What I like to do...and the reason I do it is because a lot of my favorite umpires have done it while I was coaching...wait until between innings and hold the pitcher on the mound and pull a coach out to the mound, then tell the player what he did wrong that way the player and the coach can talk it out with a pitcher plate to demonstrate on. Normally took about 30-45 seconds and didn't delay much. Worked really well.

Any reasons this is a bad thing?

Apples and Oranges....RUT
 

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I work Football as well, holding is MUCH more different than a F1 not understanding the technos of pitching mechanics....flag em!!!!! Remember, linemen don't have to keep a foot on the rubber....LOL