NCAA Test Question
 

This is a question from the NCAA test. The NCAA OBS rule is now the same as OBR. Let me know what you think and why. I believe there is no correct answer.

R1, R3, no outs. R1 is stealing and gets caught in a rundown and is obstructed. After obstruction has been called on F4, R3 is thrown out at the plate.

a. R1 is returned to first base and R3 is awarded home.
b. Award R1 third base on the obstruction.
c. R3 is awarded home since he was advancing to the plate when obstruction was called and R1 is awarded second base.
d. The out on R3 stands

No idea if I was right or wrong, but I answered C.
I assumed it was type 1 obs, but either way you make awards that in your judgement, nullify the act of obs. For me that was R1 getting his entitled 1 base and R3, getting home. The question does not paint a clear enough picture either way.

Gotta go with "C". It's the most correct, type A, with your judgement that R3"could" have made it home had there not been any obs on R1.

I am new to the forum and just attended the NCAA Chicago clinic, so bear with me. Type A OBS is an immediate dead ball, right? Therefore the out made did not happen. C is the only possible answer according to the rules interp we saw.

If I am wrong I welcome the advice since I have to take the test too. Good luck.

That's the logic I would use as well.

It is Type I (Type a in OBR), so the ball is dead and R1 must be awarded second. C is the only answer that includes that.

I agree that the part in the answer dealing with R3 is not necessarily correct, so a slightly different play on the field might result in a slightly different ruling thatn on the test question.

Sorry, this can be found in NCAA 2-54 Type 1 Obstruction on page 36.

I referred to it as Type A, like Evans did on Sunday.

Thanks Bob. I just spent the last six years in the Philippines and am learning all the rule changes from during that time. We played OBR over there so I am keen to see more discussion on NCAA ball as Spring progresses. I hope to see you out on the field again.

Two more questions:

2. R2, R3, two outs. The pitcher bobbles a come-backer and seeing that he has no play at 1B, throws to F5 who tags out R2. However, R2 was obstructed by F6 on his way to third. The BR rounds first base too wide and F5 throws behind the BR and the BR is called out.

a.The ball is "dead" on the obstruction of R2 by F6. Score R3, award R2 third and award BR second if he had touched first before the obstruction of R2.
b.R2 is out for the third out. The other action occurred after the side had been retired.
c.Inning is over, the out stands for the third out.
d.If R3 has not touched home when the BR is called out, the run would not count.

3. The pitch clock is paused for any of the following reasons,

a.A fielder is delayed in returning to his position after attempting to field a foul ball.
b.The batter is delayed in returning to the dirt area around home plate following his running out of a foul ball.
c.The pitcher is delayed in returning to the dirt circle because he was backing up a play.
d.The pitcher disengages the pitching rubber.

CG, if the runner is being played on as described it is Type 1 Obstruction and the ball is dead immediately. All plays after the infraction are immaterial. That would make "a" the only acceptable answer, right?

a. Common sense application. Safety supersedes speed - prompt the player and then resume the clock when he and the batter are ready. I assume the pitcher is since you started the clock.

b. Described in the CCA on page 23, play 12. The clock restarts when the pitcher and batter are both ready.

c. The clock should never have started since the pitcher is not in possession of the ball while on the mound. Start a new 20 seconds.

d. Unless it is a common sense pause for tying a shoe, swatting a bug, wiping sweat or cleaning glasses the clock should not have stopped. Since it was paused we can assume one of these things happened, right? Resume when he and the batter are ready after prompting.

D is the only choice for 2, as lousy as it is.

3 has to be a mistake. A, B and C are all valid reasons to pause the clock, D is not. The question should read: "In which of the following situations should the pitch clock not be paused?"

It looks like C and D to me. I've got Type B (Or "2") OBS on F6. The ball stays live and the BR is liable to be put out. He is the third out. If he is tagged before R3 touches home, the run would not count. Am I missing something here?

From my reading, the pitch clock could be paused in A, B, and C.

From the sounds of this play, R2 is not being played on when the OBS occurs. The throw was from F1 to F5, and F6 was guilty of the OBS. That looks like Type 2 to me.

It's type 2 OBS by F6. The ball stays live until F5 gets it.

But, if D is correct, then it was Type 2 OBS. That makes answers B and C also correct.

If it was Type 1, then the first two parts of A are correct, but I'd disagree with the award to BR (and the reasoning).

That makes sense, but I'm not sure you can answer a test question based on the question being a typo.

Good questions by Ceasers Ghost and UMPTTS43. I'm sure I'll see one or more of them on my test.

DR,
I would agree except that it is contrary to the video shown at the NCAA clinic this weekend. I may be confused but if a runner is advancing and the ball is being thrown there to put him out, a play is being made on him. It doesn't have to be a rundown or force play. The throw was directly from F1 to F5 in an effort to put out the runner, right? The bobble doesn't mean much.

I hate those questions. Assuming more than what is written is always something that trips me up. Did you get that answer correct on the exam?

I think you're right. The wording of the question led me to conclude the OBS by F6 occurred well before the throw to F5. At least it's the only way a single answer makes sense, although I agree with Bob about awarding the B/R 2nd base. I would keep him at 1st.

Same as OBR type B. If it is type 2, the ball stays live until the completion of the play. The only time you kill a type 2(B) obs is when the umpire that called the obs protects a runner to a base and that runner is tagged for an apparent out in which the umpire that called the obs also has the play. In other words, if U3 called the obs and judged that R2 is protected to third, yet a play is made on R2 where U3 would have to call him out, U3 would kill the play, award R2 third and place other runners, with possible assistance from the rest of the crew. If U3 called obs on a runner, and a play is made on that runner where another umpire has the call, PU for example, you wait until the entire play is over then get together and enforce any awards, if any, to nullify the obs.

In the additional questions posed, the first question is too vague to make a correct ruling from the options given, although d seems the most likely. We need to know when the obs occurred in relation to the throw to F5 in order to determine either type 1 or type 2 obs. If it is type 2, we need to know whether or not U3 is protecting R2 to third. For those reasons, b, c, or d could be correct.

I also agree that the second question was miswritten and should have had NOT included.

Have the 2011 Rules Supplement (handed out at the clinics) in front of you when you take the test. Some of the questions are taken directly from the "Test Your Rules Knowledge" section on page 10.

Thanks for the help. Still not sure what I am going to do.

One more, does NCAA have the same ruling about a batted ball that could go fair as pro rules has? That makes the difference between c and d being correct.

4. R1, R2, R3, one out. B5 lays down a "suicide squeeze" bunt that rolls into foul territory near the first base foul line. The ball is rolling back towards the foul line with a chance to roll fair. The pitcher instructs the catcher to "touch it foul" at which time the catcher scoops up the ball with the mask he is holding in his throwing hand.

a.Score one run and put the batter at first base.
b.Score three runs and put the batter at first base.
c.Foul ball.
d.Score three runs and put the batter at third base.

You won't find the language foul with a possiblitly to go fair in the NCAA rulebook.

Gentlemen, FYI, when you take and submit the test it will only tell you how many you missed (if you didn't get them all correct). It will not tell you which ones you missed (or what the correct answers should have been).

I took my test last night and didn't get them all correct, but I'll have to wait a couple of weeks until the key is posted to see which ones I missed and what the right answers should have been.

Overall I thought the test was good, but I also think the NCAA could use a few more proof readers to catch the poorly written questions.

JJ

CG, I am inclined to answer 'c'.

8-3-g only speaks of detached equipment with regards to fair batted balls. That would be a three base award. That eliminates b and d. As the ball was touched by the player in foul territory I don't see how I can award a base which would force a run to score.

I will take the test tonight or tomorrow and hope our discussion helps settle things. If I am incorrect in my application of rule here please let me know. Thanks.

This is C for sure. Go to MLB.com and search a few videos. Unfortunately you have to search "Interference" (I know the difference, but that's what you have to search to see examples) ball is immediately dead in the sitch you describe.

Thanks for all the replies.

Since we know that the ball is immediately dead on the OBS and the runner is awarded at least one base, answers a and d are invalid.

In no way would you award R1 third for this infraction. B is now done.

The answer has to be c, but I would not award R3 home in that situation.

Other questions have popped up that are just as vague and/or miswritten.

I'm sure the NCAA will come out with rewrites and interps when the testing time is done.

Man, who writes these NCAA tests? The same guy that writes the NFHS tests? :confused:

Take each play as it goes..

R1 is in a rundown, and gets Obstructed? That is considered a play on a runner, which makes the ball "Dead" and since R3 had not advanced to his next base he is sent back to his base unless he was forced, and in this play R3 was not forced.. Since R1 is awarded 1 base from his last legally touched base R1 would be sent to 2nd. and the same for R3 he gets sent back to his last legally touched base which is 3rd... So really there is no correct answer here.. If you want I can ask to the Pro guys here at school?

When the test is all done and no one can come in a take the test, they will send out which ones you missed.. they did this last year. Most likely the end of Feb.

The test closes Feb. 13.

Read the supplement. There's some excellent material in there.

The placement of R3 is at the discretion of the umpire.

well actually it is not.. we just went over all this at Harry's.. and had a question very similar to this play..

"All runners shall be awarded the bases they would have reached had there been no obstruction." That isn't umpire discretion?

I don't see a correct answer. Obstructed runner being played upon advances one base, ball is dead and all other runners are awarded the base they would have achieved, absent the dead ball. Since R3 was thrown out at home it is not likely he would have achieved home so he should not be awarded home, he should be returned to 3b since the ball was dead when the out was made. C is closest answer but don't seem right to me.

Can't see an out after a dead ball, and hard to see R3 awarded home since he can't reasonably be expected to have achieved it absent the obstruction. I am assuming that R3 did not pull up and stop running when type 1 obstruction was called and that was reason for him being thrown out, in which case C is surely correct.

In any event C is best answer of the ones provided.

yes in type "B" obstruction.

It also applies in Type A obstruction -- to all the runners who weren't obstructed, and to the obstructed runner if the award is beyond the one base minimum.

This is a HTBT type of play, but imagine this. R1 is obstructed and tagged out, this then allows the fielder to throw home and get R3 before he can score. I am not going to assume that he would have scored, but if he is about half way when obs occurs, I am gonna score him based on common sense and fair play. Who screwed up? I am not gonna then bail them out on anything where the offense had a chance to score. The OP doesn't tell us how close the play was at the plate. I also want to know why it wasn't killed when type 1 took place.

It seems test writers get wacky scenarios in their head which evaluate the test takers' ability to turn words into situations on the field and infer things rather than just test rules knowledge and application. This is one of them.

I'd answer (c) and wait for TTS to call BS on the question during the review session.

All you need to know is that when a play is being made on an OBS runner, the ball is dead immediately. That runner is awarded the next base automatically, and more if in the umpire's judgment he would have achieved them. All other runners are placed where they would have been had OBS not occurred, in the umpire's judgment. They may advance automatically as well if forced by the obstructed runner's advancement.

TS, Nebraska. Just for clarification.