Time for Ya'll to teach me something:
 

"Case Book 7.3.5 Situation F:

Situation: With R1 on third, one out and two strikes on B3, B3 swings and misses the pitch. The ball bounces off F2’s glove into the air, where it is hit by B3’s follow-through. The ball rolls to the back stop. B3 reaches first base safely and R1 scores.

Ruling: The ball is dead immediately. B3 is out for interference and R1 returns to third base. A batter is entitled to an uninterrupted opportunity to hit the ball, just as the catcher is entitled to an uninterrupted opportunity to field the ball. Once the batter swings, he is responsible for his follow-through.

Okay, I admit I am confused on this one because it flies in the face of logic (my logic, so obviously it is failed logic). There is nothing intentional being done.

F2 had a chance to field the strike originally. It seems we are rewarding the defense when they erred.

So, is this the same at the NCAA and OBR level?

I am quite upside down on this one.

T

Back Swing Interference
 

Tim, what would you do if R1 was stealing and the back swing hit the catcher as he was throwing? Or if it was strike 3 and in the catchers glove but he dropped it when the back swing hit the catcher? It is the same type of play and you are correct, intent does not have to be present. This is a rule in NCAA and OBR.

In OBR or NCAA, this would be backswing or "weak" interference. The ball is dead, and there is no penalty. In this case, the batter would be out on strikes and R3 would return.

Under OBR we call this "weak interference": strike on the batter, the ball is dead immediately, and runners return to their TOP bases.

Since FED doesn't want a different kind of interference, and they don't want to permit the offense to benefit from the batter's hindrance of F2, the only option is to call the batter out for INT.

Regardless of the count on the batter?

This is one of the Fed rules that I always have to highlight because it goes against intuitive thinking.

Roder calls it "interference without a play". If nothing was happening, you kill it right there. No one gets to move up, batter is OK in OBR. In Fed, its batter interference. I dread the day that I make this call.

I see what you mean: if the batter's out on strike 3 and then interferes, then we CAN (but need not) call a runner out for the batter's INT. Call out the runner who was being played on or, if that can't be determined, the runner closest to home. 7.3.5C,D

The penalty here is the same for any BI.

Tee as others mentioned there is no such animal as "weak interference" in FED, hence the penalty per the case play.

However, in this particular play the results are the same. B3 is out and R3 returned to 3rd base.

A little twist
The count was 1-1

In OBR the call would be

1. TIME
2. The count is now 1-2
3. R3 returned to 3rd base.

I think JR was one of the first to coin the phrase weak interference which as mentioned is NOT in any of the FED interps.

If you have "connections" to the FED perhaps you can "sway them" to adopt the weak interference call.

Pete Booth

Umpires who "start" with OBR and then go to FED find this ruling strange.

Umpires who "start" with FED and then go to OBR find the OBR "weak interference" ruling strange.

The proper mechanic is: "Time! That's a do-over and a strike on the swing."

OK, Phase II
 

Now let's say the ball is secured in F2's glove when the batter's follow-through causes the same result?

Batter would be out on Strike Three but what happens to the runner in NFHS rules?

T

If there's a reasonable chance that the defense would have retired the runner without the interference, then get the second out. If there's not such a chance, then return the runner.

Similar to 7.3.5C (and see also 8.4.2L)

Bob Jenkins is too quick
 

It's just like any other INF call in FED.

Batter is out, runner return, no added penalty. Just as if it is a regular INF on strike 3.

T, isn't the FED philosophy always to punish the offending team to the maximum extent of the law, so this play just seems to fit with it's existing philosophy?

John:
 

Sadly it is all the other rules codes that punish with the out closest to home.

With this years change of the runner contacting F5 in foul territory and calling that runner out is the first movement toward consistantly increasing penalties.

The National High School Coaches Association has been trying for the last five years to get rules changes at the FED national level so that the high school rule book more closely mirrors OBR.

T

Yes, you are right, but does not FED have the other priority; making things as easy to call as possible for its umpires? Max punishment + simple to call/remember= this ruling?

A "do-over"? Seriously? I'm hoping you're just trolling.

Lol
 

yawetag:

A couple of points.

Dash is a well respected posting member of this and other sites.

It appears that perhaps you have misplaced your sense of humor.

And finally, like it or not, there are legal "Do Overs" in baseball.

T

Thank you Tim.

I'm aware of Dash's status here and other places. That certainly doesn't mean he's perfect, and his reply was akin to other "everyone knows I'm joking" lines. If my read of it being a joke was incorrect, then I think Dash was wrong.

Of course there are legal "do overs." I would hate to think any of us don't know about the "batter causes the pitcher to balk" rule.

You're suggesting the OP situation is one of those times? The only "do overs" I know of don't include a strike on the call. If Dash meant "the runner returns to third" then I would agree; however, that's not a "do over."

In my experience, "do overs" don't include anything other than the same batter with the same count and runners returning to their original bases. If I'm wrong, then education in the matter would be greatly appreciated. However, I can't ever see myself using the term "do over" in any mechanic, unless it's "no pitch; runners return."

So,
 

the answer is in:

You have no sense of humor.

I can live with that.

T

Nothing could be farther from the truth.

For the record (and the assistance of newer players reading this thread), was Dash joking or serious?

If you have to ask, Tim C. was correct.

I apologize. I forgot that Dash, Tim, and you were perfect and never made mistakes. From now on, I'll assume that everything you three say has no mistakes and I'll never question it. :rolleyes:

Maybe next time Dash should include some sort of indication of sarcasm. It's hard to read it in one sentence.

Andrew,

For the record:

1. I have made mistakes here and on the field.
2. I will make more mistakes.
3. I was kidding you with "Time! That's a do-over!".
4. Are you kidding me?

Wow!
 

Hmmm,

1. I make errors here and in life.
2. I will make more mistakes here and in life.
3. I will NEVER miss another call during a game.
4. I really don't take softball umpires that seriously.

T

I concur.

Considering dash was the first to respond to the thread, then added the "do-over" response later, I'd say he was joking (seemed obvious to me). Actually, I consider ANY do-over response to be a joke, unless there is a valid rule siting with it. Besides that, the question had been asked and answered, so why not add a "dash" of spice to the conversation.:D

Accept it and move on. No need to continue defending yourself. On this particular subject you are in the boat alone and you're missing the paddles. Plus you've painted yourself in a corner and all you had left to say was "I forgot you're always right." Time to stop. I would expect the next response to be "I know you are but what am I?":eek:

You started all of this by suggesting dash was trolling. "Are you Joking?" would have been a better response. "Trolling" is not a good thing and you better have some support before you use that term.:mad:

Look on the bright side, they could have seriously dust rolled your butt, but all they did was say dash is OK. You got of easy, at first.;)

Note to PA umpires - our state interpreter wants backswing interference enforced in our games (NFHS Rules).

As for tim's post, if backswing INT happens on strike 3, the ball is dead, the batter is out and all runners return to TOP base. Same for NCAA and OBR.