Giving Game Fees back
 

I've just been notified by one of the assignors I work for that in order to work one of the bigger tournaments, we need to send him a check that matches one game fee for shirts, hats, etc. Normally, we are provided with tournament shirts and hats. I believe that this typically comes out of each team's entry fee, along with our game fees as well.

The reasoning is because of the bad economy, we as umpires can do something to make it easier on each team that signs up to play.

Now listen, I'm all for giving back. I had no problem last year working 4 games in a tournament and giving back all but enough for gas and six pack. The tournament was a fundraiser for a local girl who was sick.

But this one peeves me a bit more and I'm not sure I'll cave. The decision was made without my input at all, since I'm still in school and am 600 miles away from meetings. I guess perks of the union life...

Anyone have anything similar going on in their area?

They probably paid their entry fee months ago. What about the umpires who are affected by the "tough economic times" I would see how the other umps feel so if you choose to say anything at least you're presenting a united front as opposed to being seen as the complainer. Fortunately, I'm not seeing these issues on this part of the country.

I'd tell him to jump in a lake.

If they were so worried about it, they could just not buy hats/shirts and let the umpires wear their own stuff.

Let me rephrase: I would ask if he's giving part of his salary back, then tell him to jump in a lake.

Wait. Are you saying YOU need to pay up-front to work this tourney? In effect, you're paying $50-75 for a hat/shirt, that you'll probably not wear again.

I'm guessing that this is a for-profit tourney, where the TD pockets the dough. I'm also guessing that his signups are low, and he's looking to cut costs. Hey, who isn't?

Speak with your feet.

Sounds to me like an assignor is lining thier own pockets.

I do softball and had a high school coach make some comment to me the other day as she was handing us our checks for $42 each about how much money we make and must be pretty nice. I said ya, only have to work 20-25 games to pay off all the equipment and uniforms we have to purchase. She looked at me all dumbfounded and said, "oh, you have to buy all your own uniforms and equipment?"

How does this make it easier on the teams? You paying for hats and shirts doesn't help them, dropping entry fees does. Just drop the entry fees and forget about the "special" clothing.

Unless this is a membership fee (association, etc) I don't see the point.

"The economy is bad"

It's bad for all of us! But with amateur umpires, this is a "2nd job". While at times, this can be lucrative, it should not be so important that refusing to deal with jerks as in the OP, it would affect our economic status.

I have never given anything, other than the normal assigner fees, back to any league or association, nor should anyone else.

I was once assigned to a Regional Tournament in which I and my 5 partners were approached in the parking lot by the TD. He stated that we need to wear these Tournament shirts and they cost $25 each. I stated that my crew had their State Association uniforms and those would do fine. The TD started to hem and haw so I instructed my crew to undress and pack up. We were all back in out street clothes when the TD begged us not to go and we could wear our uniforms. I stated that it would cost him the double header fee, right now and we would be glad to get dressed. Without a word, the TD paid the cash and we worked the 2 games without a hitch.

Let me throw in that its not a situation of an assignor lining the pockets. It is probably more like an assignor is doing something to appease coaches.

Its the type of situation where if I walk, I would probably be the only one. To other umpires, it would look like I was a stubborn a**. I don't really want to blackball myself over it, but I sure as hell don't want to pay it either.

Challenging an established assigner by one's self is not usually a productive strategy. Nor is challening his ethics.

If you feel strongly about this (I certainly would), simply advise him that you are unavailable to work that tournament and find something else to do that weekend.

So don't. It's about YOUR principles not theirs.

How about a simple "No thank you". You don't HAVE to umpire, do you? Look, you have been asked to take less money per game, so it's your choice.

"This isn't Russia, is it Danny?"

That's what I was thinking. If your assignor asks you why, tell him that you can't afford a $50 shirt that you'll never wear again.

I don't work for free. The only time I have was a benefit basketball game for a kid who was fighting cancer, which is a completely different thing altogether. They are playing a tournament to make money and they want you to pay to work it? That's pretty ballsy in my opinion. I'd tell them no thanks and look elsewhere. As a previous poster noted, we all spend a lot of money on equipment, local and state association fees, and sometimes clinics as well. I do it because I enjoy it but I also consider it a part time job to earn some extra cash. If they can't afford to pay umpires, then they aren't doing a very good job of running their tournament. I don't know about the area where you live, but most assigners and schools in my area would be pretty hesitant to blacklist an umpire for refusing to kick back money to work a tournament, because they are pretty difficult to find anymore. There are a million places I can pick up games if I want to, so I'm certainly not going to work for free and would be even less likely to pay to work.

It's hard to believe that an assigner thought his umpires would agree to buy in to a tournament...work can't be that hard to come by out there. I had a couple of umpires approach our assn asking to work a memorial game (free game) for a team who lost a player in a motorcycle accident last summer. I think for the guys who reach out for this...is admirable to say the least.

Tell the assignor you won't be home during that tourney.

What team was that?

Matt, PM me if you want details...the umpires have told me that they don't want to make a big deal of it.

Tuss

Good to see you are back. From all your previous posts, this semester should be the your last, and over or almost over. Must be nice to go to a school where Joe West and Drew Coble went and are in the school's athletic hall of fame. Were you able to finish in 4 or did it take longer?

To your question. Since you know that many assignors (no not all) have 50-100 schools and each school pays $200 for each of 10-15 sports to be assigned (2-3k per school) and are making 6 figures for this job, in addition to whatever they make at their "real job", I would have said the assignor is looking after his pocket. Many of these assignors also handle summer leagues for different sports also. However, you said that was not the case, but it just doesn't pass the smell test to me. If he loses business, you lose business.

That being said, if I have read your past post's correctly and your future can go as you would like it, and you have read up on your history concerning your future endeavor, as the good history major you are, this summer thing might just be the least of your worries concerning a decision to that must be made. The decisions that you will have to make down the road over these types of financial issues and situations and to work or not work could be much more challenging if history continues to repeat itself ever so many years if you get my drift. Good luck with whatever you decide (you could seek council from some veterans in your CT association and why it doesn't bother them on this current issue), and good luck in the future. Never park where it says umpires(bearef??might get rid of this). Enjoy NASCAR and hockey when you can.

When my uncle (my late father's younger brother) died this past March, my sons told me that I was now "The Godfather" of the family. When they told me that I replied that if we were a Mafia Family, we should get a stimulus check from Uncle Sam because we are so lousy at being a Mafia Family, :D.

My point is, it sounds like the Tournament Director wants a kickback if you want to umpire and I would think that is racketeering under the RICO Act (see bribery or extortion, but probably bribery).

MTD, Sr.

If they are asking to give back game fees or pay extra costs after the fact, then it’s tacky and wrong. I volunteer for a charity tournament every year; they give us t-shirts, food and drinks. It’s a fun time with my brother blues and it’s for a good cause, but I know I’m volunteering upfront.

[QUOTE]Tuss I do not understand the aforementioned

When my assignor is contacted to cover a tournament we wear our HS Certified uniforms.

We do not buy separate apparel for each tournament that we cover.

I can understand getting a reduced FEE (as long as each umpire is guarenteed a certain number of games) due to the hard economic times but as mentioned I do not understand the need to buy shirts hats etc.

Pete Booth

I don't mind doing a game for free for a good cause - BUT - I will be the one choosing to do this. I hope he can't find anyone to do his tournament. :(

This is another excellent example of how people inside baseball are absolutely out of touch with umpiring.

I can't imagine an umpire that I know who would gladly comply with this preposterous arrangement.

But I know many other than myself, who would gladly donate their time for a worthy cause.

Ridiculous
 

So I guess that the " bad economy" does not affect Umpires. Your Assignor should be ashamed of himself for agreeing to this

Umpires are already exploited. The standard fee for the work that is performed is so far below what it's worth, it's a borderline disgrace. We're baseball's greatest suckers.

Negotiating game fees is like pulling teeth. Teams all want the greatest umpires but expect them all to work for next to nothing.

Many teams never believe what it costs in terms of equipment, keeping it upgraded, study time, drive time, vehicle maintenance, actually working the game...as if all of the stuff in my trunk magically appears there.

Amen!

I just emailed an AD from one of the schools that stiffed me this season, informing him of all that we incur with equipment, insurance, gas, time off work, etc. ... Let's just say, it was a revelation.

I hate when the money even has to be discussed, because I don't do it for the money. But when I get stiffed, I can't help but take a profound insult from all of it. Or how about when you drive 30 or 40 miles and find out the game was canceled a day and a half ago, but no one even considered picking up a telephone and notifying the umpires?

In this area, that means the school owes you for the entire contract.

-Josh

we get 1/2 game fee for showing up

classic example.

Same here. But the indignity is infuriating.

I have never done anything else in life where I am taken to such advantage. And I have a daughter in college! Even she appreciates me more.

Yep, when you walk out of the stadium and you hear "great game" or "great job" from obviously the winning team fans, we have to learn to not get too high on the "compliments" and to not get too low on the negative feedback...becasue they'll turn on you in a heartbeat. Not that we're out there to make friends, but it is a thankless hobby...that's for sure...and yes, even though we get paid 1/2 game fee of whatever...it is a punch in the gut to show up when nobody chose to let you know..but heaven forbid they're ready to play and for whatever reason you're 3-4 minutes late....

Same here. This happened to me once last year. If we get there and it's called off before it starts we get travel plus a rainout fee.

Nope. RICO requires two predicate offenses.

well an improper cancellation would be cause for a no-show which in my association, is billed at the full one game rate. I had a game last week that was cancelled without notifying us and my assigner said the school didn't hold up their end of the deal and I did so I was still entitled to one game's worth of pay (it's one game's worth of pay regardless if it was a single game, doubleheader, or even tripleheader that was cancelled improperly, but hey, we get to leave early!)

If a school stiffs umpires, my association will usually threaten to stop doing business with them which is a death wish for the schools since the only other association in our area has a reputation of having the worst umpires around...and my chapter usually has enough funds to pay umpires who get stiffed...

in a tournament, i'd ONLY split my game fees if we can get more umpires into the game. I'm perfectly willing to give half my game fees to a fellow blue so that we can have a 4 man crew instead of just 2 umps and if it's a REALLY long day, heck, i'd be willing to split my fees enough so that we can have 6 umps, saves the legs, don't have to move around so much and more eyes on the play. If a fellow blue hops into a game to do a 3 man crew with me for free, i'd sure as heck pay him for it or return the favor some other time. Think about the nice vacation after doing the plate, RF, LF, 3B. 2B is a warm-up, 1B is the game, and HP is the Big Game and then back to vacation: RF, LF, 3B.

Funny Kevin, but with that statement, you are doing it for the money! If you get stiffed, it upsets you as it does all of us. You negotiate for a fee (my association does this for us) and you have to justify your request for money.

So you are (and we all are who get paid) doing it for the money!

It's not a bad thing to admit so stop the "I'm not in it for the money" stuff and admit it. You love what you do and you like being paid for doing it! Once you admit to it in this light, you will find it easier to negotiate and walk away when necessary. I learned this lesson 25 years ago so I have no problem with it.

I love what I do and I like getting paid for it - plain and simple!

Interesting point Ozzy...We hear the "I don't do it for the money" line time and time again...including me. However, I'm starting to lean more along your line of thinking.

Matt:

Spoken like true lawyer. :D But could we have just plain old bribery or extortion?

MTD, Sr.

My statement is "I don't do it to make money, but I would not do it if I lost money". I want to make enough to cover my expenses, including the value of the annual leave I have to take for early afternoon games.

The statement is not on an individual game basis, but covers the entire year. The closest field to my home is twelve miles one way. When I have a game there and do not have to leave work early, my net gain is very high. The average distance for my travel is 35-40 miles one way with the longest drive right at 80 miles. If I have to leave work a couple of hours early for a game there, I will lose money, but it evens out in the long run.

I do not do it for the money!

But I don't do it to be exploited or insulted. I take insult at being exploited. There are multiple reasons why I do this, and being a mercenary is not part of it. But when I am dealt with dishonorably, I am insulted. I love what I do and I don't like being insulted for doing it. Brand it what you will.

I do it for the moms in the stands.:D

$$$$$$
 

Sounds like to me that either the TD, Assignor, or a crony of theirs is in the uniform business. Most of us retalize that for NCAA or HS there are required uniforms. But we wear them all season not for one tournament. It is hypocritical to use the bad economy as an excuse to relieve the teams of some financial burden, yet throw it on the officials.

My experience with running travel tournament teams for many years shows that the parents of most travel ball players need much less of a break than the average umpire.

If this were a high school game in my association, you're screwed. It's our job to call the school and verify the game is still on before leaving for the game. If the game is still on, you get the name of the person and drive to the school. If the game gets canceled at any time after that, you're paid for the game.

We have the same procedure in my association here in CT. We have to call the schools to verify especially sub-Varsity and Middle School games. However, if we are told that the game is on and we show up and the game is off or moved, we are still paid (under contract with the schools). The assigner handles all the dirty details in those cases.

I think on game day, the schools should hold the burden of calling/emailing the umpires...it shouldn't fall solely on the umpires...esp on game day...

This is exactly who should handle all the problems. Call the game and immediately leave the field and go home. If any procedures for money are not met, call the assignor and he should fix them including paying you the money immediately if some team stiffed you or tried to pay after the game. I have yet to hear of a pi$$ poor assignor. All the ones I have heard about have well paying day jobs and are making a nice stipend from the schools and teams and many charge umpires a fee to assign them also for their trouble.
Many assignors umpire games and many times get a lot (quantity and quality) of good games regardless of whether they are the best in their association or not. So let them pay you immediately when things go wrong, and this will solve all the problems. Believe me, if the assignor has to keep paying a lot of his umpires out of his own pocket (although many can well afford it) because teams are lax or tardy with paying the game fee on time, he will fix the problem (because it will be a pain in the a$$ for him just like it is for the umpires involved) including and up to, not booking that team with umpires any more. IMHO, put the responsibility where it belongs, on the assignor, who in many areas with many teams is handsomely paid. End of discussion.

In my area - if we don't receive a call cancelling in a timely manner - we get paid the contracted fee - w/ mileage. Timely manner means calculating the driving time - arriving at field 30 minutes prior to game time - plus 30 minutes. For example - if it takes 30 minutes to drive to field - we would have to be called at least 90 minutes prior to game time for us not to get paid. So far no problems - usually called in plenty of time. If game is cancelled for reasons other than weather - and they forget to call - we get paid. It is THEIR responsibility solely. We are not expected to keep track of all teams/schools.

This is moot through my organization. We're paid through the org, not at each individual school. I like it a lot better. I feel people, especially when the away team loses, tend to think things when you're handed a check at the game site.

One of the smaller leagues I ump for (away from the org) pays us cash for each game. We're most often paid in the office after the game, but one time the new president tried to hand me my pay on the field between innings. I politely declined and stated I would get it after the game.

In amateur organizations, it's pretty common to get paid at the field and it's no mystery how umps are paid. your association doesn't get their money from the sky...you're still getting paid by the teams. anybody who's going to "think things" or "say things" about me being paid for umpiring because their team lost doesn't get 1 second of my time in the first place. Maybe it's different out your way. I'm glad that we don't get paid through our association.

Why should that fall on the umpire(s)? Isn't there a contract in place between the school/school district and the assignor?

Here, if it's a rain issue, we have a website that is updated - like today, for example, where most of our games were killed - or we can call the assignor, quickly give name and place, and he'll let us know.

If a game is killed for other reasons, it's still not on us to call around. Two years ago, my partner and I show up at a private school for a JV game. There are guys on the field, but it's an obvious practice situation - shorts and T-shirts. It's the varsity team, and the coach says "Yeah, XXXX got rid of their JV team this year, so the game was canceled."

Really? Thing is, it wasn't - since they didn't bother to tell the assignor, that game was still on the schedule, so they owed me and my partner a game fee. I'm thinking they've tightened up their process for canceled games a little since then.

I don't involve myself with the contractual side of our organization. I'm assuming, however, the contract states that the school will pay a game fee if the game is canceled after the umpires call the school.

If the assigner knows, Arbiter is updated or a phone call is made by him. In instances where dozens of schools are canceling, how is he going to find time to not only field calls from all the schools but also call each umpire involved?

In the several games I've had canceled before leaving, only two were discovered by me when I made the phone call. The last one I had, the A.D. said "I just canceled the game and called [assigner]."

In my organization, you would have called the assigner. He would then ask, "Did you call the school before leaving for the game?" You would respond, "No, I didn't." At that point, you're screwed.

Had you called, you tell the assigner the name of the person you talked to, what time you called, and what they said. That information is passed to the school along with the bill.

I don't see how it's "calling around" either. We have one number to call; it's most often the A.D., his secretary, or an "activities hotline" number that's updated with the game status. The calls take no more than two minutes.

The umpires shouldn't have the burden of calling the same hotline as the parents. If it works in your area...I guess it works...but I would never go for that here...nor would our other members

Here, if no one calls you get half game fee to show up. Full game fee is only if the game gets started. I generally only call if weather conditions make me suspect the game is cancelled. I leave work to go to games so would rather not if game is not going to be played. If it is 7:00 game I call early because you will not get anyone past 3:00.

Around here if you're on the way to the game when it gets axed, you get mileage. If you are at the game site and it gets washed, you get one game fee most of the time.

One association uses the Arbiter and it is updated 99% of the time when a cancellation happens. The other assigner puts cancellations on his answering machine as they come in. People know to call it and check before they leave. Both associations stress that when in doubt, call the school before you leave and check.

Another Fee Question
 

Here is a situation I encountered this year. . Crew of two. AAUgly. Doubleheader, to be paid at field by coaches. We agree to be paid betwix games to get things rollling, no reason to believe we won't be paid. Since its two fees, one will take two game fees from one team, the other two from other team (yeah, bad idea for a lot of reasons, I concede that and move on). H wins Game One handily. I get paid betwix games by V. Game Two, first inning, two close calls go against V while they are at-bat, both by me. Coach yips about it, nothing unusual, he may have been right.. I move to cover first with bases empty, next to his bench and take usual abuse from moms and dads, which I find amusing since I have been in their situation where you pay a lot of coin for kids to do AAU programs and believe that gives you the right to blast officials all afternoon. Coach commiserates with moms and dads who each paid $2K in fees for inter alia, coaching fees and says: "I guess they want to get out of here (and call outs to move the game)" Not a terrible line by baseball standards, I'll live with it. Then C says "I shouldn't have paid them 'till we were through."

I ignored it. Ever since I have thought I should have dumped him as soon as that comment flew out of his mouth. This coach had previously pulled a kid off the field for *****ing and told him he was thru for the day because of it, so maybe I was giving him credit for respecting the game. I'm a rook at baseball, but have done hoops for years and would have slapped an instant T for a similar comment on the court, but was reluctant to chase the coach for one remark.

My question: Would you send the coach to the parking lot for this, warn him, or be stoic about it? My thought at the time was that it was steam-blowing and it was a one-liner (grandstanding to be sure) uttered off-field but within earshot and not worth taking the kids' coach away. On the other hand, I wonder if I put myself in a position of allowing my integrity to be questioned and should have dumped him immediately. Is the fact that I thought about it afterward a sign I should have dumped him? Is the fact that I even raise the question a sign that I should have dumped him?

It might be construed as rabbit ears...but you don't have to care about that either...if you knew that he was intentionally saying it loud enough for you to hear, I suppose you could run him...but personally, for just that incident alone, I probably wouldn't eject.

See ya -- you've not only questioned my integrity... you've done it behind my back to incite the crowd and were stupid enough to let me hear it.