Working the bases in a game played under Fed rules, the batter (with no outs and no runners on base) hits a ground ball between the first baseman and pitcher. My partner behind the plate, reacting to the sound of the ball hitting the bat, quickly calls a foul ball. However, he is suprised that despite the sound, the ball was obviously fair. Yet, because he had called "FOUL" so loudly, the batter-runner instantly returned to the plate. Thus, the defense easily retires the batter-runner at first. After the inning, we both laughed off the call, and luckily the coaches weren't upset by the play. However, in discussion, my partner and I wondered if the play should stand, or if his accidental, incorrect calling of "foul" should allow the batter a fair (no pun intended) chance.

<i> Originally posted by Lilblue612 </i>

<b> Working the bases in a game played under Fed rules, the batter (with no outs and no runners on base) hits a ground ball between the first baseman and pitcher. My partner behind the plate, reacting to the sound of the ball hitting the bat, quickly calls a foul ball. However, he is suprised that despite the sound, the ball was obviously fair. Yet, because he had called "FOUL" so loudly, the batter-runner instantly returned to the plate. Thus, the defense easily retires the batter-runner at first. In discussion, my partner and I wondered if the play should stand, or if his accidental, incorrect calling of "foul" should allow the batter a fair (no pun intended) chance. </b>

The applicable rule for FED is rule 10-2-3L
The UIC shall rectify any situation in which an umpire's decision that was REVERSED has placed either team at a disadvantage.

When B1 reacted to the call of FOUL (he returned to the plate), you CANNOT change to Fair because that would put the offense at a disadvantage.

Pete Booth

Thank you for the reference to the Fed rule. However, since the call cannot be changed to fair, would a strike be added to the count because of the foul call?

<b>"Thank you for the reference to the Fed rule. However, since the call cannot be changed to fair, would a strike be added to the count because of the foul call?"</b>

The call would be a foul ball, just like any other foul ball. With less than two strikes, a strike would be added to the count. If you didn't add the strike, it wouldn't be treated as a foul, it would be more of a "no pitch" and that's not the case.

"My partner behind the plate, reacting to the sound of the ball hitting the bat, quickly calls a foul ball."

Sorry coach. It SOUNDED foul. WOW!

Bob

<b>"Sorry coach. It SOUNDED foul. WOW!"</b>

Maybe it sounded like it hit the plate? :D


(giggle)

How does a ball sound foul? This reminds of my mother telling me on the phone in college that I sounded thin.

Lots of good blind umpire jokes in that statement.

Now we can expect coaches to start yelling at their catchers for not catching all of those pop ups behind the screen that sounded "fair".

Not to sound the alarm papa c has state the only time to use 10-2-3l is to get the call right, and get the out in obr
you live with the foul call , the thread over their was " first pitch of the game " and the issue was really cooked
up by a lot of people , jon bible was against carl as well
as other's it's a good read , but it all boil's down to
the basic issue of " timming " it an't nothing til you call
it wait a moment find it , call it ,

One of the camp's I went to [ neuc 2002 , hollowell. timmons, ioassoga, ] GAVE A GOOD POINT on calling that
little squiber foul ball that hit's the batter and scoot's out as a DEAD BALL you avoid the hassle of explaining
why a ball that's in fair territory is foul , if the coach
did not see the contact that made it foul , and a FOUL BALL
is alway's a DEAD BALL .

I know I don't post here that often, but go read carl's
thought's on this matter, as well as other's , and remember
it's only in nfhs rules that you can do this .

mac

"Foul Ball...that's a catch."

The proper mechanic is to point foul, and signal and verbalize, "Catch".

Bob

Foul Fly?
 

GarthB:
A fly ball is not fair until hits the ground or goes out of play foul. If the ball is one foot outside the foul line or 21 ft, the ball is live until something causes it to become foul. Just my interpretation.

Correction
 

OOPS! Change Fair to Foul

A ball that is caught in live-ball territory is neither foul nor dead. The only signal from PU is "out!"

Fly ball
 

My point, it is not a foul ball until something causes the ball to go foul. A ball in foul territory is not foul. How can you signal foul before 2-16-1(a-d) is satified. If the fielder makes the catch,it is a catch and an out. You start calling foul balls on a catch, your asking for trouble. If a catch, live ball runners advance at own risk, Not a catch, foul ball-dead ball.

PETER , Did you look at umpire.org thread, and how do you
feel you did not put the defensive team at an extreme disadvantage by them having to get four out's in this inning
the batter/ runner is never going to beat the throw ,
I am looking to see your thought's on this matter

<i> Originally posted by MAC </i>

<i> Originally posted by PeteBooth </i>
<i> Originally posted by Lilblue612 </i>


<b> PETER , Did you look at umpire.org thread, and how do you
feel you did not put the defensive team at an extreme disadvantage by them having to get four out's in this inning
the batter/ runner is never going to beat the throw ,
I am looking to see your thought's on this matter </b>

Well to answer you that is the uknown question. When the offensive player reacted to the call of FOUL you don't change to fair. We don't know what would have happened if B1 kept running. There could have been an overthrow etc.

The point is we don't know. All we know is at the time the ball was called FOUL, one player reacted.

The bottom line here is: 99.9% of the time when the umpire signals and says FOUL <b> It is FOUL </b> That's why we are trained to slow down our timing and not make calls too quickly, but it does happen. As my mentor once told me, when one umpire yells FOUL, we all YELL Foul.

Pete Booth

Once an umpire has called "Foul!" or "Dead Ball!", that's it. It's over. Period. All you can do is put your tail between your legs and eat that one. (How many times have you seen an umpire throwing his hands up and calling "Time" while a runner behind him is running from 2nd to 3rd? And guess what? If somebody throws over to 3rd and tags the runner, or if the runner ends up making it safely to 3rd---well, he's GOING back to 2nd because of the "time" call. All you can do is place the runners (and batter, if need be) back at their last legally occupied bases when the play was killed. There's NO other option---not even 9.01c. (Just pray that ESPN wasn't there filming the game---grin).

Garth, "maybe he heard it hit the plate"???? A ball off the plate is still fair. If we are going to make something up, i'd claim to have seen in bounce off a shoe or something!

Boone:

It was a joke.

GB

damn internet, your subtle humor was lost on me!