fly out supersedes declared out ?

[_Bruno_]

strange situation, but possible.
sit : bases loaded, 2 outs, 3-2 count.
Runners are running on the pitch, except R1 who thought, there’s just one out. The batter lifts a high fly ball into RF. AFTER R3 touched home plate and before the ball was caught, the BR passed R1 and the umpire declared the BR out (3rd out) for passing another runner.
Since a declared out, is not a force out, may R3 legally score ?
Does the fly out automatic supersede the declared out (on the same player) ?

regards

[umpjayfire]

That base has not legally been attained by the B/R because R1 has not advanced (it's still R1's)(think of what happens when 2 runners occupy 1 base...who is out?...th)...therefore he has not reached first before the third out and no run scores

[ozzy6900]

At the time of the pitch, bases were loaded which forces all runners to advance, no matter what. This means that the fly ball caught is the 3rd out, no run scores because the BR did not attain 1st base. The situation with R1 not running means absolutely nothing here.

[Maz17]

Guys... this is easy. It is not passing until the ball is dropped and in play. B/R has not acquired a base yet. The passing is not the third out. The FIRM AND SECURE POSSESSION AND VOLUNTARY RELEASE of B/R fly ball is.

[_Bruno_]

just got the answer :
From J/R
"After batting an airborne ball, the batter-runner could pass a lead runner before the catch. Such batter-runner should only be called out if the ball is fair and uncaught (regardless of whether he has returned to a position behind the lead runner)."

thanks

[UmpTTS43]

My mechanic on this would be to point at the BR and say "that's passing." After the outfielder has complted his play, catch or no-catch, I would make the appropriate call. On a catch, I would vebalize "that's a catch." On a drop, "no catch. you, pointing to BR, are out for passing." If a coach decides to come out in either situation, I would stop him and confer with my partner just to make sure we were on the same page.

[Kevin Finnerty]

That's why some of us come here. Thanks, 43

[SAump]

"That's passing!"
Is the verbal call above recognized by MLBUM, NCAA or FED?

I wouldn't be excited about verbalizing that call in public.
Why explain why aloud? Giving way too much info.
Ozzy nailed it. "He's out!"

[UmpTTS43]

Originally Posted by SAump

"That's passing!"
Is the verbal call above recognized by MLBUM, NCAA or FED?

I wouldn't be excited about verbalizing that call in public.
Why explain why aloud? Giving way too much info.
Ozzy nailed it. "He's out!"

I believe the phrase "that's passing" is an accepted mechanic for professional ball. I know the call is accepted in NCAA and in FED I would use it.

A rules infraction has occurred at the time of passing. This will have a determination concerning the outcome of the play. You must vebalize this infraction. Same as "that's: obstruction, interference, a balk," whatever the case may be. If you don't verbalize the infraction and then go back and enforce it, you will have someone coming out for an explanation. If you call it at the time of the infraction, someone probably will be coming out, but at least you will have an easier time explaining yourself.

I cannot think of why you would not make this call verbal.

You cannot just say "he's out" until you determine the reason why he's out regardless of him being out for any number of reasons. If you call BR out as soon as you see the passing, you now have a time play because of your call. If the ball is eventually caught for the third out, we do not have a time play. BR is out either way, but when and why the out is called has huge ramifications if a run is on the line.