Interference / Force Play Slide
 

Fed.

R1. No outs. Slow roller to F6, F4 takes the throw at second. The force play is made at second and R1 comes in standing up. F4 had to step toward third to throw to first. In my judgement, this altered the play to first. I killed the play immediately; I ruled interference and called the batter-runner out as well.

Coach didn't agree stating that the runners never required to slide. I agreed but stated that the runner may not alter the play.

Your thoughts?

Did I kick the play?

Edit: Added number of outs.

You got the play right if this is truely how you feel. But, the fact that you're questioning it makes me think you may be questioning what it is you saw.

My question would be, did F4 have to step toward third to make the throw, or was it his momentum that took him toward third. If it was his momentum... maybe you kicked it, maybe not. I guess it's HTBT.

Sounds like the right call to me

Just wanted to double check and make sure I'm not crazy.

I don't think his momentum as he was stationary when it caught the ball.

In that case, it seems as though you nailed this one... good job!;)

But also remember that many times it is normal for f4 to either step backwards or towards third to make the turn on the DP. This keeps them out of the way of the runner who is legally going into 2B. But you thought he interfered, so its a good call. I think that's the bottom line on this type of play.
Thanks
David

The burden on this type of play is on the offense here. If you think he interfered, the coach needs to coach his players better.

It is my understanding that the runner needs to move AWAY from the fielder if he does not slide. The runner going straight into the bad is NOT moving AWAY from the fielder. Runner Interference. Out and a out.

It is like getting a free out. :D

Agreed, but will add that if the fielder is moving away from the bag, then the runner can run straight to the bag.

I think it's a good call. Runners never have to slide, but a runner going into 2B standing up better be well out of the fielder's way.

Good job explaining the rationale to the coach, btw. Often that's the hardest part of this call. Short and sweet.

But I would be careful in explaining to a coach that the runner has any obligation to slide.

This is baseball and the runner cannot just disappear. But if there is intent to interfere then the umpire can make the call of DP.

Basically the runner can go directly to the base or away from the fielder, but if he's going right into the base, he does have a lot of leeway as long as he doesn't do anything to intentionally interfere.

If the coach doesn't like the decision, as Carl used to say, "tell him to play an upperclassman at F4" (grin)

Thanks
David:)

Positioning
 

What position/location were you in when you made the call?

Agreed. Sorry, I was not going to try to cover EVERY possibly scenario that could happen in my post. I am sure the rest of the board will take care of that. ;)

I rest my case from my last post. ;)

And I think you are possibly missing the point of the rule. If he doesn't veer away from the fielder, than he MUST slide to not be called for interference. His "intent" has NOTHING to do with anything. I am no mind reader, and don't think I will ever gain that skill. FED and NCAA doesn't require me to read minds and figure "intent" with this rule. Avoid, slide, or get nailed for interference. It is really as simple as that.

(Gasp!!)

New to the game?

Or just assuming that everytime a runner doesn't slide he interferes?

What if the fielder doesn't attempt the play to first?

What if there is no contact and no alteration of the play?

A runner never "must slide" to avoid an interference call in HS ball. There are always options.

Well, seeing how you have called out about every "myth" to this rule that I could ever think of, I should be asking if possibly YOU are "new to the game".

Read my above post carefully.

Debate by diverson. Nice technique.

So, following your new direction, the fielder not attempting a play is a myth? The runner not sliding and not interfering or altering the play is a myth?

You may be rei, but you're no rules Rei

No, he does not need to attempt a play.

Yes, not sliding OR avoiding the fielder is interference. Altering the play has nothing to do with the FED Force Play Slide Rule.

Read the rule again. Then compare it to your statement that if the runner doesn't veer he MUST slide.

FED 8-4-2 Any runner is out when he:

(b) does not legally slide and causes ilegal contact and/or illegally alters the actions of a fielder in the immediate act of of making a play....

2. Runners are never required to slide.....

Nice. Now, look up Force Play Slide Rule. :rolleyes:

Oh, lord.

8-4-2 (b) includes the FPSR

What part of Runners are never required to slide..... don't you understand?

They may encourage making up rules wherever you are, but it is highly discouraged in the northeast.

Not even close. I don't have time today, but will look up in my archives and find you the exact FED ruling/interpretation.

I've just read your other posts, and obviously you don't know what you are talking/writing about as far as this rule.

Intent has everything to do with this rule on this type of play. Others have tried to tell you also, you can never make a call simply because the "runner must slide" as the rules simply tell you this is never required.

The other side of this rule is that simply because you "do" slide, that does not protect you totally. It must be legal, etc.,

And yes FED rules and NCAA both require you to read intent on a variety of calls - FPSR, and also others such as Interference and of course Obstruction.

Thanks
David

I think you better re-read what I have posted VERY carefully.

I don't have time to play this game about rules. I've found a link to a great thread that explains all of this in detail and it also has the link that I talked about that covers every different type of play at second and what is considered a violation and not

http://forum.officiating.com/showthr...highlight=FPSR

Thanks
David

We are not required to rule on intent, only did the runner interfere or not. If I could read minds consistently I would play poker for a living and as my hobby.

If, as the original post indicates, "F4 had to step toward third to throw to first. In my judgement, this altered the play to first" then it is FPSR if runner came in standing up, since he did not veer or slide, but instead interfered by coming in standing up and by so doing altered play. If, in some other case, he came in standing up but did not alter play, then no FPSR. Example, F4 is in a stretch on SS side of 2B to get a throw from F5 and runner comes in standing up.

Good post, instead of saying intent, I should have stuck to the actual ruling which talks about "alteration of play". That's the better explaination for the FPSR.

Thanks
David