All Outs Are Not In The Rules
 

WoodyUmp posted that all outs can be defined, justified and referenced byt the rules.

http://forum.officiating.com/showpos...7&postcount=21

Don't know which rules he means but this statement is false by all rules I know (OBR, NCAA, FeD, Pony, Dixie, LL, AABC blah) including local rules.

fitump56,

To me, an interesting question.

After reflection, I found Forest's assertion to be true.

Perhaps you could provide an example which supports your point...

JM

Fair enough. An extreme one, I have others.

Billy Martin is coaching the Yanks, it's 1977. Reggie "Steroids Not Me " jackson is in RF and suddenly dies of a massive heart attack. Before anyone can see Reggie flop to the ground, B hits a screamer to RF and Jackson's rigor mortis glove hand has the ball stick in it.

According to OBR, a player must "assume and field his position" calling to question how a dead man can do either.

:D

And now, back to our ballgame
 

Situation 1: Pitch is delivered right down the middle of the strike zone for the perfect strike. The ball is less than ten feet from the plate when the sprinkler system in the infield is activated. The batter couldn't resist the temptation to offer at the perfect pitch and hits a sharp grounder to the shortstop. The batter doesn't hesitiate and starts running for first base. The shortstop gloves a "wet" grounder and makes the throw in time to get the out at first base. You make the call!

Who says it's an out? The player doesn't have control. OTOH, it is still in flight so if another player takes it out of the glove it is then an out.

Bring on the others.

No such rule exists..................


All defensive players with the exception of the catcher shall be on fair territory when the ball is put into play. Dead or alive he would have met that requirement.


Tim.

Besides, the language "quoted" does not exist within the text of the OBR rules, so it's kind of a "moot" point.

JM

Out?
 

Situation 2: No outs, 3-2 count, R1 stealing on the pitch, F1 delivers curveball. RH batter recognizes curve will pass over the plate for a strike and he swings at the last moment. Too late, the ball contacts the batter's hand. As the ball deflects to the ground, the batter continues his follow through with the barrel of the bat passing through the strike zone and over his left shoulder. You make the call.

Dead ball strike............

Batter out; R1 returned


Tim.

In that fascinating play where Reggie Jackson dies but the ball goes into his glove anyway, I'd call it an out and claim that I saw Jackson take his last breath after the ball went into his glove and the required 3 seconds had passed.

But this brings up the question of, What if Jackson was clearly dead when the ball went into his glove—no breathing, no pulse—but he was revived later at a hospital?

I'm searching PBUC, J/R, Evans, etc., for guidance on this possibility.

This thread belongs in the WOBW Hall of Fame. It just might provide the definitive insight to the nagging question: "Is Fitump fit to ump?"

Is there any doubt after this thread about the value of the 'ignore' list?

Why do you think this is a difficult call?

I have eliminated all the extraneous information from this sitch, what remains is "the ball contacts the batter's hand" .

This makes the call quite simple, does it not? :confused:

I'm thinking I'll get struck by lightning before that type of play scenario happens

Level of diffculty?
 

Expected THAPOTB, call it either hit-by pitch or foul ball, from someone standing in the 3B coaching box. :(
Failing to recognize the proper call made by a real umpire, in this case, BU56. :o
Stumped by that response, felt the call was far more difficult to make than that call to 9-1-1 in the OP. :rolleyes:

well, its either hit by pitch or a strike, but not a foul ball if the ball just hits the batter and not the bat :D

i think more often than not if the batter steps out either just before or right at the start of the pitchers motion, the pitcher stops on his own. i also think if he were too continue, most of us will "give" him the pitch. then deal with the situation as needed.

steve

Where does the rulebook prohibit that? And don't respond with 6.02(b) as you did above. You left out: "6.02 (b)The batter shall not leave his position in the batter’s box after the pitcher comes to Set Position, or starts his windup."

That comes before the line you quoted: "The batter is not at liberty to step in and out of the batter’s box at will."

Clearly the rule is addressing the batter's actions when the pitcher comes set or starts his wind-up. Taking a sign in between pitches is not what is being addressed here.

While the minor leagues have added the requirement of one foot in the batter's box, the major leagues and the OBR have not.

I agree. This is probably the stupidest thread I have seen in a long time!

It's right up there with the old Thomas White's "White wears white" thread.

Hope the headache's better, Ozz!


Tim.

I'll play along for giggles. He ain't dead until pronounced dead by an authority having jurisdiction over dead. OUT.

Oh my, the Deej is on to something here. :p

Then if pronounced dead, do we have a review? If so, and the call is dead, dead when?

So a coach can roll out a cadre of corpses, Tim? Fielding nine, eight in play, met the requirements, according to you.

Perhaps a definitive for you, sadly you're miscued emotions bear you as a shallow interpreter of skills. Deej is as good as there is and the testamanet is the respect he receives universally on the field.

I cannot resist:
http://www.jubys.com/1998/98qx6463.jpg
As coroner, I coroned her,
I thoroughly examined her,
Not only is she merely dead,
She's really most sincerely dead.......

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahaha.

Please don't feed the trolls.