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-   -   Complaints, Change And Resistance (https://forum.officiating.com/baseball/36194-complaints-change-resistance.html)

Jim Porter Wed Jul 04, 2007 11:19pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Publius
They call us independent contractors so our actions or inactions don't reflect upon them. We are not members of league administration.

They call us independent contractors so they don't have to pay for worker's compensation insurance.

fitump56 Thu Jul 05, 2007 02:56am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Porter
They call us independent contractors so they don't have to pay for worker's compensation insurance.

More than that. No requirement for withholding, less restrictions on defaulted child support, no taxable payroll, no employee insurance liabities, and a 1,000 other reasons.

Not the least of which is ICs hiding taxable income.

fitump56 Thu Jul 05, 2007 02:59am

Quote:

Originally Posted by greymule
I'm 58. In my life, I've had easy jobs and hard jobs, and invariably the easier a job is, the more it pays; the harder it is, the less it pays. I'm not talking necessarily about enjoyment, just difficulty.

My experience too.

Quote:


This was true in my first job, the hardest one I ever had, teaching in a public high school (for peanuts). Far easier was training people at large companies—for vastly more $$. Even within the large companies, the easiest jobs paid the most. Easier still was sitting home and assigning other people to do the work, which paid even more.

You know that people working for minimum wage don't have easy jobs.

Umpiring is enjoyable, but it is hard work. But what's easier (and more fun), a game between two good college teams or a rec league walkfest that pays far less? See my point?
Sure do. ;)

fitump56 Thu Jul 05, 2007 03:11am

Quote:

Originally Posted by charliej47
By your definition everyone is always under someone's thumb. When you pay to have you hair cut, they are under your thumb. When you go to work, you are under your bosses thumb.

The answer is simple. Does that person, company or entity pay me; if they do, how important to their existence or lifestyle are those $$$.

Quote:


Or you can look at it as a business transaction. That is why in the state of Ohio I am labeled a contractor. The HS contracts with me to perform a piece of work under certain conditions and I sign a contract that obligates both of us.

When I "contract" to umpire a ball game, it is under certain conditions. I am an independent contractor performing "piece of work" "umpiring a ball game" for a certain amount of money under established rules that I will enforce and they can not change.
Being an IC means nothing. The only real question is, "Do I need the money
" (either as IC or employee). If you do, then all the chest pounding about how independent we are is nothing but chest pounding. If you really don't, then don't take it.

fitump56 Thu Jul 05, 2007 03:17am

Quote:

Originally Posted by NFump
If'n I don'ts get paid, how's I ever gonna gets me a HSM to protects me grape when I forgets to WATCH THE F"N BALL!!!!!?

1) I will send you one of my HSMs

2) With an English learning program diskette in the same box.

mbyron Thu Jul 05, 2007 07:05am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Porter
They call us independent contractors so they don't have to pay for worker's compensation insurance.

Or withhold income tax.

lawump Thu Jul 05, 2007 09:35am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Porter
They call us independent contractors so they don't have to pay for worker's compensation insurance.

And in an attempt to limit their liability. Employers are generally liable for the wrongful actions of their employees. They are generally not liable for the wrongful actions of their indepedent contractors. Its called Respondeat Superior liability.

This is an oversimplified statement, but it conveys the gist.

jimpiano Thu Jul 05, 2007 03:28pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by fitump56
The answer is simple. Does that person, company or entity pay me; if they do, how important to their existence or lifestyle are those $$$.



Being an IC means nothing. The only real question is, "Do I need the money
" (either as IC or employee). If you do, then all the chest pounding about how independent we are is nothing but chest pounding. If you really don't, then don't take it.

Being an Independent Contrator has nothing to do with being able to work the job anyway you want. It means you are responsible for your taxes, insurance, medical insurance, etc. Which also means that the expenses of performing your job, travel, equipment, dues, some forms of insurance, etc, are deductible from your gross pay.

Independent does not mean being able to change the job desription or " do your own thing".

Publius Thu Jul 05, 2007 11:15pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimpiano
Being an Independent Contrator has nothing to do with being able to work the job anyway you want. It means you are responsible for your taxes, insurance, medical insurance, etc. Which also means that the expenses of performing your job, travel, equipment, dues, some forms of insurance, etc, are deductible from your gross pay.

Independent does not mean being able to change the job desription or " do your own thing".

Being an independent contractor has a helluva lot to do with being able to work a job the way you want. The control of the choice of methods in completing the work is one of the defining differences between an employee and an IC.

Being an IC doesn't necessarily mean your expenses are fully deductible, either. You have to operate with a profit motive.

briancurtin Thu Jul 05, 2007 11:54pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbyron
That must be a record - what was it, 9 ignored posts in a row? How liberating.

such a great feature
for those not using, here is a taste:

http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/4761/fitumpgr1.jpg

3appleshigh Fri Jul 06, 2007 08:02am

it is a great feature, but aren't you dying to see what idiocies come out next, I'm considering an unignore, because I hate not knowing. LOL Then again this feature does keep me smarter.

Jurassic Referee Fri Jul 06, 2007 09:02am

Quote:

Originally Posted by briancurtin
such a great feature.....

The problem is though that you don't know what new name PWL/StevenTyler/FitUmp56 is gonna post under next.:D

mbyron Fri Jul 06, 2007 09:34am

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3appleshigh
it is a great feature, but aren't you dying to see what idiocies come out next, I'm considering an unignore, because I hate not knowing.

Every ignored post has a link in the upper right corner: "View this post"

Frankly, I don't use it much.

jimpiano Fri Jul 06, 2007 10:14am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Publius
Being an independent contractor has a helluva lot to do with being able to work a job the way you want. The control of the choice of methods in completing the work is one of the defining differences between an employee and an IC.

Being an IC doesn't necessarily mean your expenses are fully deductible, either. You have to operate with a profit motive.

Really?

That may be true if you are cutting grass.

But try making up your own rules for baseball and see how far you get.


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