I'm getting to buy a pair of pants..which ones?
 

I'm going to buy a pair of combo pants before the weekend is done, and I need you guys to let me know which ones to buy. Which online source, which style of pants, etc. should I get (considering current price, comfort, quality, fit, etc...all the factors)?

Thanks!

I recently bought two pairs (plate and base) of Gerry Davis brand pants from gerrydavis.com...the best money I have invested in uniforms thus far...Great fit, comfortable, look sharp...everything I have looked for in a pair of pants...

Dont buy combos...

+POS, pluspos.com, has them on sale for 25% off right now. I like their pleated front combo pants. Just make sure they have them in stock(i.e. call first) before you lay your plastic down.

On some folks combo pants just don't work. But if you have an athletic build they are a good choice for lots of situations. Combos don't work with folks of more generous proportions. YMMV.

Best advice about buying combo pants....don't. If you're not a tubby, they look terrible on the bases. And if you're a tubby, they look terrible behind the plate.

Bite the bullet and buy plate pants and base pants. Umpires look better in uniforms that fit properly.

The Honigs poly-wool are excellent.

heather gray colored slacks that fit :)

I'll give a different take on the combo pant issue. I wear Honigs combo pants as plate pants, and Honigs base pants as base pants. In my experience, the combo pant leg is plenty flared to allow it to easily fit over shinguards (I use West Vest guards), and the Honigs plate pants are so much more flared I feel like I should be singing "Bell Bottom Blues" while wearing them.

But whoever said you need different pants for plate and bases because of the length is right on. If you try to wear the same pant for both, you're either going to be highwater when working the plate or looking frumpy on the bases due to them being too long.

Don't buy combo pants, they look terrible. They look like someone that doesn't have the time or the money to buy PROPER pants for the position they are in.

Don't buy combo pants.

DON'T take the blanket statement by anyone about combos. Look, after years of bicycle racing and triathlons my quads are bigger than the average Joe. Off the rack base pants make me look like John Travolta circa 1977. When I know I'm doing the plate, I've got plate pants. The combos look good on me on the bases, and I can use them on the dish if needed. For ME, the extra length to the plate shoe gets taken up by the shin guards. But that's me. I have no doubt that combos look horrific on others, I've seen it.

Me, I like the Honigs combos, 2" over my Levi 501 size in the waist. Remember, you're tucking in two shirts, thus the extra inches. I also like the +POS plate pants. I've got +POS base pants, for those anal assignors, and they look okay. But again, that's me, and not you or anyone else.

Fashionistas
 

Come longer than "hell" or shorter than "high waters," I certainly hope I don't get judged on the length of my COMBO pants. :D

garth is right: honigs poly-wools are great

however, i only have them for the bases right now. im replacing my honigs regular plate pants with honigs poly-wools very soon.

I really can't tell when someone has plate, base, or combo pants on. I guess i'm just not looking hard enough.

The only time someone will clearly notice is if they're too tight or you're wearing sears pants.

Plate/Base/Combo Pants
 

Waht if Combo pants fit you very well for working the plate (i.e., with shinguards on)? Wouldn't those look a little better-tailored than plate pants, which have extremely wide legs?

And what if you are going to do a double header at a field/facility where changing out of plate pants into base pants is extremely inconvenient? Wouldn't combo pants help you do your job better by not looking too outrageous (tree trunks) when you end up doing the bases?

Mostly a LL umpire here, let the arrows fly, if necessary.

if you have combo pants that are the right length for doing the plate, then they might look alright. however, if your combo pants are the right length for the plate, they are probably too long on the bases.
i have big thighs and i work GD so those two wouldnt work well with any tighter pants than plate pants. the width you get from plate pants is a big benefit, and i dont think it looks bad at all unless they are too long. with the right length, plate pants will come down perfectly at your shoes and they wont ride up too high when you are in your plate stance.

ive never found a site that changing into plate pants is inconvenient. pop the trunk, pull down plate pants, pull up base pants, lets play 2.

As someone once told me, combo pants were made for those who didn't have the money to buy one set of pants for the bases and another for the plate. In other words, for those too cheap to spend money to look professional. Considering how they look on the bases, I think that assessment is correct.

Do you find the color of the honigs poly-wool pants the same as the other heather grey ones they carry? They claim they are darker.

They tend to be a tad darker, as are the Gerry Davis pants, which I personally like better than the Honig's ones.

They are darker like the MLB pants these days. My association requires the darker pant.

They look awful with navy shirts, too. Great with black.

When it comes to bying pants, equipment, and accessories it boils down to one's pocket book.

If you are a member of an association and get paid "market" rates, then I would suggest bying the traditional plate / base pants because Combo pants are not really "Combo"

By that I mean this:

Suppose you are scheduled for a Double Header. Chances are you will bring at least 2 pairs of pants anyway, so the "Combo" Pants will act as a secondary pair the same as if you had plate / base pants to begin with.

If you are a Volunteer or get paid a minimal FEE, then by the Combo Pants. If you are assigned a Double Header do the bases the first game. That way you will still look professional behind the dish for the second game.

My personal preference is the Gerry Davis Pleated base pants and Plate pants.

Pete Booth

The pants I was looking to use as base pants are Puritan brand heather gray polyester from Wal-Mart. Is this a big no-no? Sorry, but I'm new at this and need all the advice I can get. I also need to cut costs where I can.

Yes, this is a no-no. Most of those types of dress pants are not made for outdoors, so they're very subject to discoloration or wear and tear MUCH easier than pants designed for umpires. Umpire pants are also constructed so you can run/squat in them, so they are much more durable.

Plus, you can tell who bought their pants from wal-mart and who bought umpire pants cuz they just don't look right. It's also a "dress for success" type thing. I was always told "If you dress like a clown, they'll treat you like a clown." So, i highly suggest buying umpire base pants.

It depends on the manufacturer of the pants. I have heather grey polyester pants for the bases from Pennys that you couldn't tell apart from pants purchased from an equipment supplier.


Tim.

You could if you didn't buy the cheap ones. The poly-wool will stand out as more durable and professional, even on the bases.

More durable, maybe. Visually you can't tell the difference until they begin to wear out.


Tim.

Fecheimer Pants
 

Fecheimer pants are popular around here (not sure if I spelled it correctly). They sell for around $50.
Should last several years if you buy 2 and alternate daily throughout the season.

Maybe you got stuck with a pair of knockoffs! :eek:

Then you obviously have not worn a pair of Honig's poly-wool.

All of my plate pants are Honigs poly-wool. Are the base pants much different?


Tim.

Honig's is having their sale right now, too.

I just noticed I got the new catalog for Spring. Looks like they came out with a new shirt color.

I'd ask Tee if he's going to get it, but I know he already has it! ;)

They are obviously different in appearance from any department store polyester pants.

Of course they are. I'm just not seeing it.


Tim.

If you can't see the difference between honing poly-wool and department store polyester in body, in how they hang and keep a sharp crease and their shape, and the difference in color from department store polyester, then, well...that might explain that God-awful shirt from Canada you wear:

http://www.phpbbcity.com/forum/image...387f386486.jpg

Merry Christmas to you too. I guess I haven't watched enough Queer Eye for the Straight Guy to give a darn one way or another what you think of the uniforms I choose to wear.


Tim.

Yep, that shirt looks almost as "God-awful" as the jackets worn by the Div-1 NCAA guys from the Big East.


http://www.honigs.com/img_item_full/K17N.jpg


Tim.

1. Let's see, the jacket is a.....oh, yeah...a jacket.

2. They really are not that similar. The jacket has color trim on the shoulders, while...

3. The "shirt" has color trim on the shoulders, the neck, the sleeves, which would be okay, if you're into gaudy or think more the trim conveys more authority and credibility, or you work as a doorman in Berlin.

Fashion is in the eye of the beholder, I suppose. I guess I never thought about it giving me more credibility, but if it works, well, who am I to not take advantage.

"Go back to your dugout or I'll put another stripe on my shoulder!"


Tim.

So then, do you make you partners buy that shirt, do you work with a uniform different than your partners or do you work a lot of one man games?

I have other navy shirts along with most other colors that were'nt designed by Scott that I carry with me. Scott donated 4 extra shirts to me and I sold an additional 16 to guys I work with. I wouldn't say that I made anyone buy anything. Overall the response has been very positive on the shirts. I understand that you don't care for them, Garth. You made that abundantly clear over a year ago when they were first introduced. That doesn't necessarily make them the eye sore you seem to think they are. And no, I don't work any games solo unless a partner doesn't show and I'm left with no alternative.



Tim.

Fascinating discussion.

Sorry it doesn't meet your standards, Dave. Tell you what, if it will make you feel better, I'll just move on.

It was good knowing you.

That's because the best posts all got deleted.:confused:

:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

Yup, fascinating. Sorry I missed the best parts.

Errr,
 

Rich, I am not sure there were any "best" parts . . .

And no one even mentioned PLEATS.

Regards,

Levi Action Slacks (JC Penneys) worked very well for me when I started out. The Sears slacks are good too. Neither wore out after 5 years. Haggars suck.
Just starting out, the key is to look as good as possible. I've worn Puritan brand for everyday pants and haven't had a problem with them.
Take your gear with you to the store and try 'em on all geared up. One peeve of mine is guys who wear pants that are too narrow or too short in the leg. The pants look good at the plate, but go into a stance and the pants ride up the leg. Avoid that.
I wear Honigs combos on the plate and a reg. pair of his base slacks. Don't spend a lot of money to start. Get the basics and then upgrade a little each year.
Wal Mart buys: socks, belt, pants.

that wouldnt fly in my association

buy umpire pants if you are going to umpire

Exactly,
 

This thread went right were I thought it would.

You would not be assigned games in my group if you wore "Levi Action Slacks (JC Penneys)".

You ever wonder why baseball umpires have the hardest time of all getting respect . . . look at the new Honig's mailer . . . they now have umpire shirts in 5XL.

Regards,

It shouldnt fly in any association. I have gotten flack from people for spending $45-75 for slacks from Honig's before when they spent $15 at Wal Mart.

Perhaps these days it is more important than before to wear umpire pants.

When I first started out in the '80s, very few umpires had actual umpire pants in my association. It wasn't until around 1990 that they started gaining in popularity, with a mid-90's shift to the majority of members wearing them.

I wore Sears heather gray dress polyesters for the first 5 years I umpired, because that was what was recommended to me by the leaders of the association when I started out, and was listed on the pre-season approved uniform list. Then in 1990, a fellow umpire showed me his brand-new Honig's plate pants, and I wore Honig's, +POS, or Fechheimer's ever since.

What is "Smitty" ?

These guys.

http://www1.istockphoto.com/file_thu...3_baseball.jpg

http://www.doubleswitched.com/images/blue75.jpg

http://www.hinghamlittleleague.org/d...ages/plate.jpg



Tim.

Hey, I resemble that remark!
 

or at least I did 25 years ago when I umpired Babe Ruth.:o
I have decided to bite the bullet and get a pair of umpire pants from POS or Gerry Davis. I was told by one local association that I could use Wal-Mart pants of the proper color for the bases. This was the one and only item where they made such an allowance.
My strategy will be to outfit myself with the state " varsity" style uniform used in VHSL, Virginia High School League. That way, even though I'm working Babe Ruth, the players, coaches and spectators may be fooled into thinking that I know what I'm doing;)

I will still use an outside chest protector b/c I think it's better protection and cooler in hot weather. Also, I like the beanie hat for some reason. I ordered one of the cheap West Vests mentioned in another thread and may use it if I advance to a level that requires an inside protector. I'm going to try to ease into this as much as possible. Working lower level games and using equipment that I feel comfortable with (the raft)
year one: Babe Ruth and rec league slow pitch
year two: maybe take the VHSL test and work Frosh/ JV ball
year three: think about that then if I haven't quit out of disgust like I did before

Ray

I would suggest that if you have any intentions of moving up to work higher levels of ball than the small diamond you leave the raft protector in the park equipment shed and use that new inside protector instead. I don't see why you'd want to have to re-learn how to work the plate when you do make the switch to the big diamond. I'm not sure if I know of a single official left in either association I belong to that still wears a beanie, so you may want to reconsider that as well.


Tim.

Beanie hats look really stupid. That's the #1 reason for not wearing them. Today's macho umpire wears a 6-stitch base hat along with his mask behind the dish.

Learn how to pull your mask off properly, and you won't need a beanie.

I saw a movie the other day " Eight Men Out". The umps wore rafts and beanies. Also I looked through an old Baltimore Oriole 1969 year book. Guess what the umps were wearing. That's right, rafts and beanies. I like the traditional style alot. Are the umps today more macho than 1919 or 1969? Do I hear wool plate coats anyone? How about a Ballentine Ale?
I'm not trying to be difficult, just offering an alternative point of view.

It's not 1969. It's 2007. Feel free to express yourself any way you like when it comes to your equipment and attire. Just don't expect to move up the food chain very far while looking like you just stepped out of a time machine when you show up to work for an association.


Tim.

Tim,
I won't need to get into the park equipment shed, I already own a raft.
Why would I use a raft instead of an inside protector?
1) familiarity, I used it years ago. Learned how to move with it, swing it behind to write line-up changes , run to 3rd base etc. Using an inside protector would be where the re-learning occurs.
2) it's cooler during those hot summer days. Do I hear heat stroke anyone?
3) The #1 reason, better protection. The inside protector exposes hands, arms, upper leg, lower torso and groin. Will any association pay the bills if I miss work ?

I reserve the right to change my mind. That's partly why I bought the "cheap" West Vest. Both associations I contacted said it would be OK to use a raft. I would not be the lone ump doing it either, just in the minority. In my mind higher risk = higher reward. Money talks. Also, there is more than one way to skin a cat. Does an inside protector REALLY make you a better ump? :confused: My feeling is that I should be able to choose the level of protection with which I feel comfortable at any level below professional. MLB can dictate. They pay well and if you get hurt b/c of a foul ball I'm sure you still get paid your regular salary without repercussions from your "other employer" . YMMV

Ray pres./ IBSC
Itty Bitty Smitty Committee :D

Not only is it not 1969, it's not 1919 either. That is when Eight Men Out was set, during the Black Sox Scandal. We don't typically drive cars these days with a surrey and a fringe, or models named A or T.

what is a smitty?.........
 

In my estimation a smitty is not what he is when he starts out.....its what he becomes when he chooses to, or refuses to, improve adapt and change with the accepted norms of not only our association but umpiring in general .....

its a choice........and a label thats darn hard to shed once received.....

the word "Smitty" appears to be elitist terminology
 

Officiating is a part-time "job" for me. If I need another source of income there are other, probably better, options. Let's keep things in perspective. To me officiating is a hobby that requires a certain amount of dedication and has an element of assumed risk, but a hobby nonetheless. In return for that dedication and assumed risk shouldn't I be able to choose the level of safety with which I feel most comfortable and not be subject to elitist epithets? Shouldn't my association have MY health and welfare in mind first and foremost? Isn't that part of the reason I pay dues?

Here is a question for all UIC's ,assignors and veteran elitists:
Does using the inside protector( or a 6 stitch plate hat) make you a better umpire?

Ray-Ray,
 

"Does using the inside protector . . . make you a better umpire?"

Evidence would say "yes".

No professional umpires use a raft, no NCAA College World Series umpires use a raft, and NO high school umpires in my local group use a raft.

It appears to me, Ray, that you are a "less than well trained" umpire that wants to make himself believe that his skills, equipment and attitude are acceptable in today's baseball umppiring society.

BTW, 99% of the people that post on this board umpire as a "hobby" -- you are on equal footing there.

Regards,

Where do you umpire?

Example: I started out in LL and at that time in my life I didn't know if I would like umpiring or having any type of umpiring career.

The color of the pants at that time was Navy Blue.

I had an old Navy Blue Suit with Bell Bottom pants. Instead of throwing out the suit I used the Navy pants for umpiring. I also had a light blue shirt (it was not Elbeco) in which I sowed the LL patch on.

Therefore I looked somewhat professional and it didn't cost me anything.

In Summary: If you are in any kind of umpire association, there are requirements that one must have in order to be a member.

If you simply "free-lance" and are a volunteer that doesn't get paid or gets paid a nominal FEE then there is no problem in your approach.

Once you join an association then look the part.

Pete Booth

You come onto this board, ask our opinions, get the REAL answers which dont coincide with the answers you wanted, then call all of us "elitists." Fortunate for me, you are not in my association.

Elitist ??? Only if "elitist" is defined as one who dresses and works in the
generally accepted manners.
I suppose expecting someone to look the part of an umpire is politically incorrect these days. At least in Mr Ray's eyes.

I must say when I made the decision to umpire it was originally fast pitch softball but felt I may eventually do hardball. I made the over $500 investment in the best equipment I could as I knew it would provide the best protection and also allow me to look professional.
If we think about what we honestly think when we go into a fast food restaurant and see the people behind the counter all sloppily dressed... that is what people think of us when we walk on the field not looking our best.
Umpiring is an investment as well as a reward monitarily. We owe it to the students that we are umpiring to give it our best, they are working hard on the field themselves lets do it too. Lets respect them by respecting how we look and work.

Yes it's true.. I'm a "less than well trained" umpire. But you are wrong on the rest.

Please don't put words in my mouth.

perhaps I did not explain well . it's a pet peeve
 

Many years ago I umpired for several years in a teen league. There were two types of umpires. Those with navy blue uniforms, patches and their own gear. The other group ( myself included) wore blue jeans, t-shirts and went to the equipment shed for gear. The former group were few in number and very condescending to us "smittys" . They did not offer to help. They just barked and sneered and talked behind our backs. We "smittys" did the best we could under the circumstances. I quit in disgust. So, naturally I'm sensitive to elitist attitudes.

The uniform I'll be wearing will be exactly the same as the H.S. varsity umps in Virginia, even though I'll be working lower levels. Except for the raft. Hopefully my partners will understand my position on this until I feel comfortable enough to make the switch to the inside protector.
I tried on my new West Vest. I looked in the mirror. I saw many exposed body parts. Those same body parts disappear behind a raft. Its a confidence thing......

Do what you want. But look at it this way...if the "balloon" protector provided more protection than the inside protector, don't you think the boys at the MLB level (or any higher level) would be using them? Food for thought.

Hey, the raft DOES provide more protection. No doubt. It's downsides are mobility, looks and perception. It's a tradeoff.

Look, wear what makes you comfortable. Being comfortable is quite important in making calls. But be aware that looking the part is also very important, not only to your peers, but to the participants. If you look the part, you've got half the battle won, or never fought at all. That's the perception part.

15-20 years ago, if you rolled out with a raft no one would think twice about it. Nowadays, fair or not, it puts a big question mark over your head. It's as if you drove up to the fields behind the wheel of a '74 Gremlin.

The whole combo or plate pants is the same thing (remember the original theme of this thread?) . Combos don't look right on some people, and puts that question mark over their heads.

You might have a point. But, I would agrue that almost every single person isn't going to know the difference between plate and combo pants. However, using the balloon protector, well... you get the idea. ;)

Another newcomer with a stick in his ***. Welcome! :D

Your question is debated.....oh, about 1-2x a month...usually whenever a Smitty tries to argue that there's really a Jocko Conlan lurking under all the jeans, workboots, and flannel shirt behind the plate.

Dress better, and they won't snicker about you behind your back so often. Professions/avocations that require a dress code mean that if you don't follow that code, observers decide you aren't very good. After all, if you don't care enough to dress well, then how can you care enough to know the rules or manage a game? You think people take the time to tell themselves, "oh, now this guy...he looks like a slob, but he's the one-in-a-thousand 'slob who really knows his umpiring stuff'? :rolleyes:

Do what you want (and you will), but this perception is your choice. Don't try to make anyone feel sorry that they 'profiled' you based on your Dickies or pole-climbing boots.

What have you got against pole-climbing boots? They go well with the Honigs leather ball bags.


Tim.

I saw movie the other day too. Jimmie Dugan said the umpire looked like a p*nis with a little cap on. I believe it was a beanie.

Personal Opinion:

If you are going to work LL and under only then the raft may be right for you since you're practically a back stop because of the unskilled catchers.

HOWEVER, if you plan on working HS, JV, or even Pony (13-14 yo) i highly suggest the inside protector for reasons stated before. Mainly since it makes you look more professional and your appearance and professionalism is more closely scrutinized as you move up.

National League umpires were using an inside protector many years before American league umpires adopted in the late 70's. I have not seen anyone use an outside protector since 1989.

If you want to be taken seriously you will use an inside protector. If you want to minimize risk then I would suggest volleyball to officiate. I honestly don't think you are cut out to be a baseball umpire.

Dg
 

He could also work Table Tennis.

A version of the inside protector was worn by umpires in the 1930's.

Regards,

Well Tim, I've got to somewhat disagree and go backwards. If you're going to have the leather ball bags you need to do it right and not have pole-climbing shoes... but you need these babies...http://www.frankelcostume.com/images...wnblack_tn.gif

Looks best with combo pants though...that's the only downside. :D

IIRC.. Nowhere did I advocate wearing " jeans, workboots, dickies or pole-climbing boots". It's an invention of your sick, rude and disgusting imagination.

I honestly don't think you are in a position to judge me.

Thanks to all who replied in a thoughtful and polite manner. I will take your advice to heart.

Not to mention elitist........:D

You may be the next coming of Perry Mason, but if you show up for court wearing a long curly haired white wig the Judge (coaches) and Jury (fans) will not take you seriously.

Best analogy yet. Well done.

Ease up chief... His post didn't seem to warrant that response, so don't get your panties in a knot...

actually the thread was done as far as I was concerned. However, four more of you "guys" piled on. Maybe it's not my panties that are in a bunch. I could care less actually. You give yourselves WAAAAAY too much credit.

Since someone called JonathanSCS started this thread, you don't get to determine when the thread is done.

Ray, the bottom line is this: If you want to be respected as an umpire, you need to dress sharp as a tack, and use the commonly accepted tools of the trade. If you look sloppy, or "smittyish," you will automatcally get lumped in with their ilk.

You keep fighting the advice you were given, as if you disbelieve all the people telling you this. You had asked for opinions, then you didn't like the opinions you got, so now it's still open season on Mr. Ray until further notice.

I, and some others, gave good advice - wear an inside protector. Nothing more or less than your evaluator will give you, if you can get one to come out and watch after you tell him you use a raft. If you feel you need the extra protection the raft provides your evaluator will tell you to pick another sport.

Take a college age fast ball off your mask, or off your chest protector, or your bicep in the first inning of a double header and then complete both games and then you can come back and criticize the rest of us for being elitist (ie not rafters). A college catcher (I could say pitcher but it was the catcher that did not get a glove on the ball) broke my left pinky finger in the first inning of the first game I worked in 2005 and I worked two games that day, and I finally went to the doctor 2 days later. If I had a raft I would not have been hurt, and I would not have been working those games either.

And you asked, and received, the feedback you desired. You just don't like the answer.

Ray noted:

"I could care less . . . "

That does not make sense. The correct cliche is: "I couldn't care less."

But I guess that would be elitist if I pointed that out.

Regards,

Your punctuation is incorrect.
BTW the correct definition of elitist = prick

what does that have to do with you getting the cliche wrong?

Ahh, so . . .
 

. . . articulate Ray-Ray . . .

You have now proven yourself for what you are . . .

You are certainly thinned skinned . . . and my punctuation is perfect for my writing style . . . but you wouldn't get that . . . why? . . . because it is elitist.

We now have a new base umpire for my all time internet umpire crew.

Regards,

Thanks for the plug. We'll do our level best to set him on the path.......


Tim.

I hope Ray takes you up on your most generous offer. I can think of no one better to help him with his education.

Well, thank you. That's very kind of you to say..........


Tim.