Yes, in this case the B/R was throwing his helmet is protest of the umpire's call. He should have been ejected.

However, just a while ago, Chris Guccione threw out Julio Lugo of the LA Dodgers for throwing his helmet after being called out at first, but it was crystal clear that Lugo was mad at himself for stranding the runner at first with a ground ball to F5. He was not reacting to the call. 1st base coach Mariano Duncan tried to reason with Guccione, and things got heated up.

Now what just happened is Rick Reed tossed Dodger manager Grady Little for arguing that it wasn't two trips to the mound when they came out to check on Brad Penny's ankle. Little never made it an injury visit, he just came out to the mound. Then he came out to talk to Penny after a ball four call went against him. Reed consulted with the whole crew. They determined that it was the 2nd trip, so Penny was going to be removed. Reed discussed it with Little, who eventually said the magic words and was tossed. Then he went to the mound to break the news to Penny, who went ballistic on Reed. Ted Barrett had to escort a restrained Penny off the field. Of course, the Padres broadcasters lambasted Barrett for "chasing Penny off the field, and jawing with him." Matt Vasgersian and Tony Gwynn. Gwynn's "rat" mentality and Vasgersian's disdain for umpires clearly showing through.

Guccione's ejection, not a good one. Reed showed quite a bit of restraint with Little before ejecting him. Penny was just ridiculous...had to go! (Actually removed as pitcher, then tossed!)

Stupid Vasgersian is still mouthing off about it, 10 minutes later. He doesn't know a thing about umpiring, but is now passing himself off as an expert on the subject.

Here is an update and correction for the above post:

It was not the injury visit to Penny which was in dispute. Apparently that was a legitimate, umpire sanctioned free visit. The 2nd trip occurrd when Grady Little went out for his 1st real trip after a close pitch by Penny was called Ball 4. During his visit, he left the mound and walked into the home plate area to discuss the strike zone with Rick Reed (not a very wise move).

He then went back to the mound to talk further with members of the offense. Padre Skippy Bruce Bochy came out and had a nice friendly visit with Reed, in which he convinced Reed that Little just had 2 trips, since he left the mound to talk to Reed. Reed then consulted with the crew, who agreed with Bochy too, so they charged Little for 2 trips for leaving the mound and returning. The rest of the story is the same. Isn't baseball fun???:)

I do believe throwing a helmet in a situation like this is an automatic ejection. It doesn't matter who he was mad at.

That's no way to talk about your almost team mate Tony Gwynn, calling him a rat...........I'm sure he will be a first ballot HOF inductee, if he hasn't already been enshrined. I don't know if he is eligible yet.

I was never as good as you at baseball, Mike Piazza, Jr. How's that cannon arm?

A rat is a rat is a rat. He's just a first ballot Hall Of Fame rat, that's all. He was my favorite Padre, but a rat none the less.

No, Major Leaguers throw their helmets down on the ground when they stop 20 ft. past 1st base all the time, and they don't get tossed for it, unless they show hostility for the umpire's call. Are you saying you've never had someone throw their helmet down in ANY of your games?

In live action, that's close enough for an 'out'...I have no problem with the call either way. I can't bang on U1 for that (unusual) call, no matter how many times Mush-burger does it.

Besides, Karros SAID in an earlier game, "if it's a good defensive play, the ump is going to call the out." Who am I to argue with a former Major Leaguer? ;)


I watched the game end to end, and thought overall the umpiring was decent. PU's zone was certainly better than some other games...he had a GREAT call on the ball-hit-the-bat-knob-foul ball (didn't give it to the batter despite his whining)....I thought he did a pretty good job. If all LLWS umpiring were to that level I wouldn't fuss (much :D )


Fortunately, U2 did not factor into any important calls.

In a word... yes!

If a player throws his helmet/glove/bat/hat/sweat bands/jock, whatever, after a close play that's called against his team, he's leaving early. I don't care who he is actually mad at, I just care that it appears to me that it's in protest to the call that was just made.

I guess I'm not one who looks for a "reason" to eject players.

You see, that was the pitcher who had a bad inning while on the mound the inning before. Then to get called out on a "close" play. (which the umpire booted). You have to expect a little emotion when a team is playing late in any tournament. He was upset, walking back to dugout. Didn't say a word to the umpire or even look at him.

Maybe this is why I have ejected anyone in 4 years.

I don't look for reasons to run players either... but if he throws equipment after a close play that he doesn't like... HE'S GONE! If he holds on until he's in the dugout and off the field, he can blow-up his helmet with dynamite for all I care. It's not the throwing that gets him run, it's the protest.

BTW- "4.06(a) No manager, player, substitute, coach, trainer or batboy shall at any time, whether from the bench, the coach’s box or on the playing field, or elsewhere --
(1) Incite, or try to incite, by word or sign a demonstration by spectators;
PENALTY: The offender shall be removed from the game... "

I have no choice in the matter, the rules state he must be EJ'd.
This is my explaination to his manager.

I wouldn't consider this 'looking for a reason.' His actions slapped you in the face.

What was the matter with U2? I didn't notice anything. Why, is he a bad umpire?

Actually, I think (correct me if wrong) that U2 was the Hong Kong umpire....anecdotal forum-word was that this umpire missed a fair number of clear calls on the bases in previous games.

I cannot verify this one way or the other, since I saw no close calls at 2B.



puts away the rope for the time being ;)

I can't keep track of all these umpires. I still haven't seen the woman from Hong Kong, and I've been looking.

No, she worked the line in LF last night. I am really hoping that she gets a plate game soon. That would be interesting to watch.

I haven't said anything, anywhere (on any board) about LL umpires this post-season. However, I will say this: Last night's (8/23) plate umpire was the first one during this world series that I thought did a pretty darn good job.

I thought he looked a bit like Randy Marsh with his stance, physical build and signal. (I'm not saying he was Randy Marsh, or is in his league, or anything of that nature). I'm just saying he looked like he knew what he was doing...unlike many, many others.

Which leads me to this:

Bruce Dreckman told our class that in the off-season you have to get in your uniform and look at yourself in a mirror. Look at what you look like when you make a call, and see if you need to change something.

I personally, always watch pro guys (and other college guys) and try to see what they are doing (with mechanics and signals) to see if I might want to try to incorporate something new into my "game".

My question is this: Do some (any?) of these LL guys ever do any of this? I mean, do any of them realize how far away they are from looking and acting like a pro, college or even varsity umpire? Or more simply, from looking and acting like a competent umpire, at any level?

(Like for instance: Where do these U2's learn that when they come into the inside, into the second base cutout, on a single (with no other runners) to go into the hands-on-knees set and stare at second base while R1 is retreating to first. And then they make a big dramatic turn and stare at first base (while the ball is usually now in the pitcher's glove on the mound.) Where, I ask?)

Maybe another way of asking is: Where do they come up with some of their crazy mechanics, since they don't see in on TV or at a pro, college or high school ballpark? Where do they learn this stuff? Where? Where? Where.

If they would just imitate some upper level umpires, they'd get more respect.

FINAL NOTE: This was a purely philosophical and esoteric post...I'll probably never know the answer(s). No replies are needed, but they are welcome.

ARRRGGGHHH.....

Lawump,

You pretty much nailed it.

1. IMO a huge part of the problem is a lack of quality training. Try to get into the one week class at region - you can't because the same guys are there every year, preventing others from that opportunity. It's supposed to be about training the trainers .....

2. LL mechanics are in a word, bizzare. Why is U2 running away from a trouble ball 50' away to get into the cutout? Why are U1, U2 & U3 all inside that tiny infield at the same time?

3. Until LL changes the WS assignment policy umpire quality is not going to improve. Frankly, I'm surprised that we see as many goodd umpires as we do at the WS level.

I really think they are so "mechanical" because they don't spend enough time watching upper level umpires work. The setting at second with the play at first is trying to look like (s)he's/ in control of the sitch.

I'm like you in that any game I watch is spent watching the umpires. I see something that I think looks good and I'd like to try it out, I work on it in private until it's seen on the field.

Another one of their problems is being a tad bit nervous.

Way to take the bat out of the kid's hands there, Mr. Umpire. That pitch that should have been ball 4 wasn't a strike in any level game. The umpire just wanted to show the big kid who's boss.

I've heard phrases like "well, he retired as a 20 year DA last season, so this year he gets his WS as an umpire."

I fear LL thinks all jobs are interchangable. The person making the hotdogs could umpire, if he just chose to....

He isn't?:confused:

what game is on now?

Japan and Saudi Arabia...

The manager from NH is saying that the runner at 2nd is stealing signs. He told his players at the mound conference that Georgia is "stooping to that level." Hasn't anyone ever told him that stealing signs is part of the game? He shouldn't be disparaging the kids from Georgia for doing what players are supposed to do. There is no shame in the art of sign-stealing.

Here's a thought.... SWITCH UP THE SIGNS!

The answer is both simple and sad. These umps, for the most part, are the honchos of their local areas. They don't do HS, Legion, whatever. They have never been in a position where someone will take a look at their game and come back with any critique.

They got there through longevity and working games for free.

There is no mechanism in place to tell these shlubs that they look like horsesh&t. There's n one in W-port who'll do that, either. And W-port doesn't care, either.

Remember, we are in a vast minority when we cast asparagus at these umps. Even diehard baseball fans don't notice all the (minor and major) inadequacies of guys who couldn't buy a HS varsity game in Buttlick, ND.

You get to W-port via lobbying by your District Administrator, years of volunteering and not p*ssing anyone off.

Saddest of all, there is no one at LLHQ who is truly interested in advancing the excellence of LL umpiring. It's more about, "Joe Blow in SoCal, who has been in a D. A. the system 35 years, has an ump he wants in the WS. We have to throw him a bone."

And that's the way it is. Trust me on this.

Ace

Not only is that the way it is, but that is the way it will stay as long as the umpire fraternity in Little League remains, at its "upper echelons" a fraternity of insiders who dominate the instruction and attendance at the regional schools, and use the regional schools more for networking and establishing pecking orders for postseason assignments - state, regional, WS - than for training umpires to be able to go back to their local leagues and institute LOCAL training and development umpire programs that are based on sound teaching principles, rather than the current system of Smitty trains Smitty, Jr. which leads to homegrown, inbred, ridiculous habits that then make their debut to our horror on national television at the LLWS.

The idea of regional weeklong umpire schools is a great one. The implementation, so far, leaves a lot to be desired. The focus has become grooming the select few for moving up, rather than extending professional instruction to "the masses" of LL umpires back in their local leagues.

If it really were "for the kids," reorienting the focus of the regional umpire schools would be a good place to start to prove it.

'Cast asparagus'! You just slay me, Ace!

Sadly but well stated!
 

Sadly this is true of most all of the kids leagues now not just LL. In our state was have Dixie ball, Dizzy Dean, and a couple of select leagues and it is amazing the lack of quality that is seen in their tournaments.

My son and I went to two different "World Series is what they call it" tourneys this summer and the umpires that called the games were simply "taking money"

But as stated above, its not going to change and probably is only going to get worse as more and more the quality umpires are giving it up.

I gave up small ball about five years ago and I feel for my son who is now going to be playing with these kind of umpires for the next ??? years.

Thansk
David

I agree for the most part. I work Dixie and travel ball during the summer. I have done many State tournaments and have done a couple of the "World Series", and the quality of umpiring varies greatly depending on the organization and the location.

The travel ball tournaments exclusively use the local association for both State tournament and "World Series" games. We have some very good officials in our assocation, but we also have some who are less than proficient. When it comes tournament time, the assignor has to use whoever is available, and with multiple sessions occuring simultaneously on eight or more fields, he sometimes has to scrape the bottom of the barrel.

In Dixie, the State tournaments are also primarily covered by the local associations, and the "good-old-boy" network can come into play. I am fortunate that the State UIC lives in my area and he does a good job thinning the pool and having high-quality umpires work the local State tournaments. The "World Series" is a different matter. They supposedly bring in the best from different areas. We usually send two guys a year to one. Most times they are both very good, but occasionally, the state UIC does "reward" one of his long time umpires. The "rewarded" umpires usually get a couple of games on the bases and maybe a losers bracket game on the dish, then they are done.

I believe that Ace is right here. But it is sad.

A couple of years ago, I was concidering attending the Eastern Regional school in Bristol. I wasn't trying to break into the LL system, or make contacts, I just wanted to be critiqued and improve my game.

I didn't go because after watching the jamokes that LL says is the "cream of the crop", I thought that they couldn't help me. If the mechanics I see during the WS is what's being taught, I'm better off critiquing myself.

Ace The Evaluator
 

ACE

I wouldn't group all the LLWS umpires as "shlubs". The Umpire Wed night ILL vs OR (L.B. Vidor TX.) called a great game. Maybe he didn't look like a "pro" but thats because he isn't a pro. Are you?

I will be the first to agree that there are some here who are simply not ready for this level, but not because it's televised and offends you, but because of the obvious magnitude of the games and the desire to eliminate umpire error. Some are better trained by their region or perhaps area association, and some have more experience.

Andy uses the umpires sent by the Regional Directors. When the elimination games begin, he tries to utilize those who have proven themselves the better of the 16. He would like it if all 16 were well trained, knowledgable, and used proper mechanics, but this is usually not the case. I know first hand that there is no favoritism nor politics in his assigning.

I'm sure like you would feel better if LL used Professional Umpires, and while that would seem like a great idea, it wouldn't be long before there would be a LL umpires union. A list of contract demands would be submitted to LL International and before you could say "were in it for the kids" we would have a strike.

NO THANKS.

The truth is that every year there are a few individuals who watch these LL Umpires on national TV and are pi$$ed that it's not them. Your comments wreak of such an individual.

AND THATS THE WAY IT IS. TRUST ME ON THIS!!!

Eagle Eye,

Step back from the kool aid.

1. To LL's credit, the umpires who worked Regionals this year were, overall, excellent. Most posters here agreed to that assessment and posted such.

2. To LL's shame, they did not use umpires nearly as good at Williamsport. There is no arguing that. You can say it's because "they were simply not ready." But it was obvious that they were simply not as good.

3. Many posters making these obsevations do not work LL and have no intention of working LL and are certainly not pi$$ed about not being at Williamsport.

4. Other posters here have excellent LL credentials and some have worked Regionals. They just don't drink the LL kool aid are able to be subjective.

5. If you can honestly look at tapes of the regionals and tapes of the WS games to this point and claim that LL has placed the best umpire at WS you are no "eagle eye".

6. If you believe that ability is the primary consideration, or even in the top three of considerations for work at WS, it may be too late to save you.

7. I note with interest that on LL's WS Umpire Assignment Policy, it states that the WS director may also "invite" umpires.

Pleas tell me how this happens...
 

EAGLE EYE,

Could you explain how it is that some of these umpires can't (don't) correct some things that have been pointed out in this thread? I don't mean habits that are hard to break, I mean things that just make them look umm..... well... bad.

Example: The guy who didn't trim the straps of his mask.
The guy whose shirt is constantly untucked.
The guy who 'sells' every call he makes. Even obvious plays at first.
The guy who refuses to move up the first baseline on ground balls in the infield.
The guy who is set watching 2nd base intently while the play is on the runner advancing to third.


And one of my all time favorites.... a bounding ball batted foul along the first/third baseline being called 'foul' by PU, U3, and URF/ULF.

If Andy is using the 'best' of the 16 he's receiving from the Reigonal Directors, does he not notice what caliber umps he's getting to choose from? If he can't recognize that, in general, these guys need better training, what does that say for the LL umpire program as a whole?

Don't forget those who can't move, those who think the outside corner extends to the opposite batter's box and those who don't know rules.

Eagle Eye, what does the length of the straps on the mask have to do with the quality of an umpire? That, in my opinion, is telling everyone that you are very anal.

ah

Professional-appearing = anal :rolleyes:


Contrary to what EE bleated, it is easy to look professional...even an incompetent can do that with a credit card and some forethought. It is palpable the amount of goodwill and respect you 'buy' with the customers (fans, coaches, teams, etc) with a neat, professional appearance....if you look like a schlub, you might as well have booted your first three calls.

..that these blues on a national-TV stage do not bother (in some cases) with this elementary step says much.

One other thing:

I watched a part of the game last night (8/24) on ESPN. There was a real "whacker" at first base...and U1 gave a "whacker" out mechanic that I have never, ever seen before.

I can't even describe it well enough to give it justice. One arm was brought in toward his body, while at the same time one went flying out and over his head.

Again: where would he have gotten such a mechanic? Because, no umpire in the history MLB, PBUC or NCAA (in otherwords, guys you might want to imitate) has ever used such a mechanic...as far as I'm aware of.

Did anyone else see it? Or was I more asleep than I realized, when I "thought" I saw this mechanic?

I'm not an umpire who works professional baseball, but I am definitely a professional. I get paid to umpire, I look and act professionally, I dress sharply and professionally, and my mechanics, positioning, judgment, timing, and hustle are all professional. I am a professional umpire who works amateur baseball leagues. I am sure that most of the posters on this board look at it the same way. They take pride in a professional appearance.

Some of these umpires at Williamsport do look professional, and have done a fine job. We are just pointing out that the majority of them are not very professional looking, and are doing a less than professional job. And the mechanics being used are absolutely hysterical. We can't help but say something about it, when we see mechanics being used that we would be gigged on evaluations for using, not to mention scorned by our fellow umpires.

The truth is that nobody here wants to work the Little League World Series. They couldn't afford us for starters. Little League Baseball gets what it pays for.

I saw it too, you weren't dreaming! I have seen it before, though. I have seen a couple of Smitties do it. It looks dreadful. What you end up with is the left fist extended above your head, and it looks just like you called him out with your left arm. I was going to mention this, but I thought, nah, I've bagged on these poor guys enough for one week!

Steve,

It's better that we bag on them here and now. Maybe they will correct some of this garbage. Come championship game time, Joe Morgan will be in the booth (remember, he used to umpire a lot, just ask him) and I'm sure the bus is gonna need to refuel before the end of the game!

He's not a 'pro,' so he can use any signal he likes. :rolleyes:

I saw it. I would describe it as resembling the mirror image of a "pull the chainsaw" strike 3 mechanic, turned 90 degrees.

I was rather flabbergasted by it, myself. At first, I wasn't completely sure he was indicating that the runner had been adjudged "out."

Strange mechanics tend to happen when one is awakened from a sound sleep to make a call.....

clearing it all up
 

Read carefully and you will see that it was not I who pointed this out, but one of the "professionals".

Again, I do not have a problem with critiquing the LLWS umpires. Some aren't ready, and as someone else pointed out, may never be. Some have earned their way here. I read this board for feedback and as a tool to improve my game. I know those on here worth listening to and when someone is using this forum because nobody else cares to listen at home. When I read something like what Ace wrote and I know it to be false, I will reply.

I am seeing that some Regions are consistantly sending less then par umpires to the LLWS. Not sure why, maybe there are some politics being played I really don't know, but I can assure you that a lot of what is being said on this board is also noted here.

I know that the SW Region is not a free pass to the LLWS. If we do not look like we care in the way we dress, we will definately hear about it. Positioning, Timing, and Mechanics are a MUST or the only way you will get to the LLWS is with a ticket. I see those who come to Waco more focused on sucking a$$ then umpiring and never see them again, and don't expect to.

Rodney Picard
Lake Charles, La.

P.S. As previously mentioned, I was assigned to call this year but became seriously ill upon my arrival to Williamsport and was hospitalized. Stephen Keener visited me and personally invited me back next year. I will try not to let any of you down :D

BEAREF-

I made the post about the straps, not EAGLE EYE. The lenght of the straps on the mask says just as much about the umpire wearing said mask as Sears pants, a whisk broom shoved in one pocket and the back-up ball shoved in the other. Although it may not be true, this guy "looks" as if he has been umpiring for about 1 week.

The best part is, he worked more than 1 plate game with his antenna. Why none of the other 5 members of his crew haven't said anything is beyond me. They let him hold the stick on TV twice looking like a jamoke! :D

No, you don't "know" that what Ace wrtoe is false. You may think it is.
What Ace wrote could very well be as true in some regions as what you wrote may be true in your region.

Ace is a very long time LL umpire at upper levels. Ace has not only seen this, he has lived this.

I would bet that a lot is regional!
 

Don't have anything to do with LL in my life but to observe, but I would bet there is a lot of variance in each region as to standards.

I've called just about any ball and all levels and I have seen that is true in most areas. The area I'm in now has very high standards.

However, in my travels I have been in other regions where there are no standards.

It would seem that many of those type of regions have sent guys to the LL World Series this year because I simply have seen very poor umpiring!

But as Garth stated, they get what they pay for.

thansk
David

If some aren't ready, then why are they selected?

Again, it seems as though using an umpire slot at the WS as a lifetime participation award has not changed. However, it seems as though the regions have done a better job selecting enough good umpires that those we see on the plates (and as U1 most of the time) on TV are pretty solid.

Rodney, everything you've said EXCEPT the above is sensible and reasonable. But the first statement is downright silly, and the second is an all-too-familiar method of "defending by attacking" that is intellectually dishonest and unbecoming of one who is supposed to have attained a level of experience and maturity that would preclude the use of such a tactic.

I'm sorry about your untimely illness that prevented you from participating in this year's LLWS, and I hope you do get to make it there next year.

Saturdays Assignments
 

U.S. CHAMPIONSHIP 3:30 P.M.

HP - Ron Gabriel, Castleton, NY

1B - Lyn Bourgeois, Vidor TX

2B - Eric Zimmerman, Glendale, AZ

3B - Stephen Guerrero, Hagatna, Guam

LF - Frankie Molero, Trujillo Alto, Puerto Rico

RF - Lo Mei Yan, Kowloon, Hong Kong


INTERNATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP 7:30 P.M.

HP - Jim Knorr, Marrietta, GA

1B - Tom Cahill, St. Michael, MN

2B - Larry Brewer, Dowagiac, MI

3B - Bryan Murphy, Leesburg, VA

LF - Sam McCloud, Kemmerer, WY

RF - Arthur Johnson, Meredith, NH

FWIW --> I just heard...
 

...In 2003, Larry Brewer worked the Michigan Junior and Senior "States" here in the Upper Peninsula.
I don't know him.

She kinda (ok, did) look like a man..... ya had to look real close to see the extra material on it's shirt !!

Thank you Miss Swan!

http://www.collectmad.com/COLLECTIBLES/madtvswan.jpg

I'm sorry, from reading this thread I can't follow this post. What is "its"?

This guy working the Japan-Mexico game has one of the biggest strike zone's in the tournament.

He is doing a good job of letting us know that a ball fouled directly back to the screen is, in fact, foul though!

ctblu,

I've been watching some & had the same observation - especially low and low & outside.

It would be a lot more fun to be a pitcher in this game than a batter.

Any speculation as to why? I ask because as I've been watching, he seems pretty steady, he's set up in the slot & has a pretty consistent head height, and his timing seems fine. Just an expanded "notion" of the zone, or do you see something I don't that could explain it?

JM

Jim:

I think it's simply he's of the school that if the pitcher hits the mitt "near" the plate, it's a strike. That probably works during the regular season back home, but it's out of place with this quality of pitching and hitting.

After calling one grossly outside, he seemed, to me, to back of little and not give the Mexico catcher as much as he wants.

What a horrible strike zone. Dreadful. My wife said he sucks and looks weak mechanically. Well, she's the boss.

Garth,

Actually, it's John - but no matter.

I had a similar thought in regard to him "backing off", but then he seemed to return to his previous form.

On another topic, I had tried to send you an e-mail at the "msn.com" address published in your officiating.com "author profile" because I was interested in your opinion on a question I had. I don't know whether you never saw it or simply found my query an annoyance. If it was not the latter, please send me a current e-mail address at [email protected] and I will resend. If it was the latter I will "cease and desist".

Thanks.

JM

Low, outside 8 inches, doesn't matter. Strike. Can't believe he's working a championship game.

The Mexican catcher OWNS him. Had him calling anything he (F2) wanted to be a strike by the end of the top of the 1st. I swear, it's as if he sold his soul to the devil. This guy was perfectly fine in his first TV game earlier this week. He is conjuring the ghost of Eric Gregg tonight.

John But No Matter? Hell of a name.

There was one semi-close up of the PU on an outside pitch he called a strike that leads me to believe this guy is "tunneling" instead of tracking. It appeared he was watching the ball up to about six feet from the plate, but then kept his eyes straight ahead instead of tracking the pitch to the glove. This would have him making his decision about the pitch when last seen, prior to reaching the plate.

I noticed this catcher earlier in the tournament just a workin' every umpire. I love it when I get catchers like this. This kid actually turned around and looked at the umpire when he called ball. Ever since then he has given the catcher everything he wants. I would have took great pleasure in calling ball on every one of those pitches.

Well, I guess he's been consistent at least. Consistently wrong.

Garth,

Thanks. When I call balls & strikes from the dugout, I always follow the pitch all the way to the catcher's mitt before I make my call. ;)

Seriously, thanks for pointing out something I hadn't noticed.

John

He just called an unbelievably high strike in the bottom of the 6th.

It's going to be a heck of a matchup tomorrow. Carter VS Matsumoto. Over 100 MPH equivalent for both pitchers. I hope whoever is working the plate does a better job of tightening up the zone and making the pitchers work the real corners, not the opposite batters box corners.

I hope that the Canadian guy gets the plate. In his two plates, he has done a good job. He also manages the game better than any LLWS ump I've seen in a while. Lemos did a real good job at first in his games and I'd put him there. Smith from PA should get 2nd. Don't remember any other stand out umps.

Several guys I've been watching this series with think the Canadian umpire would be the best selection for the final plate. In addition to a good consistent and not overly generous strikezone, he passes the "neutrality" test too.

I must have been gone to get a beer when he called the high strike. I missed it. But up until then I think he must have been trying to get the Japan pitcher a no-no, he was so far outside. And the pitcher was smart enough to recognize it and just kept moving it farther and farther and getting the call. He was very consistent though, consistently bad.

I'd cast my vote for Joe Lemos, Dave. I think he's done a great job.


Tim.

The Mexican catcher started the wide zone in the top of the first. I bet he is sorry about that now.

You think the Mexican catcher worked blue into calling a wide zone? I missed the first inning but I expect this guy always calls them wide outside a strike. He was very consistently bad on that.

The Mexican catcher worked every umpire in the tournament. So did the kid from Venezuela too. Venezuela's catcher would have gotten dumped (after being warned) by me, for all the hystrionics and gestures.

DG,

I'm guessing the Toadman was referring to the situation when, with two strikes on a (LH iirc) batter, after the next pitch the Mexican catcher came out of his crouch and started to throw the ball down to F5. When he realized the umpire had not called the pitch a strike, he kind of gave him a little YGTBSM body language. Pitch didn't look close to a strike to me at the time.

JM

That umpire worked one of the first television games. He had a typically generous outside corner, but nowhere near the foot or more he was giving tonight.

OTOH, I thought the PU working the US championship game did a fine job. Excellent zone.

..wish he coulda stuck around for a doubleheader! :(

Jim Knorr of Marietta, GA. I wonder if "Atlanta Blue" knows him....and can ask about his Mississippi-River-wide zone :rolleyes:

Sunday's Championship
 

World Championship 3:30 P.m.

Hp - Troy Carmont, Surrey, British Columbia, Canada

1b - Joe Lemos, Hobart, In

2b - Lyn Bourgeois, Vidor, Tx

3b - Jim Smith, Philadelphia, Pa

Lf - Eric Zimmerman, Glendale, Az

Rf - Larry Brewer, Dowagiac, Mi

I was pretty close. I just had Smith at 2b instead of 3b. Good to see that Andy K. agreed with almost everyone that Carmont and Lemos were the best at this LLWS. Unfortunately, doesn't look like the game will be today. Raining now and it does not look like it will be stopping anytime soon.

Well, at least they're not making us sit through that Japan/Mexico game again. That was hard enough to watch the first time. I sure hope they can get the final going soon. I hate reruns.

Word is, that game will offered on DVD to the first 100 signups at the Coakalinski Combine :cool:

Llws Pp
 

Game rescheduled Monday 8 P.M.

Crap. I was hoping it would be over.

One thing that the LLWS is good for is it really makes me feel like I am the best umpiring in the world, when watching those guys.

Good for my moral and confidence.

It makes the games unbearable to watch, IMO.

Seeing U3 curl in one time with R1 trying to advance to 3rd on a single made me cringe, and literally turn off the TV.

Well, let's all try to ignore the umpires (or don't notice them as much) tomorrow night, and just sit back and enjoy the game. The two fastest pitchers in the Series. Oughta be fun!

That's funny!
 

That's good Bob. I was thinking the same thing.

But my son told me already today what we would be doing tonight ... (g)
For some reason though he's pulling for Japan.

Thansk
David

Actually, Little League has recently rescheduled the game for 5:00.

5:00? Is that Pacific Time? Which would be 8:00 EST right? The game isn't on here yet.

CHECK ESPN 2

Steve,

5:00 Eastern Time. They're supposed to show a replay at 8:00 Eastern.

JM

Yeah, great. I was busy with NFL fantasy draft today and never heard of the change. Wow, top of the sixth already. I guess if I'm really into it now, I can watch the replay.:mad:

A pretty good game. PU had a much tighter zone that caught both pitchers off guard to start with, but they adjusted. Good job by PU overall!

His strike mechanic drove me nuts though.....

Final thoughts....
 

Gentlemen,

In terms of the umpiring in the final...

In a different universe than the "International" semifinal the other night. I had the impression on a few pitches early in the game that he was "squeezing" the pitchers - especially on the "low" ones. Overall, solid job and it made for a much better game.

Good no-call on the play at the plate which may have been obstruction. I thought 1BLE would have been a better angle, but I don't think it would have made any difference.

The U1's comment to the PU when he "got help" on the Georgia manager's appeal on a possible HBP (three pitches after the Georgia HR) cracked me up. I thought the Georgia Mgr. was a little out of line even asking & was also a bit of a jerk about how reluctantly he dropped it after the PU was gracious enough to check with his partner.

Other random thoughts...

I always knew Brent Musberger was a pompous a$$ - I can only hope they don't invite him back, because that environment just magnifies it.

Orel Hershiser doesn't say a lot, and I hope they DO invite him back.

The look on the kid's face who hit the home run for Georgia - priceless.

The pudgy kid for Georgia who had all the clutch hits and played solid defense - never judge a book by it's cover.

The Georgia pitcher reminding his teammates to go shake hands with the Japanese kids in the midst of their celebration - leadership and sportsmanship.

Best post on the subject:

This was in reference to the Japan/Mexico game. It wasn't posted on this board, but I thought it the best post I read on the whole LLWS.

Funniest post:

(In response to the final being rescheduled to Monday.)

Can't say why exactly, but this cracked me up when I saw it. Bob, you owe me a new monitor.

'Til next year.

Congratulations to the young baseball players from Georgia. They looked pretty "real" to me.

JM

Me too. I kept thinking he would knock himself out one of these days.

He called a couple of "doozies" strikes which were not even close, but it was a much better zone overall than that Japan/Mexico dude.

He did a previous game on the dish...I only remember because of his mechanics and how they bothered me the first game I saw him. I know ppl on here have said that Regional Final guys don't get the LLWS, but I could have swore that he did a Regional....if not I guess it was a pool round game that I saw him work...

Oh, and he definitely had some "doozies..."

PU had some unusual strike calls, but otherwise called a great zone overall.

Possible obstruction call at the plate.

I don't understand that 2 of the umpires who would have worked the final on Sunday were not there or Monday, they had to return to work. These are volunteers on supposedly grandest stage and they return to work. I doubt they were both brain surgeons, so I just don't get it.

I don't think umpiring any baseball game is worth losing your job over.

Man that Coach JM is making me reexamine the whole "rat" paradigm. :)

Must be a BC thing :p