Swinging 3rd Strike Call
 

Do you say, "Out" on a Swinging 3rd Strike that is caught ?

Usually, there is no need to say anything. I just point for the swing and show the hammer.

If there is a question on whether he swung, I again point, verbalize "Yes he did!" and again show the hammer.

I learned long ago that the minute you get into the habit of verbalizing "strike out" or something like that, that's the time that the catcher will drop the ball.

The only time I will verbalize "Out" on a swing is if the catcher drops the ball (or the pitch bounces) and first base is already occupied. Then its a loud, "The batter is out!", especially if they take off for first base.

I don't, unless it's low and questionable and then I verbalize.

Interesting dropped third happened to me last week.
Varsity game
2 out bases empty 2-2 count.
F2 set up to outside, pitch comes in down the middle knee high tailing to inside. strike 3. Ball goes off F2s glove, (don't ask me why, he was a good catcher) hits my shin gaurd.
As the ball crosses the plate I know it's a strike, as the ball carems off the catchers mitt I'm thinking punch out, but now it's dropped and I have to get out of the way. As I'm dancing out of the way of the catcher I verbalize plenty loud for catcher and batter to hear "STRIKE" but I don't give strike mechanic. Batter plays statue for about 2 seconds, F2 is hustling to retrieve ball. BR then breaks for 1st and is promptly thrown out.
Off. coach comes to me and says I screwed up and did not indicate strike. I say I verbalized loud enough for batter and catcher to hear. He says yea but I didn't hear. I say you don't need to. and he says sure i do, I have to know so I can tell my batter to run.
What a perfect set-up he gave me. But I maintained control and to keep from letting him see me laugh I just turned and walked away.

There may be some around here who believe: The STRIKE ZONE is that area over home plate the upper limit of which is a horizontal line at the midpoint between the top of the shoulders and the top of the uniform pants, and the lower level is a line at the hollow beneath the knee cap. The Strike Zone shall be determined from the batter's stance as the batter is prepared to swing at a pitched ball. (OBR) With that in mind, any pitch that crosses that area at any time should be called a strike.

I have a hard time calling a strike (especially strike three) on a pitch that hits me in the shin guards and the catcher has to run to the backstop to get. That pitch should be called to reflect what it looks like.

I only say out on a Called Strike 3.

Swinging... its hand out to the side (strike 3) then a fist close to my chest.

Is there any way to find out who the three umpires were that voted to verbalize "out" on a swinging strike three? Seems we have a few members who need to understand why it's a poor mechanic.



Tim.

I don't know about you, but I'm watching the ball, not the catchers form.

I personnally am looking for strikes so all things being equal, if the ball is in the strike zone that's what I'm calling. Good technique by the catcher simply allows me to steal a few strikes.

I couldn't agree more.

Two times I say something on a swinging strike
 

1. Half/check swing, no matter what the count: "Yes, he did!" pointing first at the batter and then giving my swinging strike mechanic.

2. Droppped third strike with fewer than two out and first base occupied: "The batter's out! HE'S OUT! First base was occupied at the time of the pitch!" This depends, somewhat on the level of ball I'm calling- I expect varsity high school and Legion to know the rule. Then again, I or my partner wind up having to take some kid off first quite often, even in those games.

Strikes and outs!

Tim,

You can find out by clicking on the poll result numbers, i.e. the "3" for the 3 voters who voted to verbalize.

While I voted not to verbalize, there is one exception. On obvious swinging 3rd strikes, no verbal. When it is questionable to the participants whether or not the pitch hits the ground, and it is unclear, I will nonchalantly say "he's out" in a conversational tone. No big production, just enough to prevent any unnecessary problems. I do the same thing when 1st base occupied with less than two outs and an uncaught 3rd strike. Just a "batter's out" is preventative officiating.

You and PDX are either idiots (and from other things I read, I doubt this is the case), or are completely or deliberately misunderstanding the sitch posted that got you to respond.

The ball didn't go directly from pitcher, through the zone, to the shinguards. It hit the mitt first. A pitch could be a cockshot and for some reason the catcher flubs it and it hits your shin - you gonna call this a ball?

pdx,

You quote, with approbation, leftcoast:

No quarrel there, but is there a distinction between making the "expected call" on a ball/strike, versus making the "expected call" on safe/out? It seems one may be permissible, while the other is a question of integrity.

I'm not attempting to be a wise-guy, although I may be doing a good job of it! I'm just learning my way, as the name and post count indicate.

Thanks, all, for a tremendous web site.

Bob James
Virginia

Grateful prayers for the repose of all those heroes who gave this nation the last full measure of devotion.

Great catch Rook!!

Ummmm, interesting philosophy, but that's not the sitch here. It clearly says 'a 3d strike that is caught' :rolleyes: :D

I'm not going to call a cockshot a ball unless the catcher completely bails out and lets me catch it. But pitches that are on the extreme edges of the zone should be stuck by the catcher to get those calls. Their coaches will even tell them that that's why the umpire didn't call it a strike. "Catch that and it's a strike, meat!" or words to that effect are often heard from the dugout.

I couldn't agree more. How the catcher handles those borderline pitches is a critical factor in helping me define my zone.


Tim.

This thread's been up for the better part of the day and I've yet to hear anyone try to explain why we don't verbalize "out" on a routine swinging strike three.


Tim.

Well, what are you waiting for?:confused: I'm sure you're just dying to tell us!

Yes Tim, please enlighten us.

I have a person i work with all the time that says "Strike 3 batter's out!" all the time and it annoys the heck out of me.

Lay the reasons down on us so i know what to tell him to stop him from doing it! haha

If reds on black or top on bottom I prefer the catcher to stick it
but if it's inside of that it's a strike regardless of what the catcher does.

Agreed.

http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/8/8_13_6.gifhttp://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/8/8_13_100.gif

It's been ingrained into me that we don't verbalize the obvious. Think about it. He just went down swinging. He knows it, his teamates know it, the defense knows it, and if the fans are paying any kind of attention they know it too. I also feel there is an element of showing the player up when he goes down swinging.

This is like screaming "foul ball" when a ball is hit straight back over the backstop. It's kind of a pointless exercise.


Tim.

I beg to disagree .......................
 

I have had several batters this season get back into the batter's box after what I consider an obvious "Strike Three". So, I have taken to quietly verbalizing "You're Out". I don't like it, but it has moved the batters along.


Doug

Yes, at the lower levels they sometimes think they get 4 strikes! The same thing happens to me. I usually look at them and say "that's 3, man!"

Doug:

Do you do it only when they're trying to step back in after strike three? I think thats alright. What I'm talking about is loudly verbalizing "out" like you're ringing him up.



Tim.

That's right. I want to give you the strike, help me by doing a good job of catching the pitch.:D

Right. The guy i work with seems to think that there's a difference between "strike 3" (uncaught) and "strike 3 - batter's out" (caught). He does that to differentiate between the two.

I don't like it, but i don't know what to tell him to change it other than "it's not the proper mechanic."

I don't verbalize "you're out" for the same reason I don't say "take your base" on ball four. There aren't all that many things a palyer is expected to know, but the number of strikes you get is certainly one of them. But then again, I don't go all acrobatic on a swinging strike three as I see too many times.

I agree. Pulling the chain on a batter on a routine swing strike three smacks of pure Smittyism.


Tim.

Either way, it's very difficult, for an experienced pitch caller, to call a ball on the ground a strike. Especially when the catcher had to reach for it. (Catcher set up outside, ball tails inside, per original post)

BALL

Yeah, like the goof they had playing the plate umpire in Major League in the AL Championship final game. What a maroon!:eek:

What a maroon!:eek: Hey! That's my line!

Actually, it is Bugs Bunny's line!

I knew I got that from a good source!

Go back and read the post by NIump50.

What do you mean? They swing at strike three, and then get back into the box? :confused:

Id advise not changing good mechanics to suit idiot or clueless batters...

ok, a multiple thread hijack :D

Yes, sometimes little Johnny is quite clueless, which is why I will say something pithy, such as, "you only get 3 in this league" or "that's 3!!!" rather than point out the fact that he's out. Usually at that point the light bulb above his head will come on and he will finally get it.
http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/18/18_7_12v.gif
THE VERBAL SWINGING STRIKE MECHANIC

Sometimes that's the coach's (nice) way of saying, "Call the pitch, not the catch, please."

I've never had a coach ever ask why I didn't call a botched catch a strike yet, and if one ever does question it, I'll tell him it takes a catcher and a pitcher to make a strike.

I am talking about extreme borderline pitches which I was considering calling a strike, but the catcher made it look horrible and way off the plate. I just feel that the catcher should have made a better effort to help his pitcher.

Exactly, Steve. If he is out and there is any question, what possible reason could anyone have for not saying out?

Joe