Obstruction? F5 plants foot on inside corner of bag, won't move for a runner

[Norm Cash]

This actually occurred in a 7-8 year-old coach pitch game. F5 is coached to plant his left foot on the inside corner of third base (right foot is toward pitchers mound) and not to move from this position if a ball is hit into the outfield. F4 and F6 used the same tactic at second base.

Our kids still made it around the bases (we won 23-3) but we're always forced to run outside these kids planted on the bases. At first the umps told the opposing coach to move his players off the bases, but he refused, stating "he's the third baseman, it's his base and he's entitled to be there if the ball is in play". Believe it or not the umps (both of them) bought this argument.

I explained that #1) this is illegal due to the definition of obstruction (2.00) and #2) this was a very unsafe practice that will likely lead to collisions on the bases.

Please bring me back out of the "Twilight Zone" and tell me how the umpire should have handled this. I want your advice in taking this to the league commissioner and the Board of Directors if necessary. This tactic is used by two different teams (both with horrible W-L records) and both sets of game umps gave in to what I thought was a totally nonsensical argument by the coaches. Thanks guys.

[Thom Coste]

You are correct that this tactic is probably "Obstruction." It is also probably very dangerous and will lead to a collision with potentially serious consequences. This is where the kids are taught to run, and the fielder simply has no right to occupy that space. The kids need to be taught that it is illegal and must be corrected. The umpires *should* have called the obstruction and explained it to the coach.

But that's not what they did, and as long as the coaches get away with intimidating the (probably youthful and inexperienced) umpires, the situation will not be corrected. Have the league commissioner sit with you at a game involving one (or both) of these teams, and point out that player safety is in jeopardy whenever this tactic is used. This tactic also promotes illegal contact among the players. Get a crew of experienced umpires to call a game involving these teams, and you'll see it called.

It should be corrected while the kids are still learning, before someone gets hurt. The umpires need to get it straight, too. It will help their "careers" to be able to recognize these things.

[Edited by Thom Coste on May 21st, 2001 at 12:13 PM]

[Brent McLaren]

We had a first baseman who regularly used this routine. I also regularly called him on obstruction and numerous times had the same discussion with his manager.

I constantly pointed out how potentially unsafe it was not only for the runner but for him. (No one pulls this garbage when the players wear metal cleats!)

As the season came to a conclusion this now "All-Star" ended up in a cast. Why? He stuck out the foot, and the runner slid into the base feet first. So much for the season.

The solution ... metal cleats. The players will only do it once.

Brent

[Norm Cash]

What kind of league? It's LL Pony 7-8 M&F
It is a coach-pitch league. The umpires are usually 15-18 year-old kids that try to do a good job. They are paid but not paid very much. The main problem is that most don't know the obstruction rule and they can be intimidated by real loud mouth/jerk coaches. Of course the coach that taught this tactic (having F5 planted on the inside corner at all times after the ball is hit to the OF) thought I was a jerk for bringing the obstruction to the umpire's attention when we were already beating them by 15 runs or so. I explained I wasn't concerned about the score, only the safety of the kids and teaching them how to properly play the game. I've yet to see obstruction called by an umpire on a F4, F5, or F6 in 1 1/2 years in this league. I'd say it happens 5-10 times a game. The umps do occasionally try to get a F3 to stay on the edge of the 1B bag when taking throws. Poor coaching by about 20-25% of coaches ignorant of proper techniques is the main problem. These guys think they know it all but fail to make the connection between their poor W-L record and their coaching ability. The worst coaches I've dealt with consistently have poor W-L records. The league is affiliated with LL and I'll be bringing this problem to the attention of the league commissioner in hopes he'll pass it on to the umpires and the coaches. Thanks for the responses guys.

[Gre144]

F5 should only be at thrid base if a play is being made there; otherwise it is obstruction if a collision occurs.

Greg

[Norm Cash]

I contend it is obstruction even without a collision. I contend it is obstruction once he causes my runner to hit the outside part of the base instead of the inside corner. Causing my runner to alter his path slows him down and impedes his progress. Contact doesnt't have to be made. F5 has no right to be there when the ball is not in direct flight to him. Usually the ball is still in the OF on its way to a relay man. Thanks for the reply.

[Gee]

If he impedes the runner you have obstruction. If he doesn't you have nothing. A catcher will always set up with his foot on the corner BEFORE their is a play. However he will get it out of their as soon as he finds there is no play. You are right about telling the manager about the safety factor, if for no other reason than to cover yourself in case of an injury. After doing that, all you can do is make the call.

[Hayes Davis]

Originally posted by Brent McLaren
The solution ... metal cleats. The players will only do it once.

Uh, Brent, these are 7-8 year old players. The kind that can hardly keep their shoes tied with Velcro. Best possibly to bring the sitch to the attention of the league's UIC who should handle it from there.

I agree though that as the players advance into older age groups they WILL be less inclined to stand on the bases. Things have a way of reaching an equilibrium.

[Gre144]

Originally posted by Gee
If he impedes the runner you have obstruction. If he doesn't you have nothing. A catcher will always set up with his foot on the corner BEFORE their is a play. However he will get it out of their as soon as he finds there is no play. You are right about telling the manager about the safety factor, if for no other reason than to cover yourself in case of an injury. After doing that, all you can do is make the call.

I guess I should have used impede instead of the word collision as Gee did. In my opinion, the obstruction has to be fairly obvious.

Greg