Braves @ Astros Game3

[KLooking]

What happened with Jeff Nelson's call on Roy Oswalt 3-1 pitch on the top of the 2nd inning?

[Umpire47]

As Oswalt was pitching, HP Umpire Jeff Nelson pointed to the pitcher midstream. Then after the pitch. Nelson seemed to call a balk, as he was moving his arms as if to say Oswalt did not come to a stop. However, instead of blowing the play dead and advancing the runner on 1B to 2B, he called ball 4 which also advances the runner but also gives the batter 1B. Very odd, never seen this before. At first I thought he called a balk, then I thought a quick pitch for ball 4, but at the end it was just ball 4 with a delayed balk calling.

During the broadcast the announcers said they spoke with observer Jim McKean, and he said this was the correct ruling.

Here is a link to the story that it explains it a lot better than I can: http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/a...=.jsp&c_id=atl

[Jay R]

Mostly confusion on part of the announcers.

The balk rule says that if the batter-runner and all runners advanced at least one base on a balk, then the balk is nullified and the play stands. On the 3-1 pitch, a balk was called by Nelson and the pitch was Ball 4. Thus, both the BR and R1 advanced one base. The announcers went on and on about calling the balk and being emphatic. Have these guys never watched a ball game? A good point was made about hitting a HR on a balk, do you think the offensive manager wants the balk enforced and nullify a HR?

[KLooking]

Thanx guys.

Anyway, I don't understand WHY Nelson called the balk.
As Umpire47 noticed, Nelson made a clear signal as if to say Oswalt did not come to a stop, but I'm not sure he actually didn't....

[KLooking]

I don't think Nelson has never missed a call in his career.

[jpc2119]

I've seen more managers argue with Nelson than most other umpires, but in almost all the situations he's been right.

He also has the best out call, imo.

Kudos to him.

[UMP25]

Originally posted by jpc2119
I've seen more managers argue with Nelson than most other umpires, but in almost all the situations he's been right.

He also has the best out call, imo.

Kudos to him.

I spoke to Jeff about this and had a few laughs with him over the fact that he once again was in the middle of postseason ruling situations. We reminisced about his obstruction call at third in the Giants LCS a couple years ago, where he ruled the runner was obstructed at third but the runner's being tagged out at home stood.

Jeff also found it rather odd that he had all the whackers at first in the previous game, bringing Bobby Cox out of the dugout each inning there for a while.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally posted by UMP25

I spoke to Jeff about this and had a few laughs with him over the fact that he once again was in the middle of postseason ruling situations. We reminisced about his obstruction call at third in the Giants LCS a couple years ago, where he ruled the runner was obstructed at third but the runner's being tagged out at home stood.

Jeff also found it rather odd that he had all the whackers at first in the previous game, bringing Bobby Cox out of the dugout each inning there for a while.

Jeff got all the whackers right, and I could not believe Cox kept coming out! Then Cox didn't come out on the call at third, which was the only one he had a legit beef on.

That stupid FOX ex-rat announcer saying that he should have killed the ball on the balk call proved the point that many players and coaches have very limited knowledge of the rules, and how they are correctly interpreted and applied. Of course, he might have been thinking of his kid's HS games, in which he would have been correct.

[UMP25]

Originally posted by SanDiegoSteve
Of course, he might have been thinking of his kid's HS games, in which he would have been correct.

Which is why I think Federation Rules has it wrong here. Is one going to tell me he prefers killing the ball and enforcing a balk rather than letting a batter hit a 2-run homer, for example? No frickin' way!

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally posted by UMP25

Which is why I think Federation Rules has it wrong here. Is one going to tell me he prefers killing the ball and enforcing a balk rather than letting a batter hit a 2-run homer, for example? No frickin' way!

Amen, you're preachin' to the chior! I've seen it happen:
Balk!...crack! HR that doesn't count. Fed Rules have it wrong on many rules, the "delayed dead ball" being one of them!

[LDUB]

Originally posted by SanDiegoSteve
Fed Rules have it wrong on many rules, the "delayed dead ball" being one of them!

There is nothing wrong with this. If you read the rulebook and understood why certain NF rules differ from the OBR, it would make sense.

[David B]

Originally posted by UMP25

Which is why I think Federation Rules has it wrong here. Is one going to tell me he prefers killing the ball and enforcing a balk rather than letting a batter hit a 2-run homer, for example? No frickin' way!

A good umpire is going to stop action anyway most all of the time.

When he hollers "balk" the batter is going to stop and many times the pitcher.

The announcers were completely incorrect in their talk about the balk and that is why FED makes so much more sense - these guys make a living calling baseball and don't understand it.

FED makes it easy for the umpires and the fans to understand.

Thanks
David

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally posted by LDUB

There is nothing wrong with this. If you read the rulebook and understood why certain NF rules differ from the OBR, it would make sense.

I've been doing HS Ball since '87, and I've read the Fed rules backwards and forwards. We get tested every year on them. Maybe I'm just dense (not), but many of their rule differences don't make sense. Every year they change one thing or the other, change wordings, add emphasis. Just when you get the rules straight, they change them again. Most umpires I know feel the same way, they prefer the OBR over the NF rules.

[johnSandlin]

I would agree with the comment about Nelson not missing a call ever or very often. I watched a game early in the season during Inter League play. It was between the Braves and Royals.

Nelson was the 2nd Base umpire. Ball hit to the SS. It was your common 6-4-3 double play. However, there was interference by the runner coming to 2nd who slid way out of his way (replay confirms it) to break up the double play.

Nelson, immediately called the runner out at 2nd and then called the batter runner out at 1st for the interference caused by the base runner going into 2nd base.

Absolutley the correct call made by Nelson. He is one of the top young umpires MLB has right now and thus why is working the playoffs almost every year or every other year.

He will be in the World Series if not this year, very soon.

[LDUB]

Originally posted by SanDiegoSteve
Maybe I'm just dense (not), but many of their rule differences don't make sense.

I told you, it lists the reasons in the front of the book.

Originally posted by SanDiegoSteve
Every year they change one thing or the other, change wordings, add emphasis.

You would prefer the never changing OBR?

Originally posted by SanDiegoSteve
Just when you get the rules straight, they change them again. Most umpires I know feel the same way, they prefer the OBR over the NF rules.

Yeah, those 4 rule changes are really hard to remember.