Check Swing Appeal @ NCAA

[EMD]

NCAA check swing mechanic: Does the field umpire respond to the cathcer, or does the field umpire respond only to the PU? I assume the field umpire reponds only to the PU, however a couple of umpires in my area disagree and I wanted other thoughts.

Thank you

[ozzy6900]

Originally posted by EMD
NCAA check swing mechanic: Does the field umpire respond to the cathcer, or does the field umpire respond only to the PU? I assume the field umpire reponds only to the PU, however a couple of umpires in my area disagree and I wanted other thoughts.

Thank you

Under all codes, the BU should never respond to anyone but the PU. It is the PU's call on the pitch and his decision to go for help. That brings to point that in NCAA and OBR, the PU must go to his partner when appealed to. Under FED, it is suggested but not required. My advice is to always go for help when appealed to. This saves a lot of time and keeps coaches calmer.

[jicecone]

Originally posted by EMD
NCAA check swing mechanic: Does the field umpire respond to the cathcer, or does the field umpire respond only to the PU? I assume the field umpire reponds only to the PU, however a couple of umpires in my area disagree and I wanted other thoughts.

Thank you

Think about it.

As the PU, your just a tad bit late stating, "No, He didn't go."

The catcher is pointing to the first base ump and he is indicating the batter swung.

I, as the PU would definetly be hosting a conference with the BU in between innings, and the discussion would not be about where were going for refreshments after the game.

Common sense should prevail here.

[EMD]

I agree. On another note, I read a story (I believe on this site) about a pro ump (F1) that chewed on a lesser experianced ump (PU) for stating "No, he did not" on a check swing instead of asking his partner (F1) for help. The lesson, from what I understand is that F1 believed it was his judgement call and that PU nulified what was to be F1 call.

[TBBlue]

Originally posted by EMD
I agree. On another note, I read a story (I believe on this site) about a pro ump (F1) that chewed on a lesser experianced ump (PU) for stating "No, he did not" on a check swing instead of asking his partner (F1) for help. The lesson, from what I understand is that F1 believed it was his judgement call and that PU nulified what was to be F1 call.

That wasn't a pro ump. That was a big dog association ump chewing on a smaller dog ump (PU).

The big dog's argument was to just call a ball. If asked by PU, big dog was going to give 'em what he had, making little dog look bad if overturned, because little dog had stated the phrase "no he didn't".

[ozzy6900]

Originally posted by EMD
I agree. On another note, I read a story (I believe on this site) about a pro ump (F1) that chewed on a lesser experianced ump (PU) for stating "No, he did not" on a check swing instead of asking his partner (F1) for help. The lesson, from what I understand is that F1 believed it was his judgement call and that PU nulified what was to be F1 call.

I do not agree with "No, he didn't go" and I do not teach it. "Ball" is all you need to say. Then when your partner gives you what he has, you do not look bad.

Also, there was a time (and there still is in some associations) where the PU will call "Ball! No, he didn't go!" and the BU had better agree or there would be hell to pay. Thank God that most of us do not use that BS stuff anymore.

[Dave Hensley]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by ozzy6900

I do not agree with "No, he didn't go" and I do not teach it. "Ball" is all you need to say. Then when your partner gives you what he has, you do not look bad.

You may not teach it, but the professional schools, as well as the PBUC Manual, do instruct that specific mechanic:

All decisions on checked swings shall be called loudly and clearly by the plate umpire. If the pitch is a ball and the batter does not swing at the pitch, the mechanic to be used by the plate umpire is: "Ball; no, he didn't go." If the pitch is a ball but the batter commits on the check swing, the mechanic to be used is: "Yes he went," while pointing directly at the batter and then coming up with the strike motion.
-- PBUC Manual, 1.12

So, if you're working with partners who have received instruction consistent with professional instruction, you won't have a problem with how it looks, except possibly to the ignorant, and who cares what they think?

[David B]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Dave Hensley

Originally posted by ozzy6900

You may not teach it, but the professional schools, as well as the PBUC Manual, do instruct that specific mechanic:

All decisions on checked swings shall be called loudly and clearly by the plate umpire. If the pitch is a ball and the batter does not swing at the pitch, the mechanic to be used by the plate umpire is: "Ball; no, he didn't go." If the pitch is a ball but the batter commits on the check swing, the mechanic to be used is: "Yes he went," while pointing directly at the batter and then coming up with the strike motion.
-- PBUC Manual, 1.12

So, if you're working with partners who have received instruction consistent with professional instruction, you won't have a problem with how it looks, except possibly to the ignorant, and who cares what they think?

Thanks Dave that's the way I've been taught; however, I've also learned and been taught that its very easy to ask as PU instead of the many bad things that might come from "not asking."

But, as BU never respond to anyone except your PU.

Thanks
David

[umpyre007]

Originally posted by David B

But, as BU never respond to anyone except your PU.

Thanks
David

Then... if you suscribe to ALL professional instruction you would sometimes take the initiative rather than responding.

MLBUM: 8.7 "VOLUNTARY STRIKE"

In the situation where the third strike eludes the catcher on a half-swing and the batter-runner is entitled to run to first base, the appeal should be made to the base umpire instantly (without waiting for a request from the defense); but even if the appeal is not instant, the appropriate base umpire should immediately and voluntarily make a call of strike IF the base umpire is going to reverse the plate umpire's call. This will give the batter the immediate opportunity to run.