Reporter wrong on rule (I hope so anyway)!!!!

[WeekendRef]

Here was the situation :
Championship game in playoffs 8th inning (FED RULES) . Home team has runners on first and third when the batter hits a deep fly ball to center . Runner on third tags up correctly and scores ahead of the throw and apparantly ball game is over as team swarms the field .

20 minutes after the game about 5 or 6 reporters converge on the losing manager and the opening question is "Did you realize that the guy on first did not tag up properly and if you threw to first after the run had scored he would have been out at first and the run would NOT have scored ? "
the losing manager says that he was not looking at the guy on first and didn't realize it .

The oversight by the losing manager was a prominent piece in the paper the next day replete with quotes from the winning manager saying that he couldn't believe the losing team didn't see it or realize it until it was too late . As a basketball official I know that coaches don't always know the rules so good .

I read through the rulebook and case book specifically rule 9-1-1 and it appears as if both the manager from the winning team and the reporter were incorrect in saying that the losing team could have thrown to first base AFTER the run had scored and appeal the lack of a tag and thus nullify the run . Am I correct in saying that the run would have counted anyway ?
To sum up :
1) Runners on 1st and 3rd in extra innings
2) batter hits Sac fly to score runner from 3rd
3) runner on 1st goes halfway on the flyball and joins the celebration as soon as the run scores and never tagging up .

Is there ANY WAY to nullify the run other then throwing out the guy at 1st before the run scores ?

[mattmets]

You don't say how many outs there are. If the fly ball is the first out, the out at first doesn't matter because the game is over anyway. If the fly ball is the second out, that run is nullified by the appeal at first base because the appeal is the third out of the inning. Hopefully there were no outs for your sake. you can't take away runs in the middle of an inning on an appeal play IN THIS SITUATION (notice the emphasis there).

[Matthew F]

Originally posted by mattmets
You don't say how many outs there are. If the fly ball is the first out, the out at first doesn't matter because the game is over anyway. If the fly ball is the second out, that run is nullified by the appeal at first base because the appeal is the third out of the inning. Hopefully there were no outs for your sake. you can't take away runs in the middle of an inning on an appeal play IN THIS SITUATION (notice the emphasis there).

Doesn't matter. R3 scores in the original sitch regardless of 0 or 1 outs. The only way to prevent R3's run from counting would have been for the defense to make a live ball appeal at first before R3 scored.

[Largo20]

[QUOTE]OBR Rule 4.09 b).
Very last approved ruling:
One out, Jones on third, Smith on first, and Brown flies out to right field. Two outs.
Jones tags up and scores after the catch. Smith attempted to return to first
but the right fielder's throw beat him to the base. three outs. But Jones
scored before the throw to catch Smith reached first base, hence Jones' run
counts. It was not a force play.

This actually happens to be a time play even though the out looks like a typical force out.
The run does not count if the defense throw out R1 before R3 reaches Home. Therefore, the reporter where wrong.

[gordon30307]

Time play game over.

[WeekendRef]

I see 4.09 listed in the OBR but this game was played under Fed Rules . I am certain the rule is the same but just wanted to point that out....
As MATTMETS illustrates there is some confusion on this particular play and while I don't want to kill the reporter for making this a large part of his article the following day I will point out that it is his responsibility to get the facts correct and in this case he did not .

For the record there was one out....

[TBBlue]

Originally posted by gordon30307
Time play game over.

Exactly,
Reporter seems to be trying to make the news instead of report it. Maybe he thinks that is the way to get promoted off the youth leagues and up to beat writer or columnist for a major sport in his area. Editor needs to retract this writers interpretation, as it is false. Some people still believe everything they read in the paper.

[Stripes1950]

Rule 8, Sec. 2, Art. 5, para. 8 Tag-ups: If a runner leaves a base too soon on a caught fly ball and returns in an attempt to retag, this is considered a time play and not a force out. If the appeal is the third out, all runs scored by runners in advance of the appealed runner and scored ahead of the legal appeal would count.

GAME OVER!

Edited due to typos not content.

[PeteBooth]

Originally posted by WeekendRef

I see 4.09 listed in the OBR but this game was played under Fed Rules . I am certain the rule is the same but just wanted to point that out....
As MATTMETS illustrates there is some confusion on this particular play and while I don't want to kill the reporter for making this a large part of his article the following day I will point out that it is his responsibility to get the facts correct and in this case he did not .

For the record there was one out....

The aforementioned play is ruled the same under all 3 Major Rule codes. It is a Time Play - Game Over. Here's the MAIN difference between FED / OBR on Game ending procedures.

Sitch: Game tied, bases Juiced and B1 walks

In OBR all that is required is for R3 to touch Home and B1 Touch First. (Reference OBR 4.09)

In FED (Reference rule 9-1-1 Note:2) ALL runners are required to touch their respective bases.

Exception: - Fans running wild on the field making it virtually impossible for runners to complete their base-running responsibilities.

Pete Booth