Dropped 3rd Strike

[johnSandlin]

Where in the rulebook does it say that a dropped third strike has to be cleanly caught? We have an umpire in our association that is sure betting that a third strike can skip to the catcher's glove and the catcher does not have to complete the play.

Need help in getting pointed to the right section of the rulebook.

[mick]

Originally posted by johnSandlin
Where in the rulebook does it say that a dropped third strike has to be cleanly caught? We have an umpire in our association that is sure betting that a third strike can skip to the catcher's glove and the catcher does not have to complete the play.

Need help in getting pointed to the right section of the rulebook.

Definitions - 2.00 Ball

[johnSandlin]

You da man Mick. Always knew a fellow Michigan umpire help me out in a pinch.

[thumpferee]

Originally posted by johnSandlin
Where in the rulebook does it say that a dropped third strike has to be cleanly caught? We have an umpire in our association that is sure betting that a third strike can skip to the catcher's glove and the catcher does not have to complete the play.

Need help in getting pointed to the right section of the rulebook.

I only have LL rules on disc so I can only give you that as a reference.

" "Legally caught" means in the catcher's glove before the ball touches the ground. It is not legal if the ball lodges in his clothing or paraphernalia; or if it touches the umpire and is caught by the catcher on the rebound.
" If a foul tip first strikes the catcher's glove and then goes on through and is caught by both hands against his/her body or protector, before the ball touches the ground, it is a strike, and if third strike, batter is out. If smothered against his/her body or protector, it is a catch provided the ball struck the catcher's glove or hand first.

A FOUL TIP is a batted ball that goes sharp and direct from the bat to the catcher's hands and is legally caught. It is not a foul tip unless caught and any foul tip that is caught is a strike, and the ball is in play. It is not a catch if it is a rebound, unless the ball has first touched the catcher's glove or hand.

A CATCH is the act of a fielder in getting secure possession in the hand or glove of a ball in flight and firmly holding it before it touches the ground providing such fielder does not use cap, protector, pocket or any other part of the uniform in getting possession

[UmpJM]

John Sandlin,

Here are the relevant rules.

From Rule 2.0:

"A BALL is a pitch which does not enter the strike zone in flight and is not struck at by the batter. If the pitch touches the ground and bounces through the strike zone it is a "ball." If such a pitch touches the batter, he shall be awarded first base. If the batter swings at such a pitch after two strikes, the ball cannot be caught, for the purposes of Rule 6.05 (c) and 6.09 (b). If the batter hits such a pitch, the ensuing action shall be the same as if he hit the ball in flight.

"A CATCH is the act of a fielder in getting secure possession in his hand or glove of a ball in flight and firmly holding it; providing he does not use his cap, protector, pocket or any other part of his uniform in getting possession. ...

"IN FLIGHT describes a batted, thrown, or pitched ball which has not yet touched the ground or some object other than a fielder. "

From 6.05:

"A batter is out when_ ...(b) A third strike is legally caught by the catcher; "Legally caught" means in the catcher's glove before the ball touches the ground. ..."

Finally, from 6.09:

"The batter becomes a runner when_ ...(b) The third strike called by the umpire is not caught, providing (1) first base is unoccupied, or (2) first base is occupied with two out;..."

JM

[Rich]

Originally posted by johnSandlin
Where in the rulebook does it say that a dropped third strike has to be cleanly caught? We have an umpire in our association that is sure betting that a third strike can skip to the catcher's glove and the catcher does not have to complete the play.

Need help in getting pointed to the right section of the rulebook.

This is why the phrase should always be "uncaught third strike."

[DownTownTonyBrown]

Originally posted by CoachJM
John Sandlin,

Here are the relevant rules.

From Rule 2.0:

"A BALL is a pitch which does not enter the strike zone in flight and is not struck at by the batter. If the pitch touches the ground and bounces through the strike zone it is a "ball." If such a pitch touches the batter, he shall be awarded first base. If the batter swings at such a pitch after two strikes, the ball cannot be caught, for the purposes of Rule 6.05 (c) and 6.09 (b). If the batter hits such a pitch, the ensuing action shall be the same as if he hit the ball in flight.

From 6.05:

"A batter is out when_ ...(b) A third strike is legally caught by the catcher; "Legally caught" means in the catcher's glove before the ball touches the ground ..."

JM

Which brings us to the often discussed...

Batter has two strikes
Pitched ball bounces
Batter swings and nicks the ball
Ball goes directly from being nicked by the bat into catcher's mitt and is caught

Most feel this is a caught third strike and the batter is out. Live ball and runners can advance... except for the batter.

How often does that happen - bad pitch, bad at-bat (bad, because he is swinging at a pitch in the dirt; but good, because he nicked the ball {foul ball}; but bad, because it went directly to the catcher's mitt {foul tip}), and the umpire is awake enough to positively see the foul tip and in-flight catch?

[UMP25]

Perhaps if we stopped calling this a "dropped third strike" and called it what it truly is: a "third strike not caught," we'd understand this better.

The problem your friend has is the term "dropped," because to drop something implies you first have to have touched it somehow. I make this analysis when I teach guys about the Intentional Drop vs. intentionally letting the ball fall to the ground.

If you look at this rule as third strike not caught and understand what in flight is, etc., you can explain to your buddy that he's nuts.

[bluezebra]

"We have an umpire in our association that is sure betting that a third strike can skip to the catcher's glove and the catcher does not have to complete the play."

Has this 'umpire' ever read a rule book?

Bob

[mcrowder]

I had to stop an umpire from teaching that in a CLINIC about 3 years back. He argued vehemently, and then got condescending until I got him during a break to discuss it with him and go through the book.