BB situation

[Shmuelg]

What about this one?

The bases are loaded and there are 2 outs. The batter receives 4 balls and as he is going to first, the R3 is walking home but before the runner scores the pitcher notices R2 rounded third and fires the ball over and he is tagged out. My question is does the run still count since the batter was initially walked?

Shmuel

[jicecone]

Originally posted by Shmuelg
What about this one?

The bases are loaded and there are 2 outs. The batter receives 4 balls and as he is going to first, the R3 is walking home but before the runner scores the pitcher notices R2 rounded third and fires the ball over and he is tagged out. My question is does the run still count since the batter was initially walked?

Shmuel

Yes, count the run, count the out. Timing of the play is only relavant if the last out is at first or a force out. Also, the runner at third was awarded home. But, he must touch it or on proper appeal he would be out.

[Shmuelg]

Interesting. I asked this same question on the Softball forum, and the consensus seems to be that the force is removed once the out is made, and R3 is therefore no longer entitled to home.

BUT

That's softball, and this is baseball. We have, in the MLB rules (which I looked up only AFTER I posted the question, and read your answer, duh) the following:

7.04
Each runner, other than the batter, may without liability to be put out, advance one base when_ (a) There is a balk; (b) The batter's advance without liability to be put out forces the runner to vacate his base, or when the batter hits a fair ball that touches another runner or the umpire before such ball has been touched by, or has passed a fielder, if the runner is forced to advance; A runner forced to advance without liability to be put out may advance past the base to which he is entitled only at his peril. If such a runner, forced to advance, is put out for the third out before a preceding runner, also forced to advance, touches home plate, the run shall score. Play. Two out, bases full, batter walks but runner from second is overzealous and runs past third base toward home and is tagged out on a throw by the catcher. Even though two are out, the run would score on the theory that the run was forced home by the base on balls and that all the runners needed to do was proceed and touch the next base . . .


OK, now it seems to me that if this happens in a baseball game, and I am UIC, the run will score, but in a softball game, the run will not score.

Shmuel

[jicecone]

Originally posted by Shmuelg
Interesting. I asked this same question on the Softball forum, and the consensus seems to be that the force is removed once the out is made, and R3 is therefore no longer entitled to home.

BUT

That's softball, and this is baseball. We have, in the MLB rules (which I looked up only AFTER I posted the question, and read your answer, duh) the following:

7.04
Each runner, other than the batter, may without liability to be put out, advance one base when_ (a) There is a balk; (b) The batter's advance without liability to be put out forces the runner to vacate his base, or when the batter hits a fair ball that touches another runner or the umpire before such ball has been touched by, or has passed a fielder, if the runner is forced to advance; A runner forced to advance without liability to be put out may advance past the base to which he is entitled only at his peril. If such a runner, forced to advance, is put out for the third out before a preceding runner, also forced to advance, touches home plate, the run shall score. Play. Two out, bases full, batter walks but runner from second is overzealous and runs past third base toward home and is tagged out on a throw by the catcher. Even though two are out, the run would score on the theory that the run was forced home by the base on balls and that all the runners needed to do was proceed and touch the next base . . .


OK, now it seems to me that if this happens in a baseball game, and I am UIC, the run will score, but in a softball game, the run will not score.

Shmuel

What is that word you keep using? S____Ball. Is that like one of those nerf things? Sorry Shmuel, on this site if you use that word too many times, you automatically must obtain every book and article written by Carl Childress, and , here the worst part , READ THEM.

You say, what is a Childress? Good Question!!!!!!! Enjoy

[Tim C]

"I asked this same question on the Softball forum . . .

Next you'll post you asked a group of Little League umpires.

Lah Me!

[Shmuelg]

Nevermind, sorry I asked . . .

[Tim C]

You're the one that wrote it.